UFOs (UAPs): Explanations?

[James R]

What would be convincing evidence (to you) in terms of proof of alien spacecrafts?

Lots of things could conceivably convince me of the existence of alien spacecraft.

Many photographs of the same spaceship(s), from a set of unconnected and reliable sources, might do the trick, for instance. A decent-sized spaceship hovering over an Olympic stadium, with all the world's media there to observe it, would be pretty convincing to me.

Alternatively, people could produce actual examples of crashed or landed alien spacecraft. They would have to display technical features that are persuasively non-human in origin, of course. Strange engines or other propulsion hitherto unknown to humankind would be a dead giveaway, for instance. But at a minimum I'd like to see a really convincing example of a spacecraft that would be so difficult or costly for human beings to produce that the chances of it being a human construct (i.e. fake) would be negligible.

I could also be convinced indirectly of alien visitation to Earth. For example, the aliens could broadcast clear radio or TV messages widely, conveying information hitherto unknown to human beings. Or they could leave super-advanced technological gadgets in convenient locations where the general populace (including the world's reliable media sources, again) could observe and interact with them.

This is by no means an exhaustive list. Lots of things could potentially convince me about aliens visiting Earth.

I can say, however, that none of the existing evidence that UFO nuts say proves aliens currently convinces me. That's not to say that there isn't some existing evidence that I'm unaware of that might convince me. I'm open to looking at any kind of evidence.

Certainly, fuzzy photographs of unidentified objects and breathless tales of seeing lights in the sky (or whatever) aren't enough to convince me. Those things shouldn't be enough to convince any clear-thinking person.

 

[Q-reeus]

...A decent-sized spaceship hovering over an Olympic stadium, with all the world's media there to observe it, would be pretty convincing to me....

Until an instance is again pointed out to you (having been posted in the same thread at least twice before):
https://www.ancient-code.com/october-27-1954-the-day-a-ufo-stopped-a-football-game/
https://www.grunge.com/243816/the-bizarre-1954-ufo-sighting-in-florence-italy/
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29342407
http://www.educatinghumanity.com/2013/01/Mass-UFO-Sighting-Football-Stadium-Italy-1954-Photos.html
etc. etc.
Ah, but you will respond that not ALL the world's media was present! And anyway, why not invoke mass hysteria? Always a good fallback, right James? Photos taken? Well we know fakery happens. Problem solved.
Of course good as that event actually was, it pales in comparison to the amassed high tech & human coordinated evidence, quite enough to convince the US navy top brass of genuine UAP intrusions, accumulated in those 2004 Nimitz and 2014-15 Eisenhower carrier group multiple encounters. Frequent encounters in the latter case. But James R knows better. They're not fooling him! No way! Let them land on the White House lawn and line up for medical examinations if they are serious and responsible space aliens.
That 'they' might have totally, dare I say it, alien agendas that don't give a shit about naive human ideas of what decent aliens should do, is sort of lost in the repetitive refrains of the SF skeptics brigade.

 

[James R]

Until an instance is again pointed out to you (having been posted in the same thread at least twice before):
https://www.ancient-code.com/october-27-1954-the-day-a-ufo-stopped-a-football-game/
https://www.grunge.com/243816/the-bizarre-1954-ufo-sighting-in-florence-italy/
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29342407
http://www.educatinghumanity.com/2013/01/Mass-UFO-Sighting-Football-Stadium-Italy-1954-Photos.html
etc. etc.

Not a single photo of the spaceships in any of the linked sites. Funny that.

The witnesses apparently couldn't agree on whether the spaceships were cigar or egg shaped. There are claims that something like glass fibres fell from the sky? Where are they now?

In short, there appears to be no reliable evidence we can examine here in 2020. Just a bunch of anecdotes, as usual.

Let them land on the White House lawn and line up for medical examinations if they are serious and responsible space aliens.

Good idea! Please pass on the message to them the next time you meet them.

 

[Q-reeus]

Not a single photo of the spaceships in any of the linked sites. Funny that.

You keep slipping in words like 'spaceships' rather than the more cautious designation UFOs. The grainy reproductions of newspaper articles from the time do seem to show one maybe two UFO photos from that incident:
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29342407
Caption under reproductions reads:
"La Nazione's headline reads: Glass fibres fall on Tuscan cities after globes and flying saucers pass by. Lower headline: The sighting over Florence (with a photograph, now lost, of the UFO)."
UFO - not your 'spaceship(s)'. The 'angel's hair' encounters was reported by multiple witnesses, and for sure was not owing to an incredible coincidentally timed spider-webs downfall. Angel hair drops with similar melting/crumbling/evaporating characteristics also reported at one or more of those US ICBM missile silo UFO encounters covered awhile back. So not unique to the 1954 encounter in Florence.

