I changed the conversation. There were some errors in it.
Raithere said:
How does it feel to be poor?
- Thread starter lixluke
- Start date
Chatha said:
What a stupid thing to say. Why don't you just call them niggers or nazis. "the rich" are people. People care about different stuff.
It could be argued much more intelligently IMO, that poor people don't care about poor people, as they do not do what is necessary to relieve their poorness.
Further, "rich" really isn't exactly a monetary measure. I think a lot of "rich" people like, those who have lots of cash, are some of the most destitute whores in the world, and vice versa.
The amount of money someone is worth doesn't say anything as to the "type" of people they care about, silly person.
*sigh* what a broad, stereotypical brush you have there.
Geez you're an asshole.
Countries don't have the capacity for caring. Only people have that. Apparently, you underestimate your own stupidity or ignorance.
Further, the responsibility of the leadership of each country is to represent their population in the global contest for control of resources. It is naive to think otherwise.
Of course there are numerous ways to view *how* each country is represented in that contest. It's sad when capitalists don't understand the integrated system / resource squanderage principles, but it is to be expected in a world of specialized individuals.
It is not ones fault when somebody is decieved. Somebody innocently does something with good intentions, and judgement. They trust so much, and in the end, they are taken for everything they have. For some people this is decades and decades of a slow draining out of their life until they have nothing, and die.Raithere said:
I know some people that have gotten ripped off time and time again. Hundreds and sometimes thousands of their hard earned money taken from them legally because of scams. Some of these scams involve years and years of taking everything out of you. Then they are old, and wondering where they went wrong. Too trusting? Too bad.
It does happen. But the government does try to fight it and even help people who get taken. The PBGC(1) is a good example. Outright deception is illegal and actionable, but people also get lured into bad investment choices, usually by their own greed. This, as I was discussing with TS, is where financial education is important. You should never invest your money in something when you don't fully understand the risks.cool skill said:
(1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pension_Benefit_Guaranty_Corporation
~Raithere
Chatha said:
Well you call for something impossible. You want us to help poor countries, how do you propose this? we could create jobs in thier countries, but that would be outsourcing and would take jobs from Americans and thats bad. If you focus on teh good for Americans in outsourcing such as low prices, then you focus on teh bad of claiming that they are bad wages for the other countries. You see what you want to see and you want flaws. What is actually happening is both are benefitting: they get new jobs, we get lower prices, all but the very lowest level of workers get higher wages because the corporations make more money since they save on labor.
You cry "help the poor countries" and then under your breath "unless it takes money or jobs from me" You sound like a capitalist and egoist now! You want to help other people so long as it does not adeversely affect you becaseu you place your own self before others like any logical person. See, people are hypocrites, no matter how much people try and deny they are selfish, it always comes out one way or the otehr. The difference betwen capitalists and people like you is the capitalists have admitted they are greedy and make the most out of it while people like you pretend to care about others but in the end you really only care about yourself. There is absolutely nothing wrong with this, but at least admit it, join the club, and stop being a bitching hypocrite and start being successful. Get over your own ego that you are the most generous and benevolent person and admit tat you are no better than a greedy capitalist
There weren't any errors, you just missed the middle scenes:spuriousmonkey said:
Proto-capitalist, speaking to his wife: Look honey, I told you it would work. All those months of labor are finally paying off and those berry bushes I planted and tended are bearing fruit. Not only will we have enough to eat this fall but we can dry the fruit just like you figured out how to do last year and we'll have plenty through the winter too.
Proto-capitalist's wife: Oh that's wonderful. But wait, who's that in the garden?
Proto-liberal: Yum berries, yum, yum, yum.
Proto-capitalist: Look you. I spent all spring working on those so my family would have enough to eat. If you eat them all my family might starve.
Proto-liberal: I find berries, I eat berries.
Proto-capitalist: Look, those berries wouldn't even be here if I didn't plant them and take care of them. You can't just come here and take everything I worked for.
Proto-liberal: Capitalist pig. The berries are not yours, they belong to everyone.
Proto-capitalist: There aren't enough berries for everyone, that's why I worked to grow more berries. Here, take these berries and plant them. The seeds will grow more berry bushes and next year you'll have plenty.
Next year...
Proto-liberal: Yum berries, yum, yum, yum.
Proto-liberal's wife: Yum berries, yum, yum, yum.
Proto-capitalist's wife: Honey, that idiot is eating our berries again. And he brought someone with him.
Proto-capitalist: Hey, why are you eating our berries again? Didn't you plant the ones I gave you?
Proto-liberal: No. I gave them to her and told her I know where to get more and she agreed to be my wife.
