Raising Children Without the Concept of Sin

[Jan Ardena]

I have friends who are gay. I haven't killed them. Am I condemned to hell for breaking the divine law of Leviticus?

Why would you?
You weren't instructed to do so, and your friends aren't Israelites from that specific time.

Those laws were specific to time, place, and, circumstance.
Nowadays folk choose to view it as a universal law, for all people, and to be enacted by anyone, and refuse to look at it from a spiritual perspective.
If that wasn't the case, all the commandments given to Moses would be brought up, and there are many.

jan,

 

[Jan Ardena]

Who told you that, God?

It's common sense.

jan

 

[Write4U]

It's common sense.
jan

God is "common sense"? How is God "common sense"? Judging by all the Holy Wars, knowledge of God is not such a "common sense" after all, don't you agree?

jan said,
If that wasn't the case, all the commandments given to Moses would be brought up, and there are many.

How many Commandements were there other than the Ten, which according to Carlin was a marketing decision to begin with. "Ten" sounds "official"!

"Many" commandments is a little vague, don't you agree? Was Moses selective as to which to use as the "official" Ten Commandments from those many other commandments?

Who carved those commandments in the stone slabs, which Moses struggled to bring all the way down from the mountain. Did he lose a few commandments along the way?

Again, who told you all this stuff?

 

[Jan Ardena]

James R

What is this "divine law" you keep mentioning?

Divine law is any law that is understood as deriving from a transcendent source, such as the will of God or gods, in contrast to man-made law. Divine laws are typically regarded as superior to man-made laws,] sometimes due to an understanding that their source has resources beyond human knowledge and human reason. They are accorded greater authority, and cannot be changed by human authorities.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divine_law

You keep saying that this or that is an example of divine law, but where is this law to be found? Is it just whatever you say it is?

They reflect the mind of God, the divine source.

Also, about this "forcing" you mention. What is forcing anybody to operate under divine law? What does that even mean?

It means what it says.

As for judgment, which you seem particularly concerned about, when will that happen, according to you? And how does it work? Who is the judge, and where is the courtroom?

I don't see the point of going down this road.
Either you can acknowledge it, or you refuse to. That is for you to come to terms with.

Why? Tell me why you consciously try to rebel against divine law, Jan. Especially seeing as you're so worried about the Judgement and all.

Most people want what they want. A lot of those desires are a hindrances to our spiritual advancement.
Divine laws are for the spiritual benefit of the soul.

I thought "original sin" referred to Adam and Eve's failure to obey God's instruction not to get knowledged-up.

All transgressions of God are the original sin.
That is the only ingredient. From there chaos ultimately ensues.

Actually, Christianity is unusually preoccupied with the idea of "sin", in a way that many other religions are not. It's fair to say that "sin" is the main "problem" facing humanity, from a Christian point of view. Christianity's "solution" to the problem is Jesus's self-sacrifice, which is supposed to absolve humanity of sin.

It's not a problem that is facing humanity. It is a spiritual problem that faces humans. Humanity merely reflects that.

Other religions have different central "problems" that they identify, and different "solutions".

Like what?

jan

 

[Jan Ardena]

Write4U


God is "common sense"? How is God "common sense"?

Everybody knows God.
We either accept God, or we don't.
The fact that there are theists and atheists, support this claim.

How many Commandements were there other than the Ten, which according to Carlin was a marketing decision to begin with. "Ten" sounds "official"!

Did God not command Moses to tell the Israelites what is and is not lawful to them?

Who carved those commandments in the stone slabs, which Moses struggled to bring all the way down from the mountain. Did he lose a few commandments along the way?

I wasn't only referring to the ten commandments.

jan.

 

[Write4U]

You weren't instructed to do so, and your friends aren't Israelites from that specific time.

Who does the "instructing"??

jan said,
They reflect the mind of God, the divine source.

And who does the reflecting?

p.s. the first three commandments are pure BS. Spooky language....spooky language.....

 

[Jan Ardena]

Who does the "instructing"??

