M
Mr X
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i sure can't beat that!
The Greatest Civilization Ever
- Thread starter Slacker47
- Start date
While I thought it best not to bring up such points, you are correct, Fraggle Rocker.
One of the things not mentioned about the greeks was their method of defense of the home city. Many of these were fought between local city-states. The Hopilite warrior was everyday, Joe Farmer. Such clashes were fought, normally in an afternoon. If you survived then you went back to farmer Joe till the next one. Armour was expensive and each supplied his own. Without the armour you had little chance of surviving such a clash. Any injury had the distinct possibility of the survivor dieing due to infection. Slaves were the currency of the day to indicate your wealth. Life expentancy of slaves were neither good nor held in high esteem.
Roman? Being a soldier was a lifetime thing. Once drafted, you never got out and stood a good chance of never seeing your homeland again. Normally, what passed for drink was wine, with tar and vinegar mixed to help it not go bad. Not exactly tasty. Once again, slaves were the measurement of wealth.
Vikings were a whole 'nother animal. The reason these people did the sea voyage thing was that there was not enough food and resources to go around. They pillaged and conquered for women, slaves, food, and items of use. The sea was a most dreadful thing for them. Ever actually seen a Viking Longboat or it's mockup? How could these men manage to deal with the sea in such a craft? With no knowledge of weather other than folklore the was often no advance warning of sever storms. Many is the voyage that did not return, just from sea conditions.
Most women were sexual objects at best. They were also the mule for hauling things. None of this is a pretty picture nor were the life and times an easy one. People did what they had to do to survive.
What we envisage from the distance of time is no where near what was...
One of the things not mentioned about the greeks was their method of defense of the home city. Many of these were fought between local city-states. The Hopilite warrior was everyday, Joe Farmer. Such clashes were fought, normally in an afternoon. If you survived then you went back to farmer Joe till the next one. Armour was expensive and each supplied his own. Without the armour you had little chance of surviving such a clash. Any injury had the distinct possibility of the survivor dieing due to infection. Slaves were the currency of the day to indicate your wealth. Life expentancy of slaves were neither good nor held in high esteem.
Roman? Being a soldier was a lifetime thing. Once drafted, you never got out and stood a good chance of never seeing your homeland again. Normally, what passed for drink was wine, with tar and vinegar mixed to help it not go bad. Not exactly tasty. Once again, slaves were the measurement of wealth.
Vikings were a whole 'nother animal. The reason these people did the sea voyage thing was that there was not enough food and resources to go around. They pillaged and conquered for women, slaves, food, and items of use. The sea was a most dreadful thing for them. Ever actually seen a Viking Longboat or it's mockup? How could these men manage to deal with the sea in such a craft? With no knowledge of weather other than folklore the was often no advance warning of sever storms. Many is the voyage that did not return, just from sea conditions.
Most women were sexual objects at best. They were also the mule for hauling things. None of this is a pretty picture nor were the life and times an easy one. People did what they had to do to survive.
What we envisage from the distance of time is no where near what was...
Fraggle rocker... maybe you should take a look around! look at all the corruption going around... i mean there was confirmed cases with solid evidence where people spray illegal chemicals to boost profits... i mean u want to see corruption and rape an crap? look, i only... critisize at a forum if someone deserves it, and i call people names even less, but dont be a stuckup tightass. The mayans weretn advanced? if your nieghbours south had advanced some? look at the mayans! they spent centuries watching the skies and got pretty damn good! they made a calander which is about3 seconds accurate to this day, which is pretty darn good considering it was made a few thouasand years ago. i think that spretty impressive. Cities? Roads? the mayans had the biggest network of roads in its time. Cities for the mayans were big, and they made structures rivaled only by the egyptains. It was pretty much a paradise till some inquisitors came and murdered them all. They almost refused to fight back, as it was against their belief system. Disease took care of the rest. Do you think that politics are corrupt in the U.S.? take a look at the last election. The mayans were obviously much more socially advanced than any culture today.
(Note to admins, and everbody, sorry, i know name calling doesnt contribute, but i feel rather strongly about this.)
(Note to admins, and everbody, sorry, i know name calling doesnt contribute, but i feel rather strongly about this.)
But at least we dont have human sacrifice and absolute emperors that claim to be gods. Fraggle Rocker is pretty much right, even if he is no fun
Fraggle,
Of course, it all depends on what traits you apply to convey 'greatest'. Good points about living conditions, cviil rights, etc. I know I would never prefer to live at any point in the past. If those are your conditions, I would say the US - if it would be conceded that the US is a separate and valid civilization.
However, I took 'greatest' to mean the most progress, advancement, and impact to humankind. By those conditions, I stand by the Greeks.
Slacker,
Of course, it all depends on what traits you apply to convey 'greatest'. Good points about living conditions, cviil rights, etc. I know I would never prefer to live at any point in the past. If those are your conditions, I would say the US - if it would be conceded that the US is a separate and valid civilization.
However, I took 'greatest' to mean the most progress, advancement, and impact to humankind. By those conditions, I stand by the Greeks.