Proto-capitalist: If you had planted the berries you would have had your own to give her, and I'd still have enough for my family. Don't you ever work or plan for the future?
Proto-liberal: Plan? Future? Work? What are you, some kind of fascist?
Proto-capitalist: Never mind. Just go away. Go!
The liberals leave, but later that night they come back and eat the rest of the berries. Subsequently, one of the capitalist's children dies that winter from starvation.
Next spring...
Proto-capitalist, speaking to a big guy: Okay. Here's the plan. I planted more berry bushes this year, so I'll have some extra. Now, I'll tend the plants during the day and you guard them at night. If anyone tries to steal them, you whack them with that stick. In return, I'll give you some berries.
Bug guy: Sounds like a good deal to me.
The plan works and the liberals aren't able to steal any berries. A few months later.
Proto-liberal: Hey, we're really hungry. Can we please have some berries?
Proto-capitalist: I tell you what. I've discovered something else. The grains of this grass can be eaten. It stores better than berries and my wife figured out how to make it into bread. I have lots of work to do on this new project so I'll make you the same deal I made with those other people. If you tend and pick the berries, you can keep some of them and I'll even give you some wheat too.
Proto-liberal: What's bread?
Proto-capitalist: Never mind. Anyway, is it a deal?
The liberal starts eating berries.
Proto-capitalist: What do you think you're doing?!
Proto-liberal: "I'm hungry."
And right on into your text. See, it all makes so much more sense with the missing scene added.
~Raithere
The rich decide the following:Jeff 152 said:
1. What should be the minimum standards of of labor conditions? Enforce them so all companies meet these standards, and treat their slave employees decent.
2. What is the minimum amount of time a slave should be kept working to afford living expenses? We the rich decide that 40hrs a week is fair.
3. How can we make sure that the slaves can afford minimum living expenses? First we decide what the minimum a worker would need to spend in order to live. Then we set minimum wages accordingly. Then we manipulate the crappytalist monetary system according to what we feel a worker should be able to afford. And if the individual is not working for our corrupt system, he gets nothing.
HOW A TRUE FIRST WORLD SYSTEM WORKS:
All humans have the right to food and shelter whether they are working or not. This as well as education, health, security, personal development facilities, the list goes on.
Why? Because of simple science. The better the environment and care an individual recieves, the better developed an individual is. This is more than anything relevant in terms of keeping all people educated to the highest degree. In order to keep them educated, we must encourage a very educationally prolific society. This as well as facilities for health and personal care skyrockets the human development process.
As such, the results are highly educated energetic mentally clear humans of influence.
The results of a society of such standards results in major productivity of high standards. Development of exceedingly advanced technologies specifically suited for enhancing human development and life experience catered mostly to the care of the environment and the dedicated relief of the impoverished without condition.
Crappytalism results in bad environments, dirty cities such as NY, and many poluted places all over the world. Uneducated deprived individuals who develop psychological disorders as a result of lack of high standard provisions. This results in rising medical needs and more time and effort. It takes more time and effort to treat the sick than to just provide them with the true First World standard of living.
Just my own tribute to cool skill's excessive (and explosive) personality. Sorry for all the collateral damage to the thread, but really, it is cool skill's thread. He likes it better when he's enraged.Baron Max said:
It's only 913 words.
without copy and pasting
I'll write a small Perl script to make it look like I'm doing it by hand. You won't be able to tell the difference.
CHEAT!baumgarten said:
It's only cheating if you get caught!thedevilsreject said:
No, I have not. And since you insist on repeating yourself, so will I:cool skill said:
I think you're being a bit optimistic about just how close we are to having a completely automated workforce.
Don't get me wrong. I think you're right as far as this goes, just a bit naive and premature.
Until technology can provide 100% who gets to decide who has to work and who doesn't? Or do we just play suckers and free men until then?
Wouldn't we get there quicker if we all worked real hard for now?
~Raithere
cool skill said:
I totally agree, I think you are a capitalist deep down you just dont know it. Exactly what kind of ENCOURAGMENT do you suggest? maybe we should give more money to those who are better educated right?? Yea that sounds really good yet also strangely familiar.
And don't give me your bullshit about materialism and say that money is not the only incentive. Unless you can find a way to package pure happiness and give it to people, money is the only thing you can give someone to make them happy.
Money is not all that matters in some situations, but for the purpose of a large scale society, money is the most efficient way to reward people. For example, when you were a kid, and for your mom's birthday you were deciding what to get her, she would always say she would rather have a nice thoughtful homemade card, and that would make her much happier than an expensive gift. It would be great if the govenrmen could offer personalized thoughtful gifts to reward people, but there are far too many people, so giving them money is the only real practical way of rewarding them for their efforts and motivate them.