UFOs (UAPs): Explanations?

I take back that Kirkpatrick believes in a common cause for metallic sphere. He didn't explicitly say that but he certainly implies it. If metallic spheres are all the same thing, then wouldn't they have a common cause?

 

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No.
He doesn't imply they have a common cause.
He doesn't say or imply they're all the same thing.

Excerpted From the video you posted:

"It's worth mentioning that many reported UAPs - including those resembling the mysterious metallic orbs - can often be logically explained. Kirkpatrick cited an example where three high velocity orbs detected by a sensor in the US were ultimately identified as commercial aircraft adjusting their flight paths."



Now, you personally surmise that they are all the same thing,
Several of them have been identified as commercial aircraft.
If follows that you conclude that they are all commercial aircraft.

That would be quite a turnaround for you.

 

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Most have been identified as flying metallic spheres 1 to 4 meters in diameter. I accept that conclusion.

 

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That is not an identification nor a conclusion; that is a description of an observation.
We know this because several of them have been identified as commercial aircraft, and we do not have commercial aircraft that are, in fact, metallic spheres 1 to 4 metres in diameter even though the may appear in descriptions of observation as "metallic spheres".

This is good. Other readers may have made the same mistake. You're helping educate.


So:

You have surmised that all these flying metallic spheres all over the world have the same cause.

Since several of them have a known cause (commercial aircraft), you conclude that all of them all over the world are commercial aircraft.

That's inescapable logic, so either you agree or you'll have to retract and modify at least some portion of your surmisation.

 

What appeared to be metallic flying spheres. I don't think that they have ruled out the possibility that they weren't metallic or even that they weren't flying. (That they were camera artifacts, visual illusions or something like that.) They still seem to be at the stage of not knowing what they were.

There's so much that they aren't releasing. What kind of instrumental sensors detected them? Were they detected by multiple modalities? Were they visually confirmed by aircrew or from the ground?

But just reading between the lines, if they are taking them as seriously as they seem to be, they must have what they consider good reason to think that they are something real. I assume that they have considered most of the illusion objections and still think that they have a real puzzling phenomenon on their hands.

Moving on to the common explanation issue, I would treat that as a hypothesis rather than as a solid conclusion. They (and we) simply don't know that all the apparent metallic flying spheres have the same explanation.

But that being said, science does typically hypothesize similar explanations for similar phenomena. (It's that Ockham's razor thing.) If I observe some phenomenon (a rainbow, lets say), I'll assume that the textbook explanation for that kind of phenomenon (rainbows) holds true in my case as well. Of course the possibility remains that what I saw wasn't a rainbow... or that there are aberrant rainbows with different explanations... or even that it was a miraculous sign from God. It's probably impossible to exclude all those additional possibilities. But in practice we do, unless we have some additional reason to doubt the rainbow explanation.

So it does seem to be intellectually defensible to assume common explanations for common phenomena. But it is an assumption and not something that we actually know. That applies to scientific regularities (things many people want to believe in) as well as things people want to dismiss.

I guess that my position (at the moment, it's subject to change) is that perhaps sometimes those choices to believe or to dismiss might be premature.

 

Hence uap

 

Alex Anne Dietrich received a copy of Mick West's "Escaping the Rabbit Hole":

https://twitter.com/DietrichVFA41/status/1672569009680572416?s=20

("new") Jun 11, 2023 - Alex Dietrich & Sean Cahill give their accounts of seeing UAPs


In reference to the above (Dave Grusch claims back then)...

Mick West (Jun 11): "Let me be very clear. I want Congress to investigate Dave Grusch's (and others') claims that the US has alien craft. I think it's false, but that indicates a systemic failing, an environment in the Mil/IC that allows these fantasies to mutate and spread."

https://twitter.com/MickWest/status/1667946152430559232?s=20
_

 

Gee, things sure get quiet once you start holding enthusiasts accountable for their claims, eh?

You tell one enthusiast 'Hey! Show us where he said that' or another 'Hey! Don't be a hypocrite!' and suddenly you can hear crickets chirping and pins dropping around here.

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Apparently the Grusch thought-virus has now spread to the point that government officials are sitting around the campfire telling ghost stories to each other. One might hope they're just participating in a CIA ploy to bluff the Alternate World Order (Russia, China, Iran, NK) into believing the West has strategic god-tech. But that's not necessarily a better sign of psychological health.

- - - - - - - - - - - -

Recent UFO whistleblower isn’t the only one
https://www.newsnationnow.com/space/ufo/rubio-recent-ufo-whistleblower-isnt-the-only-one/

EXCERPTS: Sen. Marco Rubio, R-Fla. Rubio told NewsNation on Monday that he has heard from firsthand witnesses in “high positions in our government” to some of the claims made by Grusch.

“There are people that have come forward to share information with our committee over the last couple of years. … I want to be very protective of these people. A lot of these people came to us even before protections were in the law for whistleblowers to come forward ... Some of these people still work in the government. And frankly, a lot of them are very fearful, fearful of their jobs, fearful [of] their clearances, fearful of their career, and some, frankly, are fearful of harm coming to them.”

