I agree with Slacker47 that China was a great civilization. There is even evidence that China "discovered" the world before Columbus. Something about Chinese explorers sailing for 2 years and producing maps which, though not entirely accurately, roughly stake out each continent and body of water. And China invented so much, was culturally primed and could have easily been the Old World USA.
The Greatest Civilization Ever
- Thread starter Slacker47
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'Lo Fraggle
I am not too sure about the downfall of the Incans. As far as I remember from grade 5 studies, they "mysteriously" disappeared/were defeated and every last one of them wiped out? I remember there were invaders, resulting in a war, but somehow the Incans lost, even though they were native to the atmosphere and land. They lost on their hometurf, while the explorers were suffering from heat, humidity, and tropical maladies. Could you tell me anything about it? Thanks.
I am not too sure about the downfall of the Incans. As far as I remember from grade 5 studies, they "mysteriously" disappeared/were defeated and every last one of them wiped out? I remember there were invaders, resulting in a war, but somehow the Incans lost, even though they were native to the atmosphere and land. They lost on their hometurf, while the explorers were suffering from heat, humidity, and tropical maladies. Could you tell me anything about it? Thanks.
Que? Who made those, and when?
In 1929 some old maps were found painted on gazelle skin, rolled up on a shelf in the palace at
Constantinople. They belonged to the sea captain Piri Reis who sailed the area and made this map
around 1513. Two maps of his were already in the Berlin Library and showed remarkably accurate
surveys of the Red Sea and the Mediterranean islands. Piri Reis was well known in his day, an Admiral
in the Navy of the Ottoman Turks who took part in many successful battles. He was considered an
expert in Mediterranean lands. He had privileged access to the Imperial Library where he probably found
the many maps he states were used as reference for this one. Reis was put to death by the Sultan
Suleiman II for a little tiff they had in 1555.
His map shows the exact coastline of North and South America - including the Andes which were
unknown at this time - and Antarctica including their exact topography - mountain ranges, valleys and
individual peaks that weren't discovered until 1952, giving their exact altitudes. Antarctica is shown in
detail in spite of it not being discovered until 1818, 300 years after the map was drawn. The last time the
coastland of Queen Maud land was ice-free was 6000 years ago. Greenland was strangely shown as
being three islands. Investigations carried out in recent years show Greenland does indeed rest on three
islands.
The Falkland islands are shown at the correct latitude, although they weren't discovered until 1592.
Due to the ice-free state of Antarctica shown on the map, it was estimated the original map(s) used to compile Reis' must have been drawn at least 10,000 years ago. This was also confirmed by an evaluation by the 8th Reconnaissance Technical Squadron of the USAF, Westover AFB, Mass. The
subglacial topography of Queen Maudland in Antactica, which the Piri Reis map shows accurately, was
not mapped until 1949 by a joint British-Swedish science endevour..
Reis gives us some answers to these puzzles in notes written in his hand along the margins. He states that this map is a compilation from a large number of existing maps, some of which were copies of maps before them. One theory which has gained scientific credibility in the last decade is that the
poles were once near the euqators, before a "earth-crust" displacement took place. Even if this is true,
it happened about 4000 BC.
Constantinople. They belonged to the sea captain Piri Reis who sailed the area and made this map
around 1513. Two maps of his were already in the Berlin Library and showed remarkably accurate
surveys of the Red Sea and the Mediterranean islands. Piri Reis was well known in his day, an Admiral
in the Navy of the Ottoman Turks who took part in many successful battles. He was considered an
expert in Mediterranean lands. He had privileged access to the Imperial Library where he probably found
the many maps he states were used as reference for this one. Reis was put to death by the Sultan
Suleiman II for a little tiff they had in 1555.
His map shows the exact coastline of North and South America - including the Andes which were
unknown at this time - and Antarctica including their exact topography - mountain ranges, valleys and
individual peaks that weren't discovered until 1952, giving their exact altitudes. Antarctica is shown in
detail in spite of it not being discovered until 1818, 300 years after the map was drawn. The last time the
coastland of Queen Maud land was ice-free was 6000 years ago. Greenland was strangely shown as
being three islands. Investigations carried out in recent years show Greenland does indeed rest on three
islands.
