92 people died -- I must say this is really a tragedy that hit Norway yesterday. My sincere condolences to the victims. I hope the the reasons and motives behind this amok and the bombings will soon get explained, also whether there really is a connection between the two, and how many more were involved in this act of terror. (I really doubt that it was pulled off by just one person)
Yes. Profiling based on ethnic and religious stereotypes never catches fucked in the head, does it? Yeah, it was starting to look like the discussion pages of FARK around here.:bugeye:
It looks like the disease is spreading. We have seen this kind of thing in the US before. If the inital reports are true, it would appear another right wing Christian goes over the edge.
i think shit like patriotism and nazism is more relevant than christianity when adducing as motivations religion in the west is for the most part kneejerk lipservice
I think Westerners all too often underestimate the implicit cruelty of Christians/Christianity. Don't forget that these (supposedly) God-loving people believe that everyone who doesn't believe like them deserves to burn in hell for all eternity. For many non-Christian people, this belief in the righteousness of eternal damnation is so absurd that they ignore it, unwittingly. It is, however, nonetheless there, and it affects how Christians treat people.
I don't see it that way. Neo-Nazi's have been babbling about pushing for a war against their respective Government's who support multiculturism, immigration, accept refugees (especially coloured and Muslim refugees and migrants), etc.. Have a quick read through sites frequented by these individuals and the central theme is the same. Bring down the Government and re-establish an order that will protect and enhance their white culture. Anyone not white and anyone who is Jewish are to be removed from said culture by means of forced deportation. They were rarely seen as a threat in Norway because as the police had been reporting, they seemed to lack leadership. While in Sweden, neo-nazi's there appeared to be more organised and structured. One of the things that has been found has about Anders Behring Breivik is that he did frequent neo-Nazi forums where what he did was discussed and hoped for. With comments that he would have had access to and discussions discussing and hoping for the war they must apparently wage: THE suspect in the twin attacks that killed at least 92 people in Norway was a member of a Swedish neo-Nazi Internet forum, a group monitoring far-right activity says. "He created a profile in 2009, with a pseudonym that can be traced back to his email address," Mikael Ekman, a researcher with the Stockholm-based Expo foundation, told AFP on Saturday. It was not possible however to determine when the suspect, named by Norwegian media as Anders Behring Breivik, was last active on the forum, which has about 22,000 members from across the region, he said. ------------------------------------------------------ Nordisk's members range from Swedish members of parliament for the far-right Sweden Democrats party to Nazi leaders, the article explained. "What united the members is a critical attitude to the current refugee policy and immigration," it said. Some contributors to the forum have posted comments inciting violence. "Cars parked next to high buildings with fertilising powder + diesel gives a nice effect," one anonymous user said last year on the forum. "The buildings go down like the World Trade Centre." "I think it's a bit too bad that people do not see this is a war we must wage," the contributor, who Ekman said was not Behring Breivik, added. "Those ... in government, who do not live close to or don't have to experience immigrants' threat in their nice neighbourhoods ... in my world there is no dishonest act one can commit against these monsters," the user wrote. http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/norway-suspect-anders-behring-breivik-was-a-member-of-nazi-web-forum/story-e6frfku0-1226100562007 So he went after the Labour Government, the ones he probably sees as enabling migration and destroying his culture. Couple the above with the comment he apparently made on Twitter, he saw himself as taking action.. "One person with a belief is equal to the force of 100 000 who have only interests." Putting into practice what the others only imagined about. And to the twats posting on such forums, he did not commit a crime but merely did what needed to be done to rid themselves of those they perceived as a threat - sending the message if you will. He felt he had the true belief while his compatriots on such forums only had an interest. His lawyer apparently released a statement where he stated Anders felt his actions were 'atrocious but necessary'. Me thinks they took the true threat of neo-Nazi's not seriously enough. The fear now is whether others like him are not going to continue to wage their personal little wars and follow their twisted dreams. There is the desire to say he snapped. I don't think he did. This is the far right neo-Nazi Christian fundamentalist dream. He just lived it out by shooting at children for around 2 hours as they tried to run and hide for their lives. And if he is only charged with terrorism he could be out in 21 years. 21 years!Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Given the dominant PC MC climate of this forum's members (and staff), any direct participation by myself in a discussion about this terrorist act would be like covering my body with tuna salad and jumping into a pond filled with piranha. I will therefore merely obliquely refer any interested readers to my recent blog post on it: Three theories on the Oslo mass-murderer. Anyone here who wishes to post comments on my blog is free to do so, and I won't censor anyone or threaten them with "warnings" (as I have been warned by an administrator here, KGB-style, recently for my content) -- no matter how wrong I think their content is, and no matter how egregiously and maddeningly they insult my intelligence with their politically correct multi-culturalism.
Having just spent the last few minutes of my life, which I unfortunately cannot get back, reading through that blog post of yours Mr Hesperado, and with my children within ear shot of any expletive I may utter, all I could politely come out with was 'Oh dear'. You should be ashamed of yourself. You spent the better part of your post trying to find excuses for the terrorist and then discussed trying to find links to a possible Muslim connection and how the search for such a connection should not end. How can I put this.. Since my children do not read this forum or have access to it.. Mod Note: My sympathies, I assure you, but I am certain you know what goes here, so I won't bother actually saying it.
Prove that allegation with an actual argument using evidence. You can't, because that allegation is simply incorrect. But at the very least you should make the attempt. When making grave accusations like that, the accuser should bring substance -- or not bring the charge at all in the first place.
Does anyone know what building this guy blew up? Was it a government building? The only thing I've heard was it that it was close to the PM's office.
