A world with a loving God.

[(Q)]

Just so I'm clear, are you replying on James' behalf? I’m a little confused in that I replied to him but then you started responding as if this is what he might say?

No, I'm responding on my behalf. But, if you feel it sounds similar to what James might say, then that should be a sign that those who don't hold beliefs in the irrational are pretty much on the same page regarding the rational as opposed to those who hold irrational beliefs and can't even seem to agree with one another. We see this in Christianity, for example, where there are tens of thousands of separate denominations.

 

[wegs]

No, I'm responding on my behalf. But, if you feel it sounds similar to what James might say, then that should be a sign that those who don't hold beliefs in the irrational are pretty much on the same page regarding the rational as opposed to those who hold irrational beliefs and can't even seem to agree with one another. We see this in Christianity, for example, where there are tens of thousands of separate denominations.

Okay, fair enough. Of course, people chime in to different threads with their input, but it seemed to be an interception of sorts, when I was quoting James. Thanks for explaining.

I hear you about Christianity, and its many denominations. But, I wonder whose ''fault'' that may be? The denominations seem to have been created (and new ones sprout up every now and then, still) to accomodate the various interpretations of the Bible... interpretations that align with their own desires. That does seem to be ''irrational,'' for want of a better word.

 

[(Q)]

Okay, fair enough. Of course, people chime in to different threads with their input, but it seemed to be an interception of sorts, when I was quoting James. Thanks for explaining.

I hear you about Christianity, and its many denominations. But, I wonder whose ''fault'' that may be? The denominations seem to have been created (and new ones sprout up every now and then, still) to accomodate the various interpretations of the Bible... interpretations that align with their own desires. That does seem to be ''irrational,'' for want of a better word.

The fault lies in outdated thinking, the fact that humans used to be steeped in myths and superstitions for centuries and that has carried forward to today unfortunately. The Age of Reason seems to have left behind a lot of folks. Look at the state of the US right now, facts and evidence are being flushed down the toilet in favor of the irrational, which we find seems to be coming from the believers. Notice how much damage can be caused simply because folks embrace the irrational?

 

[(Q)]

"When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called a Religion."

“Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest."

 

[davewhite04]

"When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called a Religion."

“Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest."

So who is this last king? Who is the last priest? You think humanity being "free" is the ultimate? How will that change your life? Who is this king that has us chained up?

Sounds like you just want a scapegoat.

 

[(Q)]

So who is this last king? Who is the last priest? You think humanity being "free" is the ultimate? How will that change your life? Who is this king that has us chained up?

Sounds like you just want a scapegoat.

I think this fellow can talk about it much better than I. How it will change my life? In multiple ways. As a land owner I would pay less property taxes as the land currently used (tax free) by religious institutes (and their huge fcuking parking lots) would start paying taxes and mine wouldn't be used to subsidize them. Apparently, this runs into the billions of dollars. The economy might flourish a little more if valid businesses took over some of those properties or if in a residential neighborhood, could be used for more housing. The list goes on and on.

Personally, I think one of the worst things mankind has ever come up with is the concept of worship, which crushes ones self-worth, integrity and morals as it destroys the mind by plugging it with ignorance, fear and tribalism. In my opinion, mankind should stop worshiping their religious idols, whether real or imagined.

 

[davewhite04]

I think this fellow can talk about it much better than I. How it will change my life? In multiple ways. As a land owner I would pay less property taxes as the land currently used (tax free) by religious institutes (and their huge fcuking parking lots) would start paying taxes and mine wouldn't be used to subsidize them. Apparently, this runs into the billions of dollars. The economy might flourish a little more if valid businesses took over some of those properties or if in a residential neighborhood, could be used for more housing. The list goes on and on.

Personally, I think one of the worst things mankind has ever come up with is the concept of worship, which crushes ones self-worth, integrity and morals as it destroys the mind by plugging it with ignorance, fear and tribalism. In my opinion, mankind should stop worshiping their religious idols, whether real or imagined.

I completely agree. Religion needs to go, but maybe God does exist, so do you think him actually being on earth be a good replacement for religion?

Unfortunately religion, school, 9-5 jobs, have 2.5 children etc.. are drilled into us, it's up to individuals to free themselves of the clutter, like religion.

 

[wegs]

We all look up to someone, or some thing. Worship might not be the appropriate word, but if we're being honest... politics, religion, hobbies, relationships, celebrities, etc can all sweep people away, and many of their thoughts are not their own. The ''American Dream'' is another idea that causes people to do all kinds of things, to keep it going. Look at all the debt people get into to look like they have more money than they do. They become enslaved to a way of life, that has nothing to do with religion, but has to do with their own ego. So, religion isn't the only area of life, where I see ''worship'' going on.

Where you spend the most time, money and energy is what matters to you most.

 

[davewhite04]

We all look up to someone, or some thing. Worship might not be the appropriate word, but if we're being honest... politics, religion, hobbies, relationships, celebrities, etc can all sweep people away, and many of their thoughts are not their own. The ''American Dream'' is another idea that causes people to do all kinds of things, to keep it going. Look at all the debt people get into to look like they have more money than they do. They become enslaved to a way of life, that has nothing to do with religion, but has to do with their own ego. So, religion isn't the only area of life, where I see ''worship'' going on.