The Falkland islands are shown at the correct latitude, although they weren't discovered until 1592.
Due to the ice-free state of Antarctica shown on the map, it was estimated the original map(s) used to compile Reis' must have been drawn at least 10,000 years ago. This was also confirmed by an evaluation by the 8th Reconnaissance Technical Squadron of the USAF, Westover AFB, Mass. The
subglacial topography of Queen Maudland in Antactica, which the Piri Reis map shows accurately, was
not mapped until 1949 by a joint British-Swedish science endevour..
Reis gives us some answers to these puzzles in notes written in his hand along the margins. He states that this map is a compilation from a large number of existing maps, some of which were copies of maps before them. One theory which has gained scientific credibility in the last decade is that the
poles were once near the euqators, before a "earth-crust" displacement took place. Even if this is true,
it happened about 4000 BC.
sciforums, the definitive resource for atlantis!
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?threadid=12864
ps: it sucks that google can find the thread and our search engine cannot! shame!
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?threadid=12864
ps: it sucks that google can find the thread and our search engine cannot! shame!
Thanks Av However, I must inform you that the Chinese maps predate before Piri Reis' maps. 1389, baby. And Piri Reis dated his maps around the same time Columbus was around (I looked at the translated Turkish, and it mentioned Colombo), which was 1492.
This new map is causing a lot hype:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/2446907.stm
http://www.100megsfree4.com/farshores/am02cm.htm
http://www.dialognow.org/story/2002/11/13/183426/30
www.thingsasian.com/browse/stories/topic/ Travel/goto_article/article.1934.html
http://saindia.wack.co.za/article/articleview/4602/1/7/
http://mailbox.univie.ac.at/~muehleb9/questions.html
http://www.ilearnasia.com/ilearn021134.htm
About Chinese sea supremacy: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/sultan/explorers.html
Unrelated, but talks about ancient Chinese weapons and martial arts. http://www.booktrail.com/Safety_Survival/Ancient Chinese Weapons.asp
However, I must inform you that the Chinese maps predate before Piri Reis' maps. 1389, baby. And Piri Reis dated his maps around the same time Columbus was around (I looked at the translated Turkish, and it mentioned Colombo), which was 1492.This new map is causing a lot hype:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/2446907.stm
http://www.100megsfree4.com/farshores/am02cm.htm
http://www.dialognow.org/story/2002/11/13/183426/30
www.thingsasian.com/browse/stories/topic/ Travel/goto_article/article.1934.html
http://saindia.wack.co.za/article/articleview/4602/1/7/
http://mailbox.univie.ac.at/~muehleb9/questions.html
http://www.ilearnasia.com/ilearn021134.htm
About Chinese sea supremacy: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/sultan/explorers.html
Unrelated, but talks about ancient Chinese weapons and martial arts. http://www.booktrail.com/Safety_Survival/Ancient Chinese Weapons.asp
Yep, I knew Columbus didn't discover Antartica and such. I only used him as reference to the notes on the Piri Reis map, because his name was in the notes.
The map was largely compiled from previous maps that were made 10 000 years ago; the Piri Reis map did not come into existance until 1513. Though Piri sailed around and documented some stuff too, he had help, so that doesn't count.
The map was largely compiled from previous maps that were made 10 000 years ago; the Piri Reis map did not come into existance until 1513. Though Piri sailed around and documented some stuff too, he had help, so that doesn't count.
Sure, thank Av. Even though the Piri Reis map was after the Da Ming Hun Yi Tu.*stalks off*
it seems that people just don't get it
Forget the Piri Reis guy - all he did was copy some maps
what matters is that such previous copies existed and that there was someone who actually saw Antartica and Greenland without the ice coverage, someone who saw South America, Antartica prior to all know explorers, even the Chinese and drew detailed maps of the regions as they geologically were 10 000 years ago!
