Will Hillary become president after recount?

Bowser said:
Don't you mean Hillary's recount effort?
Click to expand...
No.

One of the problems with a politician like Clinton - or Gore, Kerry, in the past - is that nobody can count on them to do something like this, or even make an honest attempt. We've seen consistent vote suppression and voting machine "anomalies" for five consecutive Presidential elections, and the Democratic Party political establishment has done nothing about it.

And they've had the money. One can argue that even just making an example of one of the more obvious cases - Ohio in 2004, say - would have been of great benefit, whether it reversed an election or not.

Clinton has apparently promised to provide lawyers, and maybe they will show up, but this kind of thing is not something one can expect from current Democratic Party management. Without somebody like Stein, this wouldn't be happening.
 
"It's not the voting that's Democracy, it's the counting. "

Capracus said:
State election officials said Friday evening that Trump now led Democratic challenger Hillary Clinton by 49,000 votes, down from 71,000 as provisional and absentee ballots from overseas are recorded.
Click to expand...

One might track this: the "spoilage" and reject rate in the voting machine, provisional, and absentee ballots. Compare Pennsylvania's locale by locale - under threat of recount, when its criteria for such determinations will come under scrutiny - with, say, North Carolina's or Ohio's, or any other swing State not under recount threat. Or for that matter any comparable State with a Democratic governor.

Thing is: provisional and absentee ballots are often not "secret" before counting - somebody looks at them. The person deciding whether they are properly signed, filled out, witnessed, etc, often knows or can determine how they voted, or at least where they are from. And likewise voting machines are individually calibrated to reject ballots whose indicated votes are for some reason unclear or improper - and their locations are known by the calibrators.


Last I looked into it, the calculation was that a black person's ballot in the US was nine times as likely as a white person's to be rejected as "spoiled" or improper.
 
It looks like Jill Stein’s recount efforts are pretty much circling the drain at this point. Michigan courts ruled she has no standing for a recount based on her low vote count. Wisconsin and Pennsylvania petitions also face continued challenges in court. So much for my $29.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/presidential-recount-michigan-expands-detroit-area-43999331

Pennsylvania finally finished their count.

TRUMP 2,970,764

CLINTON 2,926,457

JOHNSON 146,709

STEIN 49,947

Trump’s margin over Clinton was 44,307 votes. Combine half of Johnson’s votes with all of Stein’s, and you get 123,301 foolishly cast for Trump. Ask said progressive voters to pull heads out of ass, and Clinton wins by 78,994 votes.
 
I meant to say, "Probably not given Trump is fighting and delaying the recounts as Bush Junior did in 2000".
 
Question: has anyone of these recount efforts actually got to the recount phase, do we have results yet, have they detected any sign of vote tampering?
 
ElectricFetus said:
Question: has anyone of these recount efforts actually got to the recount phase, do we have results yet, have they detected any sign of vote tampering?
Click to expand...
So far, all of the recounts have been blocked by lawyers acting in the service of the main source of accusations that the election was rigged. It's looking like the basic investigations that would discover fraud if it existed are not going to be undertaken this year either. The fifth consecutive American Presidential election that would have been flagged by the UN observation folks as "irregular, probably invalid" is passing by.

Go figure.

As far as signs of vote count manipulation, possible machine or software tampering, etc, we have a basket full of them: such as the anomalous statistical results and voting circumstances - no one has yet offered any other plausible explanation for why, for example, exit polls are so much less accurate (but consistent in direction of their errors) in regions that recorded their votes on certain kinds of machines overseen by Republic governors, while remaining spot on in other regions; no one has plausibly explained why a black voter in the US is 5 to 10 (average around 9) times as likely to have their ballot be rejected as "spoiled" , no one has totaled up the effects of the fact that voting machines break down or are too few, resulting in long lines, over and over again in multiple consecutive elections, in only some places and not others, and so forth.
 
iceaura said:
As far as signs of vote count manipulation, possible machine or software tampering, etc, we have a basket full of them: such as the anomalous statistical results and voting circumstances - no one has yet offered any other plausible explanation for why, for example, exit polls are so much less accurate (but consistent in direction of their errors) in regions that recorded their votes on certain kinds of machines overseen by Republic governors, while remaining spot on in other regions; no one has plausibly explained why a black voter in the US is 5 to 10 (average around 9) times as likely to have their ballot be rejected as "spoiled" , no one has totaled up the effects of the fact that voting machines break down or are too few, resulting in long lines, over and over again in multiple consecutive elections, in only some places and not others, and so forth.
Click to expand...

