World trade centre collapse, 9/11 conspiracy

[DaveC426913]

500,000 tons is 50,000,000 kilograms. (All metric units.) It even says so right in the article; you apparently missed that.

This should be a cathartic moment for @psikeykackr - to realize that he is not qualified to judge whether others (let alone experts) are wrong.

How can he critique any engineering if he is unable to handle basic grade school units and measurements? (If this is a simple, honest mistake he should consider the strong likelihood that his entire argument is a similarly simple, honest mistake. After all, how would he know if it wasn't?)

It should cause him to rethink his raison d'etre as resting on a baseless foundation.

It won't. He doesn't care. Trolls are too busy trolling to waste time getting things right.

But it does serve as an extant example to readers that
- he is not qualified to judge whether others (let alone experts) are wrong .
- his whole raison d'etre rests on a baseless foundation.
- grade school math escapes him.

How does this unqualified troll warrant an audience at all?

 

[David C]

Now this is funny. LOL

Nope, just you being dumb.

500,000 tons is 1,000,000,000 lbs.

Nope. 1,102,292,769lbs "LOL"

A kilogram is 2.2 lbs

Nope. A KG is 2.20462lbs "LOL"

so a billion lbs is 4.545 × 10**8 kg.

One of the dumbest things I have ever seen. You've taken their Tonnage figure, incorrectly converted it to pounds. You've then incorrectly stated the value of a kilogram when we are dealing with large numbers. Then to compund your daft errors you've taken the incorrect total of pounds re-converted it to tons using your wrong kg to lbs number and arrived at a figure that is nothing to do with what was stated.

It is actually one of the most absurd things I've ever seen.

So Scientific American begins by being off by 9%.

No, they stated a figure. Your moronic, needless and baffling conversion failures produced any discrepancy.

WTC2 was 1362 ft and WTC1 was 1368, so they couldn't even get the heights correct.

They specified the height of the bulk, not the added maintenance areas and walkways which contributed to additional heights.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/when-the-twin-towers-fell/
"With a mass of about 500,000 tons (5 x 10(to the power of) 8 kilograms), a height of about 1,350 ft. (411 meters), and the acceleration of gravity at 9.8 meters per second 2, he came up with a potential energy total of 1019 ergs (1012 Joules or 278 Megawatt-hours). "

Run along now, you just made one of the most embarrassing fails possible. And try not to pull Billvon up because he missed a zero on his post - the point is the same!

 

[psikeyhackr]

In the United Kingdom, the (Imperial) ton is a statute measure, defined as 2,240 pounds (about 1,016 kg).[a][1]

In the United States and Canada,[2] a ton is defined to be 2,000 pounds (907.18474 kg).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ton

An American magazine writing about an American building wouldn't use an American unit. The refer to it as 'tonne otherwise.

 

[DaveC426913]

In the United Kingdom, the (Imperial) ton is a statute measure, defined as 2,240 pounds (about 1,016 kg).[a][1]
In the United States and Canada,[2] a ton is defined to be 2,000 pounds (907.18474 kg).
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ton
An American magazine writing about an American building wouldn't use an American unit. The refer to it as 'tonne otherwise.

Excuses.

Like it or not, it's what it is. It doesn't absolve you of shooting off your mouth and being dead wrong about such a simple thing. The fact is, you didn't bother to do your homework to find out why you got an answer that didn't match with the published answer.

And that is why you are not qualified to judge those do spend a little more than a few minutes reading an article.

 

[psikeyhackr]

Also seen in Fig. 5–3a are two other markings, “5T” and “<63>”, found on the exterior panel sections. These markings are the estimated piece tonnage (1 ton equals 2,000 lbs, or approximately 907 kg) and
erector’s derrick division number, respectively. This information was also stamped on some of the core column pieces, see Fig. 5–2. The erector, Karl Koch Erecting Co., Inc., assigned derrick divisions 47 through 70 for WTC 1 and derrick divisions 547 through 570 for WTC 2 (PONYA 1967).

NIST NCSTAR1 1-3

 

[David C]

In the United Kingdom, the (Imperial) ton is a statute measure, defined as 2,240 pounds (about 1,016 kg).[a][1]

In the United States and Canada,[2] a ton is defined to be 2,000 pounds (907.18474 kg).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ton

An American magazine writing about an American building wouldn't use an American unit. The refer to it as 'tonne otherwise.

What!? In your face, they quoted the KILOGRAM total and your moronic maths was needless, baffling and wrong. Admit it, be a man.

Conspiracy theorists simply never admit their failures, it's why they are able to believe the bollocks that they believe. In your case, nobody knows what the hell you believe since you never state it!