The witnesses apparently couldn't agree on whether the spaceships were cigar or egg shaped

Different vantage points and different times could easily account for such apparent discrepancies. All agreed what they saw was very non-mundane - rapidly moving then hovering bodies unlike any conventional aircraft. Astonishing as one or two former soccer players recounted.

There are claims that something like glass fibres fell from the sky? Where are they now?

See detailed report in BBC article. And above.

In short, there appears to be no reliable evidence we can examine here in 2020. Just a bunch of anecdotes, as usual.

Concordant recollections, with expected minor variations, of players and reporters and spectators all written off as 'just a bunch of anecdotes'. How easy it is to be an SF UFO skeptic.

Good idea! Please pass on the message to them the next time you meet them.

Being 'smart' like that reflects poorly on you.

 

[DaveC426913]

The grainy reproductions of newspaper articles from the time do seem to show one maybe two UFO photos from that incident:
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29342407

No they don't. Please clarify.

 

[James R]

You keep slipping in words like 'spaceships' rather than the more cautious designation UFOs.

What happened is that you tried to change the topic. wegs asked me what would convince me of the existence of alien spacecraft. I replied to her. You then took my reply as a jumping-off point for your latest attempt at providing some convincing evidence for aliens/paranormal beings/whatever you believe they are today. At some stage, you decided that trying to prove "spacecraft" was too big a stretch, so you've backed off to the usual vague "UFOs".

 

[Q-reeus]

No they don't. Please clarify.

Read the caption again, all of it, and go see an optometrist.

 

[Q-reeus]

What happened is that you tried to change the topic. wegs asked me what would convince me of the existence of alien spacecraft. I replied to her. You then took my reply as a jumping-off point for your latest attempt at providing some convincing evidence for aliens/paranormal beings/whatever you believe they are today. At some stage, you decided that trying to prove "spacecraft" was too big a stretch, so you've backed off to the usual vague "UFOs".

The usual lying distorting garbage reply from you. Compare with what I wrote in #4542 then #4544. And you actually expect to get away with such BS.

 

[wegs]

Lots of things could conceivably convince me of the existence of alien spacecraft.

Many photographs of the same spaceship(s), from a set of unconnected and reliable sources, might do the trick, for instance. A decent-sized spaceship hovering over an Olympic stadium, with all the world's media there to observe it, would be pretty convincing to me.

Alternatively, people could produce actual examples of crashed or landed alien spacecraft. They would have to display technical features that are persuasively non-human in origin, of course. Strange engines or other propulsion hitherto unknown to humankind would be a dead giveaway, for instance. But at a minimum I'd like to see a really convincing example of a spacecraft that would be so difficult or costly for human beings to produce that the chances of it being a human construct (i.e. fake) would be negligible.

I could also be convinced indirectly of alien visitation to Earth. For example, the aliens could broadcast clear radio or TV messages widely, conveying information hitherto unknown to human beings. Or they could leave super-advanced technological gadgets in convenient locations where the general populace (including the world's reliable media sources, again) could observe and interact with them.

This is by no means an exhaustive list. Lots of things could potentially convince me about aliens visiting Earth.

I can say, however, that none of the existing evidence that UFO nuts say proves aliens currently convinces me. That's not to say that there isn't some existing evidence that I'm unaware of that might convince me. I'm open to looking at any kind of evidence.

Certainly, fuzzy photographs of unidentified objects and breathless tales of seeing lights in the sky (or whatever) aren't enough to convince me. Those things shouldn't be enough to convince any clear-thinking person.

Agree - good points. Eye witnesses aren't ever asked the question it seems - why do you believe this? Many of these ''sightings'' are little more than a planned hoax. ''Unknown lights in the sky'' doesn't equate to alien spacecraft, but why do some people make that leap, while others don't?[/QUOTE]

 

[James R]

The usual lying distorting garbage reply from you.

You're entitled to your opinion, of course.

Everything is on the record. I invite readers to judge for themselves.

Meanwhile, I have better things to do than to give my time to somebody with a huge chip on his shoulder. Goodbye.

 

[paddoboy]

but why do some people make that leap, while others don't?