Slacker,
You don't think any eastern countries were affected by the Greek civilization? Look at the world today...can you honestly say the chinese civilization has had more of an impact than the greeks? How so? Art, philosophy, law, etc.? Maybe I am looking through my western civilized colored glasses again but I can't see it...
LOL
I don't think there's just "one", each contributed something to world history, and achieved something others didn't (don't ask for examples though) though I'd say Roman's cos of their huge empire, but the Egyptians were pretty mighty, and so were the Inca's, they could've tackled the Conquistadores if they but wanted.
Why was that?
I don't think there's just "one", each contributed something to world history, and achieved something others didn't (don't ask for examples though
) though I'd say Roman's cos of their huge empire, but the Egyptians were pretty mighty, and so were the Inca's, they could've tackled the Conquistadores if they but wanted. Siddhartha
Registered Senior Member
Any civilization that is to be called "Great" is yet to form.
pumpkinsaren'torange
Registered Senior Member
"great"
relax, it's just an adjective. and, it's all purely subjective.
relax, it's just an adjective. and, it's all purely subjective.
Salute SPARTA!
How intriguing...I was going to post this exact same topic, Grey Seal. You sure you are not psychic?
I am OBSESSED with the glorious civilization known as Sparta.
Arguably the finest warriors of the Old World, the Spartans were superbly trained fighters, and many of their tactics and methods are of standard use today (e.g. the boot camp). Their advocacy of paranoia, body strength, war, and fitness made their armies strong and proud. Their driven mentality to achieve honour and rigid vigilance has inspired even Hitler, and the Spartan government has been referred to by some politicians as the "perfect system".
<center>All Hail Sparta! </center>
For a free history lesson courtesy of me, click below:
Part One: http://www.livejournal.com/talkread.bml?journal=blackiceuphoria&itemid=8146
Part Two: http://www.livejournal.com/talkread.bml?journal=blackiceuphoria&itemid=16825
Cheers.
How intriguing...I was going to post this exact same topic, Grey Seal. You sure you are not psychic?
I am OBSESSED with the glorious civilization known as Sparta.
Arguably the finest warriors of the Old World, the Spartans were superbly trained fighters, and many of their tactics and methods are of standard use today (e.g. the boot camp). Their advocacy of paranoia, body strength, war, and fitness made their armies strong and proud. Their driven mentality to achieve honour and rigid vigilance has inspired even Hitler, and the Spartan government has been referred to by some politicians as the "perfect system".
<center>All Hail Sparta! </center>
For a free history lesson courtesy of me, click below:
Part One: http://www.livejournal.com/talkread.bml?journal=blackiceuphoria&itemid=8146
Part Two: http://www.livejournal.com/talkread.bml?journal=blackiceuphoria&itemid=16825
Cheers.
FadingCaptain,
You are correct, but i didnt say that the Chinese had a greater impact. Rather, I said that they were the most magnificient. The Chinese aren't about imposing their beliefs on other cultures. The Chinese developed everything that they knew without the assistance of the Greeks etc... They accomplished the same artistic heights of the Greeks and Romans, but just in a different way. It is hard to see that China is "better" than Western culture because they acheived greatness in a different form. The Daoists and confuciousts contradicted each other... one wanted a government to state laws, and the other wanted to live free.
Its a totally different culture altogether, but in my eyes, they accomplished a better sense of nationalism and a greater continuous population than Europe.
Fraggle,
Jesus, get off the power trip. Yes, people had misconceptions about the word "civilization." Big deal. It was just a quesition about everyones favorite "group of people to live with." Is that better? So what if i would love to live in a completely shitty lifestyle. I hate America and all of the people who DENY the problems. I would rathrer live in a culture that KNEW that life sucked, so they tried to do crazy shit. Its my opinion. I know that life in America is better, but I hate hypocrites.
Yeah, the MesoAmericans had some cracked up rituals. At the time that the Europeans arrived, they were sacrificing most of their people, and the cannibalism got out of hand. Although, the Incas were the shit.
You are correct, but i didnt say that the Chinese had a greater impact. Rather, I said that they were the most magnificient. The Chinese aren't about imposing their beliefs on other cultures. The Chinese developed everything that they knew without the assistance of the Greeks etc... They accomplished the same artistic heights of the Greeks and Romans, but just in a different way. It is hard to see that China is "better" than Western culture because they acheived greatness in a different form. The Daoists and confuciousts contradicted each other... one wanted a government to state laws, and the other wanted to live free.
Its a totally different culture altogether, but in my eyes, they accomplished a better sense of nationalism and a greater continuous population than Europe.
Fraggle,
Jesus, get off the power trip. Yes, people had misconceptions about the word "civilization." Big deal. It was just a quesition about everyones favorite "group of people to live with." Is that better? So what if i would love to live in a completely shitty lifestyle. I hate America and all of the people who DENY the problems. I would rathrer live in a culture that KNEW that life sucked, so they tried to do crazy shit. Its my opinion. I know that life in America is better, but I hate hypocrites.
Yeah, the MesoAmericans had some cracked up rituals. At the time that the Europeans arrived, they were sacrificing most of their people, and the cannibalism got out of hand. Although, the Incas were the shit.