 

[psikeyhackr]

They specified the height of the bulk, not the added maintenance areas and walkways which contributed to additional heights

So you just make shit up?

Provide a link regarding these "walkways".

https://heightpedia.com/twin-towers-height/

Make up some more bullshit, it's more amusing than your inability to do grade school math.

 

[David C]

So you just make shit up?

No, I looked at some pretty pictures. Making shit up is your strong point.

https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-W0RbxKJ1...XVC8rPm1fpM/s1600/4507291221_a051c28735_z.jpg

Make up some more bullshit, it's more amusing than your inability to do grade school math.

Your sorry attempt to show scientific-american errors was actually a complete mess and here you are, afraid to admit it and not even understanding the completely idiotic thing that you did.

You took a given number. You screwed up converting it to pounds, even though the article showed how many kilograms. You then screwed up the pounds to kilograms by simplifying it. Why would you even do this when they gave the actual figure. You then multiplied figure 1 by figure 2 to get an idiotic wrong total when you already had been given the correct total. Then like a clown you attempt to suggest I made errors in my maths when you made errors in reality that are off the scale fail.

Run along now, you are a big embarrassment. You claim that conspiracy theorists are all wrong and the original account is wrong, then offer diddly-squat to show/prove what you think happened. You are a time wasting troll.

 

[billvon]

An American magazine writing about an American building wouldn't use an American unit. The refer to it as 'tonne otherwise.

Nope. Metric ton is correct. And they gave the units in that example.

From the dictionary:


met·ric ton
/ˈmetrik ˈtən/

noun

1. a unit of weight equal to 1,000 kilograms (2,205 lb).

Perhaps learning more math/science would help you understand such things?

 

[psikeyhackr]

This is hysterical. So many sources are for shit!
I already provided you with an NIST quote for what they meant by a TON.

The towers were massive.

Each weighed more than 250,000 tons,

contained 99 elevators, and had 21,800 windows. Each floor was an acre in size, and there was enough concrete in the towers to build a sidewalk from New York City to Washington, D.C. The complex even had its own zip code: 10048.

https://911memorial.org/learn/resources/world-trade-center-history

The twin towers had more floors (at 110) than any other building before the completion of the Sears Tower in 1973. Their floor counts were not matched until the construction of the Sears Tower, and they were not surpassed until the construction of the Burj Khalifa, which opened in 2010.

Each tower had a total mass of around 500,000 tons.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Trade_Center_(1973–2001)

Eagar, Thomas W., and Christopher Musso. Why Did the World Trade Center Collapse? Science, Engineering, and Speculation. 2001. JOM. "The total weight of the structure was roughly 500,000 t, but wind load, rather than the gravity load, dominated the design" 450,000,000 kg
(each tower)

World Trade Center History. Fact Monster. Family Education Network. 2003. "Weighed 500,000 tons" 450,000,000 kg
(each tower)

https://hypertextbook.com/facts/2004/EricChen.shtml

You guys just engage in knee jerk arguments. 12 to 18 feet of "walkways." LOL

 

[DaveC426913]

12 to 18 feet of "walkways.

psikeyhackr note to self:

A foot is 12 inches.

Not metres, tonnes, furlongs or cubits.

You're welcome, and carry on.

 

[David C]

This is hysterical. So many sources are for shit!
I already provided you with an NIST quote for what they meant by a TON.

Doubling down on his idiotic failure. This is what conspiracy clowns do.

You guys just engage in knee jerk arguments. 12 to 18 feet of "walkways." LOL

Didn't the pretty picture show you some extra height that wasn't bulk? Have you ever looked at the plans. They're online and show the white angled area at the top is effectively just fascia:

d81cf94b3ab55fff9f02880759503b20.jpg (1028×1416) (archpaper.com)

Can you see all the maintenance bits in this picture below? Can you see the white angled pieces at the top that the plans show are not part of the bulk.

https://www.thoughtco.com/thmb/kaUe...p-578695525-crop-5b724e9946e0fb0050eab3a0.jpg

Troll.

 

[Michael 345]

Troll

David C - feeding

 

[David C]

David C - feeding

Kind of, in an "arse-kicking all around the room" sort of way.

 

[Michael 345]

Kind of, in an "arse-kicking all around the room" sort of way.

Careful you might be kicking the most intelligent part

 

[DaveC426913]

psikeyhackr be so yesterday's news.

 

[Q-reeus]

Moderator note: Q-reeus has been warned for insulting other members. Specifically, he has accused other members of supporting serious crimes, without attempting to provide any evidence for his accusations.



Q-reeus was asked to either support or retract his accusations. He has made no effort to do either, so far.

