Originally posted by WANDERER
Actually it does make evolutionary sense. Being fat is a rarity in nature and only a species, like us, that has mastered or dominated its environment can hope to indulge in gluttony and superfluous nutrition.
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M*W: I disagree that it is a "rarity in nature...". Our food supply is depleted of nutrients because the soil used to grow food is depleted. Our lifestyles are busy to do all the cooking that preserves what nutrients are left in the food supply. We eat a lot of fast-food and it's notoriously unhealthy. As far as the animal kingdom goes, the more robust, the healthier. I take it that neither Dr. Lou or you have ever read anthropological studies about women with big hips and a little fat reserve on their bodies, or do you both think that sexual media hype promoting the Barbie Doll figure is the norm?
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People forget that human civilization is a relatively new environment for humanity and that we are still hardwired for a more natural primitive one. In a natural environment the desirable form of sleek muscularity ensures the survivability of the individual whereas any other form points to a physical ailment or mutation that becomes unattractive because it is helpless and unable to adapt or react with the speed necessary to ensure survival.
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M*W: I disagree that. We might still be hardwired for a more natural, primitive environment, but a little adipose on the bod kept those cavepersons warm and helped them to survive when food was scarce.
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Food is not the end all answer in nature; if it were then obesity would be attractive. In females overweightness also signifies an inability to become impregnated and to successfully bear a child to term.
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Food is everything in nature. It's just you two guys who prefer the anorexic-looking females which is just as sick as they are. Gross obesity is one thing. That is not healthy at all, and it is high-risk to other killing diseases. Throughout history, skinny women were not preferred over the more robust ones.
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We forget that the ideal form is not one that has access to food continuously but one that is fit enough to deal with changing circumstances in diverse environments.
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M*W: The "ideal" you refer to is one created by the media. Anthropological studies have shown that males prefer women who have a little meat on their bones for procreation purposes.
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Ergo intelligence is also important and physical fitness is the ideal form.
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M*W: That is today's ideal model. Food is readily available. Physical fitness is the rule of the day. We know this is an important part of modern culture, because we don't go out and kill for food like our ancient ancestors did.
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Living in a modern consumer dominated culture, like in the west, we somehow have taken consuming and acquiring as the highest virtue and so we are perplexed when nature reminds us that this is not so.
The subliminal message given off by obesity is that of a physical ailment, such as a glandular problem, or a mental ailment, such as a lack of discipline, will-power or self-respect. It may also reveal a physical inefficiency to deal with calories or a mental lethargy and dependence.
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M*W: Obesity is not always "lack of discipline." Our genetic heritage would have us forage for food. We don't need to do that today. We can just drive-thru McDonalds. It's easier. Perhaps we have evolved as a race faster than our genes could keep up with us. Obesity is not healthy, but neither are food disorders.
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We must remember that the physical manifestations of what we call reality are signposts and evidence of inner workings. Our physicality is a symbol of our inner self or our history. Being tall, for instance, exemplifies access to good nutrition, past physical health and a stable environment and so is considered preferable to shortness.
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M*W: Our diets over the centuries have allowed us to grow taller. Even as recent as the Civil War, we have become more massive. It's not only our genes that make us who we are, it is our lifestyle.
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There is no cultural prejudice here only a natural prejudice that culture mirrors. In my view, when you reach a certain weight because of gluttony or circumstances [I exclude medical factors here] and then you do not have the mental discipline, the will-power, the self-esteem to do something about it and work hard and consistence to alter it, if not for aesthetic shallow reasons then for personal health and pride, then you should not complain or attempt to redefine the concept of physical attractiveness.
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M*W: Oh, but there is cultural prejudice here. What you're attracted to today is a result of the media. Sex sells. Look at Hollywood for instance, all those bare-bellied goddesses who can't get pregnant and are adopting: Nicole Kidman, Courtney Cox Arquette, Sharon Stone, Angelina Jolie, etc. The sunken in belly is in. Thank God in my day men liked a little something to hold onto.
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Your body is a mirror to your mind, its inflexible obesity reflects the same attributes within your psychology and its helpless slowness that looks for magical quick fixes that avoid pain and suffering reflects your brain patterns.
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M*W: No, the body is NOT a mirror to the mind. Obesity might reflect certain attributes, but they are not always on target. Sometimes medication is needed, definitely exercise is needed, and for sure a healthier diet is required. Just because you two aren't attracted to full-figured women, so be it. You're certainly no loss to the female gender.
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There is an entire industry that takes advantage of the majority’s inability to work or to earn any successes and is helplessly reliant on short-cuts and technological breakthroughs to accomplish what they as individuals cannot. The recent stomach-stapling craze and past ‘fat blocker’ pills as well as the popularity of diet plans and cult solutions manipulate weak minds to give up their money because they do not have the strength or mental discipline to find a solution on their own.
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M*W: Yes, there is an entire industry out there for weight control. Some may work, most others not. It has nothing to do with a "weak mind." There is a solution: Eat more protein and less carbs and high-glycemic foods (potatoes, rice, pasta, bread, cereals), take vitamins and minerals, drink a lot of water, and walk.