I'm sure you will find that most UFO of Alien origin believers, will also be believers of other conspiracy nonsense, like 9/11 for example.
Most have a deep fear that the government/science is hiding the truth from them, and that they [themselves] are the only bright sparks, able to see through this "conspiracy".
They need mystery in their lives, [as if the universe is not mysterious enough] and suffer from a degree of suggestability and gullibility, that is over and beyond the norm.

 

[river]

I'm sure you will find that most UFO of Alien origin believers, will also be believers of other conspiracy nonsense, like 9/11 for example.
Most have a deep fear that the government/science is hiding the truth from them, and that they [themselves] are the only bright sparks, able to see through this "conspiracy".
They need mystery in their lives, [as if the universe is not mysterious enough] and suffer from a degree of suggestability and gullibility, that is over and beyond the norm.

Pathetic pad .

 

[paddoboy]

Pathetic pad .

I know three on this forum that fit the bill quite well river, yourself, q-reeus and MR...you all accept Aliens of one form or another, you all believe in ghosts, goblins, the supernatural, conspiracies, etc, and one actually believes we have had an atomic war on Mars between Alien species.
yeah pathetic certainly!
You have a good New Year, I'm now off to start celebrating mine in style!

 

[Q-reeus]

I know three on this forum that fit the bill quite well river, yourself, q-reeus and MR...you all accept Aliens of one form or another, you all believe in ghosts, goblins, the supernatural, conspiracies, etc,...

No careless liar, I DON'T accept *visiting* (space)aliens per se, or ghosts or goblins. Supernatural yes, and conspiracies yes (only naive fools genuinely deny their existence). Try and get it right for once. And it's not as though the situation hasn't been clarified many times. You are just careless, irresponsible by nature, and thus habitually indifferent to facts.

 

[paddoboy]

No careless liar, I DON'T accept *visiting* (space)aliens per se, or ghosts or goblins. Supernatural yes, and conspiracies yes

Hey q-reeus old fella, I'm not particularly interested in the exact type/kind of nonsense you chose to swallow. I'm simply showing your gullibility.

 

[Q-reeus]

Hey q-reeus old fella, I'm not particularly interested in the exact type/kind of nonsense you chose to swallow. I'm simply showing your gullibility.

By falsely attributing beliefs? No fool, that's not how it works. It's as I wrote last post. You are an irresponsible disgrace, but here at SF that seems to be a well tolerated virtue.

 

[DaveC426913]

No careless liar, I DON'T accept *visiting* (space)aliens per se, or ghosts or goblins. Supernatural yes, and conspiracies yes (only naive fools genuinely deny their existence). Try and get it right for once. And it's not as though the situation hasn't been clarified many times. You are just careless, irresponsible by nature, and thus habitually indifferent to facts.

Q-reeus: look at the title of the thread.
You're stepping into a thread about space aliens to flog your own pet ideas of their origin.
Which is fine, as far as it goes - but you have no business being hostile - let alone calling people liars or fools - just because everybody else doesn't want to follow you down your personal rabbit hole.
You are in the wrong here.
Start your own thread.
And behave yourself.

 

[river]

↑

I'm sure you will find that most UFO of Alien origin believers, will also be believers of other conspiracy nonsense, like 9/11 for example.
Most have a deep fear that the government/science is hiding the truth from them, and that they [themselves] are the only bright sparks, able to see through this "conspiracy".
They need mystery in their lives, [as if the universe is not mysterious enough] and suffer from a degree of suggestability and gullibility, that is over and beyond the norm.

Pathetic pad .

I know three on this forum that fit the bill quite well river, yourself, q-reeus and MR...you all accept Aliens of one form or another, you all believe in ghosts, goblins, the supernatural, conspiracies, etc, and one actually believes we have had an atomic war on Mars between Alien species.
yeah pathetic certainly!
You have a good New Year, I'm now off to start celebrating mine in style!

One Day the Truth will come out about More Intelligent Beings than Ourselves. In Our Space , Our Solar System , and Beyond . The Evidence is Clear that Advanced Beings Exist .

 

[paddoboy]

By falsely attributing beliefs? No fool, that's not how it works. It's as I wrote last post. You are an irresponsible disgrace, but here at SF that seems to be a well tolerated virtue.

Ahh gee, did I hurt you by lumping you in with river and other gullible nuts? An old saying q-reeus, if the cap fits, wear it! And it fits you to a "T"

 

[paddoboy]

↑
Pathetic pad .One Day the Truth will come out about More Intelligent Beings than Ourselves. In Our Space , Our Solar System , and Beyond . The Evidence is Clear that Advanced Beings Exist .