I would think the easiest answer is underfunded voting centers in urban areas, it also allows complete deniability also: it is not technically vote tampering if you simply make it harder to vote for demographics that don't tend to vote for you.

Also it seems Wisconsin recount is more than half way done, although a judge may shut it down today, few irregularities have been found.
http://heavy.com/news/2016/12/wisco...st-new-rules-laws-totals-numbers-vote-status/
 
Wisconsin is one of the states with anomalous exit poll statistics, but not one of the states with the most dubious and suspect kinds of voting machines (paper trail exists, etc). So it's interesting.

The most likely areas of vote trouble have not been recounted, but the most likely areas of exit poll procedural error have been.
 
http://patch.com/michigan/detroit/michigan-vote-recount-half-detroit-ballots-may-not-qualify

In Detroit, the election results cannot be audited specifically in heavily Democratic districts. By law.

A recount capable of discovering the most obvious and discussed possible problems with the voting machines is apparently not going to happen this year either. For some reason, Americans seem to be ok with a vote counting setup that is never audited, and in some cases cannot be audited, in elections that swing on a few thousand votes in predictable districts.
Capracus said:
Just too many obstacles in this current social climate.
Click to expand...
The Republican power establishment seems to be the main source of obstacles. Lawyers and money, not so much "climate".
 
ElectricFetus said:
it is not technically vote tampering if you simply make it harder to vote for demographics that don't tend to vote for you.
Click to expand...
It is illegal to do that, however, intentionally - whatever name you give that kind of rigging, it violates several laws and a couple of Constitutional provisions.

And many of the consequences of underfunding targeted voting districts are directly vote tampering - providing machines that spoil ballots or miscount votes, for example.
 
iceaura said:
audited, and in some cases cannot be audited, in elections that swing on a few thousand votes in predictable districts.

The Republican power establishment seems to be the main source of obstacles. Lawyers and money, not so much "climate".
Click to expand...
Unfortunately in the recount states that's a significant element of the social climate. If the reverse had happen in a blue state, there would've been party opposition there as well.

ElectricFetus said:
So are you happy that we will never know for sure if there was any vote tampering?
Click to expand...
No, mostly frustrated.
 
Capracus said:
If the reverse had happen in a blue state, there would've been party opposition there as well.
Click to expand...
The reverse of what - twenty years of consistent evidence of election tampering, culminating in the election of W, first, and now Trump?

There isn't any "reverse" possible, of this situation. This is a one Party show.
 
There’s never been a situation where a minor candidate has challenged the election result of an obvious winner. No winning party is going to want to jeopardize a vote count in their favor, or welcome a recount when it’s technically not called for.
 
The Wikileaks e-mails, from the DNC, showed how the Democrats were a bunch of two faced scammers. They are now blaming the Russians for hacking the DNC and releasing the truth, since truth got in the way of the deception tactics which could have won them the election. If nobody knew the debate moderator were giving Hillary questions in advance, she could have created the illusion of being even smarter than she is. The rigged system needed to be exposed.

Trump had been under the scrutiny of all national media, from both parties. He did not have the means to hide away. The DNC hacked leveled the playing field since it did not allow the DNC deception to run its course, without reality check, which Trump was also seeing from all sides.

Those who have been turned into zombies by the DNC, and were starting to awaken, were fed another dose of DNC Kool-aid. The recount is over and Trump still won. I hope some the zombies will be able to wake up. However, I also know the con artists are not done, and will try again to keep their zombie army asleep, so they can be directed to feed off the living, who supported Trump.

This is good for our country. The party of illusions and deceptions and its media allies, has lost it grip; free the people.
 
You think Trump and the Republican Party are any better at cyber security than the DNC and Hillary? Not likely. You then have to wonder why no embarrassing hacks against two prominent entities with at least as much dirty laundry.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top