Where you spend the most time, money and energy is what matters to you most.

Brilliantly put.

EDIT: And you are right. Their thoughts aren't their own much of the time.

 

[wegs]

Brilliantly put.

EDIT: And you are right. Their thoughts aren't their own much of the time.

I think we tend to pick on religious people (because it's easy?), but ''idolizing'' money, sex, porn, gambling, drugs, relationships, people, vanity, etc is a very real thing, so much so, it may cause destructive behaviors and addictions. We could find another word for ''worship,'' but it seems to fit in a way. Self actualization and reflection isn't always fun, but it is worth it.

 

[(Q)]

I completely agree. Religion needs to go, but maybe God does exist, so do you think him actually being on earth be a good replacement for religion?

Unfortunately religion, school, 9-5 jobs, have 2.5 children etc.. are drilled into us, it's up to individuals to free themselves of the clutter, like religion.

Regardless of whether God exists or not, it's a completely irrelevant point until God actually decides to reveal himself to all mankind. Until then, we're just pissing into the wind and speculating on something that's never been shown to exist.

 

[(Q)]

I think we tend to pick on religious people (because it's easy?), but ''idolizing'' money, sex, porn, gambling, drugs, relationships, people, vanity, etc is a very real thing, so much so, it may cause destructive behaviors and addictions. We could find another word for ''worship,'' but it seems to fit in a way. Self actualization and reflection isn't always fun, but it is worth it.

When people worship (idolize) money, sex, porn, gambling, drugs, relationships, people, vanity, etc., they are indeed real things that can have real consequences and cause real damage, but we can also find real solutions to those problems and solve them, which most sane people would agree. Yet, if we try and apply the same principles to worshiping God, we're told it's blasphemy and how dare we question the worshiping of God, regardless of the damage or consequences. In Islam, it's cause for violence. Completely different things, don't ya think?

 

[wegs]

Sure, in some cases but not sure there’s a “cure” for over blown egos.

So do you feel that religious and/or spiritual expression should be banned?

 

[davewhite04]

Regardless of whether God exists or not, it's a completely irrelevant point until God actually decides to reveal himself to all mankind. Until then, we're just pissing into the wind and speculating on something that's never been shown to exist.

How should this "God" show himself to world for them to know it is actually "God"?

I can't think of anything "supernatural" that would work. If God floated to earth on clouds Christians would probably believe it's a deception, I shit you not.

People want to worship an invisible Jesus, waving their arms in the air calling his name, pretending to speak in tongues etc.

Pathetic.

EDIT: Many Christians believe that God is in their hearts and don't go about with this "feeling" Jesus above them business.

 

[DaveC426913]

I can't think of anything "supernatural" that would work.

If a ten mile tall guy with a beard appeared in the sky in front of every human, and turned day into night with a twitch of his moustache and turned the world inside out with a wink - I would very seriously reconsider my views on God's existence.

If God floated to earth on clouds Christians would probably believe it's a deception, I shit you not.

How do you know what they will or won't believe?

 

[davewhite04]

If a ten mile tall guy with a beard appeared in the sky in front of every human, and turned day into night with a twitch of his moustache and turned the world inside out with a wink - I would very seriously reconsider my views on God's existence.

You might, but a terrified kid might think it's the clown out of IT.

How do you know what they will or won't believe?

Because I have talked to people who actually think that way. Not all Christians. The Christians that believe it's God will be called "deceived" by millions of Christians.

It doesn't work.

 

[DaveC426913]

Because I have talked to people who actually think that way.

Except that it hasn't happened yet. They don't know how they'll react.

I believe that - when faced with a robber pointing a gun at my wife - I'll step in and take the bullet. But that makes no difference until I'm actually confronted with the situation.

 

[davewhite04]

Except that it hasn't happened yet. They don't know how they'll react.

I believe that - when faced with a robber pointing a gun at my wife - I'll step in and take the bullet. But that makes no difference until I'm actually confronted with the situation.

It's pointless in anyway. Why would "God" want you to believe in him? Maybe he really doesn't give a fuck either way.

 

[(Q)]

Sure, in some cases but not sure there’s a “cure” for over blown egos.

So do you feel that religious and/or spiritual expression should be banned?

Why should anyone feel the need for religious expression? Isn't religion between a person and their God? Why should it be made public? What would be the point?

 

[(Q)]

How should this "God" show himself to world for them to know it is actually "God"?

I can't think of anything "supernatural" that would work. If God floated to earth on clouds Christians would probably believe it's a deception, I shit you not.

I think that's a rather moot point. If God did what he allegedly did, creating the universe and everything in it, he can certainly find a way to reveal himself and make sure every single person on the planet knows its Him (or Her or It). He should at the very least be intelligent enough to figure that out.

People want to worship an invisible Jesus, waving their arms in the air calling his name, pretending to speak in tongues etc.

Pathetic.

EDIT: Many Christians believe that God is in their hearts and don't go about with this "feeling" Jesus above them business.

They can make that claim but they're shooting themselves in the foot simply because they immediately imply they're special among humans. If they have God in their heart, then we all do. Of course, we can remind them that the heart pumps blood and it's actually our minds that we're talking about. God would be in every person's mind and we would all know, if we followed that Christian logic.