Trees are NOT alive.

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John99 said:
Life and alive have separate meanings, that is why there are two words to describe them. Of course they qualify as something living.
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One's a noun, the other's an adjective (in fact an adjectival form of the word "life").
That's why they are two words.
 
John99 said:
Life and alive have separate meanings, that is why there are two words to describe them. Of course they qualify as something living.
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Your argument above is very poor.

Life is a noun.
Alive is an adjective.

Anything considered alive is a form of life.

edit: oh, you beat me to it Oli.
 
John99 said:
A tree is closer to a snowflake than it is to a mountain lion.
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Trees turn their leaves to the Sun, they grow, water and minerals circulate through them in a complex circulatory system, their respiratory system exchanges gases from their circulatory system with those in the air.

I suspect you have a primitive notion of a tree as a solid object without internal structure or differentiation, when in fact they are far more akin to mountain lions, in that regard.
 
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John99 said:
Oli and simon,
Notice where it has adj. in the box.
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Somewhat dishonest of you since the FIRST definition of the word from YOUR source is... noun.
With 20 definitions as opposed to the mere 4 as an adjective.
 
Pandaemoni, all that is learned by the third grade. All i am saying is that to be be truly alive there needs to be added components present that trees do not posses.

Take a look what i have placed in order of consciousness:

rock (0)
tree (0)
bug (1)
fish (2)
human (3)

Of course that is simplistic but just used as for illustrative purposes.
 
John99 said:
Oli and simon,

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/life

Notice where it has adj. in the box.

Main Entry:
life
Function:
adjective
Date:
13th century

1 : of or relating to animate being 2 : lifelong <a life member> 3 : using a living model <a life class> 4 : of, relating to, or provided by life insurance <a life policy>
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Yes, 'life' can be used as an adjective BEFORE nouns. Alive is used as a predicate adjective which 'life' cannot be.

Your theory is not backed up by anyone. Language is a communal process and people are not going to agree that this thing is a form of life but not alive.

You are becoming a troll.
 
Oli said:
Somewhat dishonest of you since the FIRST definition of the word from YOUR source is... noun.
With 20 definitions as opposed to the mere 4 as an adjective.
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It is also a different kind of adjective when it is used as an adjective. It is a noun that became an adjective, used to modify nouns by coming right before them.
 
Oli said:
Somewhat dishonest of you since the FIRST definition of the word from YOUR source is... noun.
With 20 definitions as opposed to the mere 4 as an adjective.
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Doesnt matter if there are four or twenty. My contention is that Life and Alive are two different things.

Enmos said:
What about flowers John, and mushrooms ?
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Same as trees my man.

Simon, why are you calling me a troll?:mad:
 
John, are you saying that a tree isn't a plant? Are you saying that a tree isn't an organism?
 
Oh, lol, what a funny thread :D

John, please take a look at this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organism

In biology, an organism is an individual living system (such as animal, plant, fungus, or micro-organism). In at least some form, all organisms are capable of reacting to stimuli, reproduction, growth and maintenance as a stable whole (after FAO[1]). An organism may be unicellular or made up, as in humans, of many billions of cells grouped into specialized tissues and organs. The phrase complex organism describes any organism with more than one cell.
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A life is characterized by growth and reproduction ability. If you put seed on appropriate soil condition, it grows...!
 
John99 said:
Pandaemoni, all that is learned by the third grade. All i am saying is that to be be truly alive there needs to be added components present that trees do not posses.

Take a look what i have placed in order of consciousness:

rock (0)
tree (0)
bug (1)
fish (2)
human (3)

Of course that is simplistic but just used as for illustrative purposes.
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Your personal beliefs have nothing to do with the definition of alive, which for some reason, you refuse to understand. Again, the term 'alive' is not restricted to a state of consciousness, John, nor is restricted to humans.
 
John99 said:
Pandaemoni, all that is learned by the third grade. All i am saying is that to be be truly alive there needs to be added components present that trees do not posses.

Take a look what i have placed in order of consciousness:

rock (0)
tree (0)
bug (1)
fish (2)
human (3)

Of course that is simplistic but just used as for illustrative purposes.
Click to expand...

The reason there are two different words for "life" and "alive" is that one is a noun and the other the adjective. Even Merriam-Webster notes that "alive" comes from the Middle English "on life". Your argument is akin to saying that things that are "on fire" are not covered in fire, because that's why we have different terms "on fire" and "fire."

As for consciousness, trees do react to the environment in ways that rocks do not, and have a more complex system enabling them to react than you are giving them credit for. Granted that they are not "animals" and so do not react with the speed that animals do, but that's not the test. Apparently things are alive only if John99 sees them reacting on a time scale John 99 considers acceptably fast. Sorry, coma patients, but you're not alive either.

Face it, you have your own special definition of "alive" and it does not actually match what anyone else in the world thinks that word means.
 
John99 said:
Doesnt matter if there are four or twenty. My contention is that Life and Alive are two different things.
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Two different words that are ALWAYS applicable to some members of any other noun.

Some humans are alive.
Humans are a form of life.

Some trees are alive.
Trees are a form of life.

That tree is NOW dead. It was struck by lightning. Before that it was alive. It was a member of the set of plants which are forms of life.

Give us a break and admit he obviousness of this.

Simon, why are you calling me a troll?:mad:
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I think you know why. I think you know on some level that you are now simply trying to win.
 
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