Rubio did not comment on if he thinks the claims are credible [...] “What I think we owe is just a mature, you know, understanding, listening and trying to put all these pieces together and just sort of intake the information without any prejudgment or jumping to any conclusions,” Rubio said.

UFO expert Nick Pope told NewsNation ... “There’s safety in numbers ... People are cautious about this, but once the first few speak out, I think others come forward.” ​

Rubio: Recent UFO whistleblower isn't the only one

 

That's my impression too. The fact that they would make a whole slide about the metallic spheres and list their traits seems to assume that these uaps are concluded to be real physical things that have been evidenced by videos/photographs.[see below] And then there's Kirkpatrick's clear statement about them: "These are the things we are seeing the most of. We see them all over the world. And we see them making very interesting apparent maneuvers." Unfortunately they may not release the evidence to the public since it is all largely classified. So we will just have to wait for what trickles out of the next report of the AARO due out this August.

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Not sure how you figure that follows.

What it seems to assume is that - whatever they are - they're taking the reports seriously enough to classify and study them.

 

https://www.space.com/nasa-astronaut-scott-kelly-ufos-uap-worth-investigating

"remaining largely silent, Kelly, a former U.S. Navy captain, stood up to share a UAP experience he had while flying an F-14 Tomcat. 'I remember one time I was flying in the warning areas off of the Virginia Beach military operating area there,' Kelly said. 'And my RIO [radar intercept officer] thought — the guy that sits in the back of the Tomcat — was convinced we flew by a UFO. So I didn't see it. We turned around and went to go look at it."


Consider the implications of this incident. It is one of an incredibly small set of sightings where the observers had a second chance. Had they flown by and not been able to turn back, or not been able to reacquire the object, this would very likely have gone down in the annals of UAP reports by trained military pilots, alongside so many others.

What - upon first sighting was sufficiently UAP-like to cause them to break from their mission - turned out to be conclusively mundane.


'It turns out it was Bart Simpson, a balloon."'


It forces the question to be asked: how many other similar incidents are on-file, as ostensibly legit UAP sightings, but wherein there was no such fortuitous opportunity to get a second chance?

Fact: Balloons can be misidentified by trained military pilots/radar operators, "convinced" they have seen a "UFO".

 

In the NASA meeting there’s that along with things looking odd in space too
A nearby "bolt" in the payload bay, becomes the international space station 80 miles away.

The transcript:
https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/nasa-holds-first-public-meeting-on-ufos-transcript

 

I don't see the logical connection between a pilot being mistaken that a balloon was a ufo and that event therefore being a common occurrence. I mean we already know there are probably a number of cases of such mistakes. But the really well-evidenced accounts of uaps have video/photos to back them up and yet defy conventional explanations. The Middle East video of the metallic sphere is a clear example of that. Kirkpatrick says that was a typical example of what they see all over the world. The assumption therefore is that they are seeing them as caught on video/photos and so not relying solely on a pilot's account.

 

My bold.

"And we see them making very interesting apparent maneuvers."
But, it seems within the laws of physics.
My bold
Kirkpatrick:“I should also state clearly for the record that in our research AARO has found no credible evidence thus far of extraterrestrial activity, off-world technology, or
objects that defy the known laws of physics.”

Kirkpatrick, Defence meeting April 2023

https://www.armed-services.senate.gov/download/kirkpatrick-statement?download=1

 

Woops. Now the contagious Grusch thought-virus has incorporated that [sarcasm laden] alternative into its conspiracy repertoire, treating it as double serious rather than a tactical ruse of the Western establishment.

Aliens are helping Western governments develop spacecraft, "expert" claims
https://www.jpost.com/omg/article-748529

INTRO: Are there extraterrestrial beings residing on Earth and assisting Western governments in the construction of spacecraft?

UFO expert Paul Ascough seems to think so. He asserts that a race of "gray aliens" arrived during World War II and has been actively involved in the development of flying saucers ever since.

Ascough, an ex-military officer and current member of a British UFO research team, was featured in the Daily Star stating: "There are several authors and investigators who believe that western governments have colluded with the ‘grey’ Aliens to such an extent that advanced technologies have been passed down to them and an ongoing dialogue and cooperation exists even now."

According to Ascough, this partnership has given rise to significant breakthroughs [...] and even the creation of our own flying saucers. While several writers have covered these topics over the years, and numerous photographs have been taken, including sightings of jet planes escorting UFOs and the frequent occurrence of black helicopters, no government agency has acknowledged these claims.

Furthermore, Ascough highlights the work of author Timothy Good, who has gathered substantial evidence suggesting ongoing collusion between Western governments and extraterrestrial beings on both sides of the Atlantic... (MORE - details)​

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I'm exercising my Sci Forums right to not correspond with posters I have personality conflicts with. Quit threatening me with banning and maybe I'll respond. Maybe. It all depends on you and how you treat me.

H6. Personality clashes between members occasionally occur and are unavoidable. It is the responsibility of the members involved to manage their differences in a civil manner. Often, the simplest way to do that is to avoid engaging in discussions with the person concerned.

 

High Noon…

Yes, and like High Noon the film, this is just another of many repeats of it on this thread.
Nothing new to see here folks,move along.
Do not forsake me oh my darling...