This kind of behaviour towards other members of sciforums is unacceptable.

Due to accumulated warning points, Q-reeus has been temporarily banned from sciforums for a period of 2 weeks.

What is clear to me is that your bullying and at the same time cowardly-subservient-to-almighty Judaism's repressive leftist dictates, is a piece of crock.
Entirely lacking from yours and oft quarreling 'fellow' SF Leftist-Marxist mods is any semblance of objective fact. 'Antisemitism' is just code for repression of freedom of speech hence anti-freedom of thought. In a truly free society, any and all political/ideological 'truths' aught to be freely criticized.

Very much NOT the case for SF or more generally in supposedly 'free' 'democracies', correctly characterized by .e.g Aldus Huxley as 'oligarchies (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligarchy) in fact'.

A truth denied by the cowardly leftist conformists like you. So go ahead and life ban me for daring to point out the extreme hypocrisy of Israel's and fellow Jew financiers/backers mass-murdering agendas. Who financed and indeed created ISIS/ISIL/whatever alternate label, as engines of ME destabilization/destruction. The latest (ca 29/12/2021) instance of the Jewish States expansionist aggression being of of uncriticized-in-'Western' MSM, bombing of Syrian port facilities:
https://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-...ia-port-israeli-missile-attack/6511640697216/
That on top of announced plans to create ~ 8000 Jewish settler homes in the stolen Golan heights - actually Syrian not Israeli territory!
And of course the incessant pressure by Israel for the decimation of Iran, preferably by yet again expending goy military personnel of the US and 'allies'.
Just like was the case for their tragically successful campaign to decimate (via US and so-called 'coalition-of-the-willing' partners, as proxy), then potential rival Iraq in 2003 onward. We can all see how well that has turned out for Iraqi citizens. 'Liberation'? NOT. Likewise for ravaged citizens of Afghanistan, Libya etc. A trail of destruction always follows Israel instigated wars of 'liberation'. That 'miraculously' always benefits Israel, and no-one else.

I do NOT wish you and SF political/ideological fellow-travelers a happy and prosperous new year for 2022.

 

[Q-reeus]

double post

 

[billvon]

. . . your bullying . . . cowardly-subservient-to-almighty Judaism's repressive leftist dictates, . . . Leftist-Marxist . . . repression of freedom of speech . . .cowardly leftist conformists

I have to ask - do you think that such hateful ranting makes people think more of your argument? Because it sort of does the opposite. You come across as incoherent and confused. Surely you can do better than that.

I do NOT wish you and SF political/ideological fellow-travelers a happy and prosperous new year for 2022.

I have noted lately that the right wing's one consistent political message is "fuck you." You seem to hew to this message as well.

 

[exchemist]

What is clear to me is that your bullying and at the same time cowardly-subservient-to-almighty Judaism's repressive leftist dictates, is a piece of crock.
Entirely lacking from yours and oft quarreling 'fellow' SF Leftist-Marxist mods is any semblance of objective fact. 'Antisemitism' is just code for repression of freedom of speech hence anti-freedom of thought. In a truly free society, any and all political/ideological 'truths' aught to be freely criticized.

Very much NOT the case for SF or more generally in supposedly 'free' 'democracies', correctly characterized by .e.g Aldus Huxley as 'oligarchies (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligarchy) in fact'.

A truth denied by the cowardly leftist conformists like you. So go ahead and life ban me for daring to point out the extreme hypocrisy of Israel's and fellow Jew financiers/backers mass-murdering agendas. Who financed and indeed created ISIS/ISIL/whatever alternate label, as engines of ME destabilization/destruction. The latest (ca 29/12/2021) instance of the Jewish States expansionist aggression being of of uncriticized-in-'Western' MSM, bombing of Syrian port facilities:
https://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-...ia-port-israeli-missile-attack/6511640697216/
That on top of announced plans to create ~ 8000 Jewish settler homes in the stolen Golan heights - actually Syrian not Israeli territory!
And of course the incessant pressure by Israel for the decimation of Iran, preferably by yet again expending goy military personnel of the US and 'allies'.
Just like was the case for their tragically successful campaign to decimate (via US and so-called 'coalition-of-the-willing' partners, as proxy), then potential rival Iraq in 2003 onward. We can all see how well that has turned out for Iraqi citizens. 'Liberation'? NOT. Likewise for ravaged citizens of Afghanistan, Libya etc. A trail of destruction always follows Israel instigated wars of 'liberation'. That 'miraculously' always benefits Israel, and no-one else.

I do NOT wish you and SF political/ideological fellow-travelers a happy and prosperous new year for 2022.

Juden raus!