You mean your theories? Theory one was the killer.. The poor "alienated" individual, the fighter against Islam and the evil left.. etc.. And then the kicker was your quote from another blog which you described as being "apt" as an explanation.. or more to the point, as an excuse: "...perhaps he's one of those extremely "pessimistic conservatives." You say "his fellow Norwegians." Perhaps to him they weren't his people anymore. Since the West is declining and veering towards collapse, why not hasten the decline? It's similar to Roissy going after all of the bar skanks and "gaming" low-quality women and sluts instead of persevering in goodness despite all of the incredible troubles around us. Perhaps he sees those young people and teenagers as too late to save or no longer his people. How could they be "his people" if they continually believe in concepts like multiculturalism, diversity and whatnot? How could "his fellow Norwegians" do this to their own country? To him perhaps they were traitors. What he did was terrible but it's not hard to understand what would lead to this monstrous act." And you seriously believe I am incorrect? Theory two amounting to his apparently being mentally unstable and being driven to this by "how slowly the West is taking to wake up to the problem of Islam, couldn't take it anymore and had this outburst of mass-murder.".. And then you discuss what the problem is with this theory.. The first of which being that he targeted non-Muslims and that he should in theory have attacked a Mosque or a Muslim community instead for theory two to apply. The second problem you identified was that he would be further victimised by what you deem the "PC MC" crowd if he did target just Muslims. Theory three amounted to his being a possible Muslim plant and how the search must continue to make sure the "left" government is not hiding such a plot. How can I put this politely? Go away. Slither back to whatever rock you slithered out from and remain there for eternity.
Ok...thanks Bell. Has it been confirmed that this guy was exclusively involved in both the bombing and the shootings?
He has been charged with both. The news report states he is being very cooperative and open with the police. It all points to him at the moment. Apparently there may be a second shooter on the island and apparently the police are investigating, but yes, he is the prime suspect and one accused of both attacks at present. He distracts the police with the bomb in Oslo before heading to the island and having a couple of hours to himself shooting defenseless children and teenagers. Unfortunately if he is only charged with terrorism, he could apparently be out in 21 years.
84 fucking kids...It just boggles my mind. I haven't heard that there was any kids shot, and only injured...which to me, suggests he "finished off" anyone that didn't die immediately. It goes way beyond political beliefs...these kids had nothing to do with politics. It just makes me weep. Severe mental illness. From what I understand..after the 21 years, there is something like a parole board that can put him back in jail for another 5 years...and another 5 years, and so on. Maybe Sock puppet path can confirm that.
AFAIK that's correct. The Norwegian penal system is based on rehabilitation and not punishment, so if they feel that after 21 years he's not rehabilitated they'll keep him locked up. My bet is they just might.
The children were members of the Labour Youth Movement - ie the youth wing of the Government. Like the junior version of the party. This was a camp, where children and teenagers become involved and engaged, discuss issues, try to find solutions and I think most political sectors have them. In this terrorist's eyes and those who believe as he does or sympathises as he does, they were political individuals. Which is obscene. The survivors did say that he would check to see if those on the ground were dead or not and would shoot again if he suspected they were alive. The man accused of a massacre at a youth camp in Norway and a bombing in the capital, Oslo, has admitted responsibility, his lawyer says. Anders Behring Breivik, 32, described his actions as "gruesome but necessary", and said he would explain himself at a court hearing on Monday. ------------------------------------------------ "He thought it was gruesome having to commit these acts, but in his head they were necessary," Mr Breivik's lawyer Geir Lippestad told Norwegian media. He added that the actions had been planned for some time. Mr Breivik has been charged with committing acts of terrorism, and is due to appear in court on Monday when judges will decide whether he should be detained as the investigation continues. The suspect is reported to have had links with right-wing extremists. Still pictures of him, wearing a wetsuit and carrying an automatic weapon, appeared in a 12-minute anti-Muslim video called Knights Templar 2083, which appeared briefly on YouTube. A 1,500-page document written in English and said to be by Mr Breivik - posted under the pseudonym of Andrew Berwick -was also put online hours before the attacks, suggesting they had been years in the planning. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14265094
My first wife was a Norwegian school teacher and I have been to Oslo four or five times. In general, as reflected in their high tax rates supporting many social services, including high quality education for all, Norwegians care for each other. I cannot understand how even an insane Norwegian could do this. Currently “facts” I know seem to indicate that political ideology was a large factor in the motive for this terrible act by a Norwegian – killing 92 of his fellow Norwegians. This, plus the current “Party First” & country second if at all, thinking on the debt and budget ceiling by our “representatives” in government is making me think I should give anarchism a second look.
(Quoted areas from Hesperado's blog) I could not read the whole thing...but I saw this... Agreed Hesperado, that sets off a red flag with me, because I find it incredibly hard to understand. My politics are far left but I made the decision that I would not resort to violence to bring my ideals about. That I live in a democracy and I have to accept the will of the majority, like or no. Have you accepted that? That's not your underwear peeping out, that's the mindset of someone who might be evolving the capacity of doing something like this himself. Someone who would conceivably gun down those whom he scapegoats and say that the leftists/multiculturalists "made him" take those actions. WHO AND WHAT ARE YOU? You see, folks, one of the few bennies of being a PTSD-bearing person, is that I am tuned to threats. My judgment...this guy might be a windbag, but he's evincing...not necessarily the internet-kind of threat (Identity outing, cyberstalking) here..not to us.... I think this man here may end up as the lead-in story on the evening news. People like this guy may actually be-a potential and potentially worsening threat- are why I want the shiny, happy semiauto AK47 and the shotgun.
