What is the goal of integrating mentally retarded people in normal schools?

shichimenshyo said:
So then you dont want anybody to have to do anything they dont want to?
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In essense, yes. But I'm more of a realist than that and know that we can't vote on every-fuckin'-thing, but there should be some limits to keep people like me from having to pay for mental and physical retards when I didn't have a fuckin' thing to do with the decision to have them or keep them.

I willingly pay school taxes even though I don't have any kids in schools. But I recognize that school is important if kids are going to learn and take over the society at large. Retards ain't never gonna' do that! And they ain't never gonna' be good for anything except be a burden on society.

If you and others want to keep the retards, I think you should do it. Create a trust fund for them and let any and all who want to donate for the retards give money for their care. Done ...everyone is happy, including me!

Baron Max
 
If you and others want to keep the retards, I think you should do it. Create a trust fund for them and let any and all who want to donate for the retards give money for their care. Done ...everyone is happy, including me!

Baron Max
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...I actually agree with you. Well as far as to say that if you want some of your taxpaying money to go towards special needs children you should have the option of giving a portion of it to programs that do those kinds of things.
 
Baron Max said:
No, I don't think so. You fuckin' doo-gooder liberals are always trying to force others to help people and things, why don't you liberals just volunteer for such things yourselves and leave everyone else alone?

Why must you liberals always be trying to force others to do what YOU think are good ideas? Ever wonder about that?

Baron Max
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"you"? I don't really give a f*ck if you're a liberal hater just stick to the topic at hand and avoid dragging it down to a conservative X liberal level.
 
Baron Max said:
So, it would be your idea to spend billions of dollars on this one "kid", without any evidence that it would be successful, ....while millions of inner-city school systems throughout the nation flounder in poverty and poor schooling?
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Exactly, this is an investment: Through billions you spend on this one "kid" you gain precious and priceless knowledge. Then you can solve the similar problems for cheaper, and can develop new perspective for other problems.
 
baftan said:
Exactly, this is an investment: Through billions you spend on this one "kid" you gain precious and priceless knowledge. Then you can solve the similar problems for cheaper, and can develop new perspective for other problems.
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Don't know much about the mechanics of investing, do you? Don't know much about "return on investment", huh? ...LOL!
Do you always invest your money in such risky ventures?
Do you always advice your friends to invest their money in such risky ventures?

Hey, but that's okay ....you'd have gone far in the banking and investment business before it collapsed. :D

Baron Max
 
That's not what we were talking about. We were talking about the investment into children that are in a similar state as the one in your initial example.
 
PsychoTropicPuppy said:
That's not what we were talking about. We were talking about the investment into children that are in a similar state as the one in your initial example.
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Okay, what's the return on that investment? If we invest millions into integrating the retards into our normal schools with the normal kids, what do we get in return for that investment of time, effort and money?

Baron Max
 
Baron Max said:
Okay, what's the return on that investment? If we invest millions into integrating the retards into our normal schools with the normal kids, what do we get in return for that investment of time, effort and money?

Baron Max
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you get (hopefully) people who are more understanding of people with differant conditions, and you get children who are not affraid of kids with conditions, and that to me, has got to be a good thing!

What are we suppose to do Baron, with these kids, lock them away and never let people know they are there? or should we make people aware of them so they can then become more understanding of conditions?

and what if, these kids can go to school and learn like the non affected children?
 
lucifers angel said:
you get (hopefully) people who are more understanding of people with differant conditions, and you get children who are not affraid of kids with conditions, and that to me, has got to be a good thing!
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A good thing? Why? What good does it to to introduce abnormal kids into a classroom? What is the purpose of that disruption?

What good are those kids to the society? In almost all cases, they end up being a burden on society. Hell, we even shoot horses when they break legs, yet we keep retarded kids forever! Is there no logic being used whatsoever?

lucifers angel said:
What are we suppose to do Baron, with these kids, lock them away and never let people know they are there? or should we make people aware of them so they can then become more understanding of conditions?
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Ain't my problem, they ain't my kids! And I think that's an important point. Normal people didn't have any say in having those kids, so why should they have to foot the bill to pay for them?

And normal school taxes are for normal kids educations, NOT for edcuating or caring for the retarded or disabled who require lots of additional care and special facilities.

lucifers angel said:
...and what if, these kids can go to school and learn like the non affected children?
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Well, they can't ....because if they could, without any special care or facilities, then we wouldn't be talking about them here! This thread is about disabled and/or retarded kids that require extra care, additional, special facilities, etc.

Baron Max
 
Baron Max said:
Ain't my problem, they ain't my kids! And I think that's an important point. Normal people didn't have any say in having those kids, so why should they have to foot the bill to pay for them?

And normal school taxes are for normal kids educations, NOT for edcuating or caring for the retarded or disabled who require lots of additional care and special facilities.
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i think this comment has merit because of our current medical science ability.
people have the ability to abort the fetus if it is damaged in some way and to choose not to and then go on to abuse society around them with this child is quite obviousely wrong on about as many levels as you could possibly think of.

but... that does not detract from the ethics that should be in place to protect not only the child born with damage but the other children growing up in the community.

humans compared with a higher level of life form would obviously be considered not only retarded but quite a waste of resources that they use on this planet.

by defining damaged children as being unworthy of resources and a sense of normalcy integration is simply sentencing ones own species to be wiped out by a superior race.

AND... given our constant noise and space junk we are going to be noticed sooner or later and how we treat our own species is going to come back to haunt us in how another species chooses to treat us.

if we act like animals we shall be treated like animals.
 
ripleofdeath said:
...by defining damaged children as being unworthy of resources ...
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I agree. And I never said otherwise. The retards and physically disabled should be given exactly the same level of care using exactly the same amount of money as normal kids. So if the retard needs anything special..... well, tough shit.

ripleofdeath said:
...if we act like animals we shall be treated like animals.
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I agree. But then, we ARE animals!! Or don't you believe in the theory of evolution and all that kinda stuff? Or do you think that evolution has somehow bestowed upon the human animal some special rights above and beyond the normal animals?

Curious, Riple, but if a horse breaks his leg, would you keep that horse alive hanging from a suspension harness for the rest of his life?????

Baron Max
 
Baron Max said:
Curious, Riple, but if a horse breaks his leg, would you keep that horse alive hanging from a suspension harness for the rest of his life????? Baron Max
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question...
why would a horse need to be suspended for its entire life because it has broken its leg ?

it is just a matter of cost which is the same with most non human animals.
as soon as the cost reaches a certain point medical care is retracted and the animal is executed by drug overdose... which is vastly more humane than the treatment many humans get.

are we really getting into an ethics discussion on comparative life/health value to fiscal measure ?

not sure what country you live in RE tax system, but pretty much all western countries have a disproportionate tax burden on single men/women with no kids.
government subsidies go to people with kids and those who have chosen to be careful and follow condom instructions properly and manage their sex life like an adult are punish by unfair biased taxation.

Personally i am sick of being taxed more than another couple of people just because i have decided not to burden the earths over population problem.
Personally i am sick of hearing these same people rattle on about user pays and personal ownership and personal rights when they inflict their children upon me with no consequences for their behaviour(i cant even touch the child legally if the child is committing a crime) and inflict their child on me financially.

i am sick of it !

single people with no kids should get a 5% reduction in income tax and a 5% discount in all utility costs.

if you cant afford to have kids then don't have them !
 
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