That's akin to claiming that most of the 9/11 deaths were sectarian in nature (christianity vs islam) and therefore not innocent.
10th Anniversary of Iraq War.
- Thread starter Saturnine Pariah
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That's akin to claiming that most of the 9/11 deaths were sectarian in nature (christianity vs islam) and therefore not innocent.
spidergoat
Valued Senior Member
9/11 was extremely one-sided.
spidergoat
Valued Senior Member
He killed lots of innocent people just to create terror. I'm sure some were violently opposing Saddam, but most were not.
His tactics were crude but killed less people as a result of his rule than the policy USA leads with other countries of "Fear".
He was an unusually powerful standard model rightwing US backed strongman tyrant - current examples exist in the 'stans, hangovers and residuals throughout South America and Africa and SE Asia. The use of terror by the State - "interrogation" prisons known to feature ugly and fearsome abuses (such as Abu Ghraib), "disappearances" and paramilitary violence, etc - are part of that standard model. The total number of people directly afflicted is not that large - in the low tens of thousands at the very most, for a full blown long term terror campaign throughout a country the size of Iraq.spidergoat said:
If you can can find examples of Saddam killing large numbers of people (even just the high tens of thousands, anywhere near comparable to the Iraq invasion and aftermath) who were not violently opposing him, please share. I have never seen any documented.
The United States is training secular Syrian fighters in Jordan in a bid to bolster forces battling President Bashar Assad's regime and stem the influence of Islamist radicals among the country's persistently splintered opposition, American and foreign officials said.
The training has been conducted for several months now in an unspecified location, concentrating largely on Sunnis and tribal Bedouins who formerly served as members of the Syrian army, officials told The Associated Press. The forces aren't members of the leading rebel group, the Free Syrian Army, which Washington and others fear may be increasingly coming under the sway of extremist militia groups, including some linked to al-Qaida, they said.
The operation is being run by U.S. intelligence and is ongoing, officials said, but those in Washington stressed that the U.S. is providing only nonlethal aid at this point. Others such as Britain and France are involved, they said, though it's unclear whether any Western governments are providing materiel or other direct military support after two years of civil war that according to the United Nations already has killed more than 70,000 people.
The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because they weren't authorized to speak publicly about the program.
Officially, the Obama administration has been vague on the subject of what type of military training it may be providing, while insisting that it is doing all it can — short of providing weapons to the rebels or engaging in its own military intervention — to hasten the demise of the Assad family's four-decade dictatorship.
White House spokesman Josh Earnest said Monday the U.S. has "provided some logistical nonlethal support that has also come in handy for the Syrian rebels who are, again, fighting a regime that is not hesitating to use the military might of that regime against its own people.
http://news.yahoo.com/officials-us-training-syrian-forces-000203408.html
We need more immigrants to fill the over build housing industry, so we destabilize other regimes.
spidergoat
Valued Senior Member
Huh?
spidergoat
Valued Senior Member
spidergoat
Valued Senior Member
No, he killed far more.
That link refers to the Kurds, which were allied with Iran during the Iran-Iraq war.
Using the same justifications others use here, he killed those ~100,000 Kurds to shorten the war and save the lives of millions of Iraqis and Iranians.
Not according to your link. There are very few if any examples of thisspidrgoat said:
in your link. Not even low tens of thousands - more like low hundreds, from a quick mental perusal.
The link is mostly examples of war crimes, as it says in its own title - atrocities Saddam committed against people who had launched overt military violence against him and against Iraq as a country, started civil wars or thrown in with foreign armies such as Iran's, the kinds we have been comparing to the nuking of Hiroshima above.
Furthermore, even misrepresenting a list of decades of alleged war crimes as State terrorism against its own people and genocide of the innocent, the total is not big enough to support this response in comparison with a few years of US assault and occupation
100,000 over a couple of decades would be at least somewhat less, not "far more", than were killed in the Iraq invasion and its one decade aftermath of ethnic cleansing, sectarian fighting, violent rebellion, Islamic jihad, US military assault and reaction, and so forth.
It might sound Huh to you but look every time the USA gets involved in a war Refugee from those country have commend in , and those people need housing.
The final breakdown of every tax dollar spent by the United States to rebuild post-invasion Iraq was presented to Congress earlier this month - a down-to-the-nickel analysis of nine years and $60bn worth of waste, arrogance and ineptitude unequalled in American history.
The conclusive report by Stuart Bowen, the Special Inspector General for Iraq Reconstruction (SIGIR), was a 186-page document titled "Learning From Iraq”, which followed that misspent money on a tragic joyride through the expensive and embarrassing mega-blunders that have become synonymous with US"nation-building” efforts in Iraq since 2003.
Clearly a must-read for any official in US-occupied Afghanistan, the SIGIR report was based on 220 audits, 170 inspections, hundreds of investigations, and, most compellingly, candid interviews with 44 senior Iraqi officials and US military and congressional leaders, including US General David Petraeus, Senator John McCain and Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki.
In depth
WATCHDOG WORK: During its congressional mandate, SIGIR was able to secure 104 indictments, 82 convictions and $191m in court-ordered fines.
SECURITY CONTRACTORS: SIGIR identified an explosion in the number of private security contractors, between 25,000-30,000 in Iraq.
STACKS OF CASH: In 2003 and 2004, more than $10bn in cash was flown to Baghdad on US military aircraft in the form of massive, shrink-wrapped bundles of $100 bills stored on large pallets.
BAD BUILDING: In 2010, SIGIR inspected 170 US-funded construction projects valued at nearly $2.1bn. Of 116 ongoing projects, “almost one-half did not meet contract specifications or had major deficiencies”.
Maliki, for example, told Bowen and his staff "$55bn could have brought great change to Iraq”, but the positive impact of that spending was"lost”.
Claire McCaskill, a Democratic senator from Missouri, called the teamwork between the US departments "an utter, abject, failure” and described the agencies' collaborative efforts as a "circular firing squad”.