Not a single fact says that that chinese map is older 10 000 years
I'm talking that there is evidence of some much much earlier civilization that existed at least 10 000 years ago and that it then was on such an advanced level to make such maps
I do get it. I just thought the extra-emphasis on the Piri Reis was cluttering it up. 10 000 years ago ... wow! That's nearly the end of the Ice Age, isn't it? So it would have been easy for humans to see Antartica and Greenland and record their geography, with migration and all.
current official data tells that there have been no people in Antratica prior the 19th century - no migration or whatever
I have a specullation that Antartica is actually Atlantis
Pluto said himself that Atlantis was located at the middle of the ocean
But we have only one ocean, the world ocean, and in the middle of it is Antartica
we started naming different parts of the world ocean later (Atlantic, Pacific, etc)
that is only a specullation of course
the fact remains that there are such maps
I have a specullation that Antartica is actually Atlantis
Pluto said himself that Atlantis was located at the middle of the ocean
But we have only one ocean, the world ocean, and in the middle of it is Antartica
we started naming different parts of the world ocean later (Atlantic, Pacific, etc)
that is only a specullation of course
the fact remains that there are such maps
Mass confusion!!!
Wait, so the originals were 10,000 years ago at the end of the ice age? Were they recorded with coal on animal skins? I dont see how it is possible to have records of Antartica when the population huddled for warmth and followed the migrating herds of animals.
Could someone please explain this oddity to me. Was the Atlantic and Pacific frozen enough that they could walk across to Antartica and back? REALLY CONFUSING
Wait, so the originals were 10,000 years ago at the end of the ice age? Were they recorded with coal on animal skins? I dont see how it is possible to have records of Antartica when the population huddled for warmth and followed the migrating herds of animals.
Could someone please explain this oddity to me. Was the Atlantic and Pacific frozen enough that they could walk across to Antartica and back? REALLY CONFUSING
back then there was an earth strip /link/ between South America and Antartica i.e. they weren't completely devided by water
it was then much like now are connected both Americas
it looked just like in that Piri Reis copied map
geological ocean floor data confirms it
it was then much like now are connected both Americas
it looked just like in that Piri Reis copied map
geological ocean floor data confirms it
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yes
I think that stones, but nobody really knows
maybe some of the population lived there then
if now an ice age started some people would remain where they are, try to live with the help of technology they have, but if they fail they would die out.
Maybe then in Antartica existed an advanced civilization surrounded by the barbarian continents
Trying to sort out this confusion
Humans in Oregon 10,000 Years Ago
Researchers have found traces of a human presence on the Oregon coast dating to more than 10,000 years ago...
The discovery, which dates to the end of the last Ice Age, also lends weight to the theory that early inhabitants of the area might have arrived by sea, rather than by land...
The findings are about the same age as a few sites in coastal Alaska, British Columbia and California...
http://2012.antville.org/stories/217608/
<hr>
No need for huddling and coldness Slacker47, it was the end of the Ice Age. Here's a blob:
With so much water frozen as ice at the poles the sea was not so deep and people and animals could walk from Europe to Britain and across to Ireland.
As the ice melted and the land got warmer trees grew and Britain was soon almost totally forest.
Humans in Oregon 10,000 Years Ago
Researchers have found traces of a human presence on the Oregon coast dating to more than 10,000 years ago...
The discovery, which dates to the end of the last Ice Age, also lends weight to the theory that early inhabitants of the area might have arrived by sea, rather than by land...
The findings are about the same age as a few sites in coastal Alaska, British Columbia and California...
http://2012.antville.org/stories/217608/
<hr>
No need for huddling and coldness Slacker47, it was the end of the Ice Age. Here's a blob:
With so much water frozen as ice at the poles the sea was not so deep and people and animals could walk from Europe to Britain and across to Ireland.
As the ice melted and the land got warmer trees grew and Britain was soon almost totally forest.
No, that's highly unlikely. They would have given way to deterioration long before Piri got his hands on them. I expect they were carved up on some cavern wall somewhere, like the ones in that country which I can't remember the name of....Australia, I think. Yes, I am quite sure it's Australia.
I don't think that Piri Reis ever was in Australia :bugeye:
I think that they might have been stone tablets maybe orignally located at one of the Americas and the first European explores brought them to Europe
Maybe they stole them, maybe received as a gift or smthing
latter they found their way to the Turkish library.. maybe
I think that they might have been stone tablets maybe orignally located at one of the Americas and the first European explores brought them to Europe
Maybe they stole them, maybe received as a gift or smthing
latter they found their way to the Turkish library.. maybe