-The Spirit of Athens-

[%BlueSoulRobot%]

For the purpose of this thought experiment:
We will suppose that ancient Greek ships are composed of exactly 1000 cleverly interlocking wooden planks.

The story:
The Spirit of Athens is composed of 1000 sound and seaworthy oak planks. One day, however, its owner - Theseus by name - is rather taken by the trim cut figure of his friend's ship, made entirely of teak.

"I'd like to have teak ship myself," he thinks, and being a man of action, off to Ships-R-Us he sails. Parking the Spirit of Athens in Dock A as instructed, he tells the shipwright what he wants his ship entirely renovated with teak planks.
"Not to worry," says the shipwright, "My crack crew can get the job done in 1000t minutes. Come back after that."

But when Theseus had gone, the wily shipwright thinks to himself, "Hmm. Those are mighty good oak planks. There's no point in letting them go to waste." With this thought in mind, then, he instructs his crew that the oak planks which they are replacing with teak planks in dry-dock A should be reassembled, plank for plank, in dry-dock B, in the exact replica of the Spirit of Athens.

And so it comes to pass that at the end of 1000t minutes, 2 ships exist - one in Dock A (Ship X - renovated one), and the one in Dock B (Ship Y - made of discarded oak planks).

The question is, which is the Spirit of Athens?

 

[Votorx]

It's all in the eyes of the beholder. Theseus calls his ship the Spirit of Athens because that is how he defines his ship. Forever, no matter what happens to his shipe, whether or not it crashes, explodes, it is remodeled etc etc, he will always call it the Spirit of Athens. Other's as well will call it the Spirit of Athens, but, in reality it is just a ship made out of teak planks. If the shipwright decided to make the shipe he has created the Spirit of Athens as well, then that is what he would call it. It doesn't neceserilly mean that there are 2 spirit of athens since other people may call it different names or refer it with other names. All it is is a title and can be changed as easily as a 15 year old can inhale and exhale. Now if the question had been, "What is the original ship" Then i would have to say Ship Y.

 

[Lemming3k]

i think the 1st one is a modified spirit of athens(still making it the spirit of athens) and the 2nd one is the original spirit of athens, its up to the individual to decide if you call it the spirit of athens or not.

 

[patty-rick]

Spirit of athens is just a name therefore the shipwright can be the spirit of the athens if his friends down at the local bar want to call him that...., define what the name infers if we are to tackle this problem from another angle

 

[draqon]

They are both spirit of Athens.

 

[cosmictraveler]

Neither because when they remove anything from a ship its "spirit" goes along with it.

 

[invert_nexus]

The original ship is actually the Ship of Theseus. Therefore, it must be the ship recreated from the original oak planks which is the Spirit of Athens.

 

[maxg]

The purpose of naming a ship is to give an dominion over it. It's like naming a nation. There is more to a nation than the land which it occupies (e.g., there are American Indian nations that no longer occupy the land on which they originated) & the same is true of the ship. The ship which Theseus commands & which he has chosen to call "The Spirit of Athens" (i.e., X) is the "real" (in a legal and linguistic sense) "Spirit of Athens."

 

[Klippymitch]

The spirit of Athens was taken apart. The two ships that were built by using the parts of the Spirit of Athens can not be the Spirit of Athens but rather one of the descendants of the Spirit of Athens.

Other than that the name of the ship is what you call it.

 

[madanthonywayne]

To me, identity requires a continuity. The Spirit of Athens ship pulled in, and as each plank was replaced, the new plank became part of the Spirit of Athens. So at the end, even though the planks had been completely replaced, it was still the Spirit of Athens.

The same applies to human beings. Over time, practically every cell in our body is replaced by a new cell. Does that mean you're a different person? No.