What instructing?

jan,

 

[Write4U]

What instructing?

jan,

Your words. Post # 161

Again, who does the instructing?

 

[Michael 345]

Who carved those commandments in the stone slabs, which Moses struggled to bring all the way down from the mountain

They were never official

True story

They were the earliest version of workplace agreements

Carved by apprentice headstone makers

 

[Write4U]

Write4U
God is "common sense"? How is God "common sense"?

Everybody knows God.

That is just not true at all. There are many versions of God.

We either accept God, or we don't.

Which version?

The fact that there are theists and atheists, support this claim.

No , it does not.
Do you believe in Zeus?

Did God not command Moses to tell the Israelites what is and is not lawful to them?

No, we don't know that, nor do you. All we know is that Moses told the Israelites what he believed was lawful to them.

I wasn't only referring to the ten commandments.
jan.

Ohhhh??? Another book of commandments? Wow! The Quran? It has a bunch of commandments.
Some are even illegal. Ain't that a crock.....

 

[Write4U]

They were never official

True story

They were the earliest version of workplace agreements

Carved by apprentice headstone makers

But Moses was alone on that mountain and there was nobody else around. Something is messed up here!......

And if they were not the official commandments, did Moses think he was the boss over the workplace and the workplace agreement was with Moses only?

Maybe a few people said, "Moses ain't the boss of me"!....."I've got my own commandments and they are much stricter than Moses' . "Confession won't get you off the hook in my workplace. I'll fire your ass.....you hear!??".........

 

[spidergoat]

I know you have to pee and poo, and I'm not in your head.

jan

Those things are not in my head. They might be in yours.

 

[spidergoat]

It makes no difference what you say.
You are forced to operate under divine law. And you will be judged by it.
Those who try to sidestep it, and make up their own rules, will be judged by divine law.
Get over it!

Jan.

I say slavery is immoral. God doesn't. I can judge too.

 

[Michael 345]

But Moses was alone on that mountain and there was nobody else around.

He found them up there

The apprentices took them up when the had a drunken party with a few girls

Boosting of their handwork

Left them behind by mistake

 

[Jan Ardena]

That is just not true at all. There are many versions of God.

What does that have to do with anything?

No, we don't know that, nor do you. All we know is that Moses told the Israelites what he believed was lawful to them.

That’s not documented.
Based on the documentation, I am correct.

Jan.

 

[Write4U]

Which children are these?

Catholic children, according to my wife who was raised catholic and went to catholic school.
And received many "demerits" for asking questions, which remained unanswered.

My wife was threatened with "hell" several times. Way to go, scaring innocent minds with death and damnation, when they have barely begun to live.

 

[Write4U]

What does that have to do with anything?

That means somebody is believing in a "false" god. That's what all the religious wars were about, no?

That’s not documented.

Yes it is. History is full of religious wars.

Based on the documentation, I am correct.
Jan.

What documentation? The Bible? The Quran? Book of Mormon? The Chronicles of Mickey Mouse?

Again, who is telling you all this knowledge? Still waiting for an authoritative answer.

 

[Write4U]

I don't see the point of going down this road.
Either you can acknowledge it, or you refuse to. That is for you to come to terms with

Then we'll just have to "force" you down this road. When discussing religion you don't get to pick the rules.
You do not have the authority.

Again who is telling you all this? You?

 

[Write4U]

He found them up there

The apprentices took them up when the had a drunken party with a few girls

Boasting of their handwork

Left them behind by mistake

Moses robbed a stone-masonry business? Or was it just "litter"............

"Cleanliness is next to godliness", and especially for campers, "Remember the "Leave No Trace" principles and be nice to the next camper -- leave your campsite better than you found it.

Moses was an environmentalist? Kudos to Moses....

p.s. OTOH, perhaps those stone slabs were actual headstones of some very wise old timers.
Moses read the commandments on the headstones and decided to just rob the graves rather than to waste time on cutting a stone copy. He had forgotten his stone cutting tools anyway.

 

[Jan Ardena]

I say slavery is immoral. God doesn't. I can judge too.

Why do you think slavery is ''immoral''?

jan.