you must forgive me i have not been back for a while and had to make a new account as i dont remember the old one login
Can't you just ask it to send you a new temporary password via your email account?
That there may be larger societies in Trek...? I thought it was rather straight forward.
The tyranids are responsible for the withdrawal of the damocles crusade.
And yet the Damocles Crusade didn't end after five days, did it?
How do you know they are smaller than the federation?
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100706070328/warhammer40k/images/f/f0/Tauspace400.jpg
From where I'm standing, it only looks like the Tau have a few systems. It sure as hell isn't 150 core worlds, a thousand (plus) colony worlds, and 8,000 light years of territory.
They are big fleets of millions and billions of orks with strong fleets. If 2000 ork ships had attacked earth instead of a borg cube it would have been orkified by now!
Except that the Orks don't tend to gather in fleets that massive--not unless it's a really, really big Waaagh! Most invasions from what I've seen tend to involve only a few dozen ships. A Waagh of 2,000 ork ships would require time to build up. And Starfleet would probably hold a significant technological advantage over the orks.
That is why i said they invade with smaller fleet than the tyranids
It wasn't a Borg invasion. That's what you're missing. It's more akin to probing. The Borg seemed to have some interest in testing certain cultures so they can find new means of adaption. We've been told that when the Borg do invade, their fleet numbers in the hundreds to thousands of ships--not one single ship.
Are you saying that torpeods will just force through exploding spore screens
Depends on how powerful the explosion is. The shields on torpedoes pretty much render immune to enemy phasers throughout the franchise. If the yield of the explosion is powerful enough, then sure, it could cause the torpedo to detonate prematurely. The difference is that 40k spore screens stop torpedoes that aren't shielded and probably don't have all that thick armor. Or energy weapons that can be blocked by throwing physical matter in the way.
and ignore psychic energy strikes?
Since when do they protect themselves with psychic energy?
Tyranids follow real space from the outskirts of star systems. They use wapr travel or compressed space corridors up until then. I dont know which example of ST sensros you are using as na example for the planet sensor array to show that this could happen
1) From what I recall, they use some sort of space folding thing. Whichever the case is, they are physically in space, not some parallel dimension.
2) Star Trek ships can typically detect all life forms. The only exception was the Borg (at first), who were in all likelyhood blocking their scans or their cybernetic hardware confused the sensors.
3) Star Trek ships can easily detect all life on a planet just by orbiting it, as per the Survivors:
RIKER: Helm, put us in high equatorial orbit. Scan for survivors.
CRUSHER: Survivors? Down there?
DATA: Sensors are scanning ninety degrees of longitude as we orbit. I am detecting no bodies of water, no vegetation, no artificial structures.
WORF: Life form readings are negative.
TROI: Could the colonists have escaped?
DATA: That is highly unlikely. Rana Four possessed no interstellar spacecraft.
RIKER: Who would cause devastation on that order?
WESLEY: Hold it. Captain, I've got something here. Thirty seven degrees north and sixty two degrees east. It's a structure.
PICARD: Life?
WORF: Two life forms, possibly human.
Now, this is just one ship. A planet is going to have multiple orbiting satellites, some ranging from from subspace transceivers to planetary sensors designed to observe the area around them. And Starfleet ships themselves can scan light years at a time searching for a single starship. While planetary bodies and so forth would indeed make immediate detection of a tyranid craft difficult, it probably be detected long before it entered a planet's atmosphere.
if tyranid spores are falling on a planet the most likely warning sign is the fleet of tyranid ships or tectonic activity
Uh, no. Tyranids send scouts head of their main fleet to search for planets rich in food. When one is found, they lock onto system and immediately travel towards it. In some cases, Tyranid cults form on the planet and create psychic beacons that lure the fleet like a moth to a flame.
ST ships do not do as you describe from the ST I watched. They fight in big clumps or really close. So I dont know about greater combat range! How does the border make a difference since they can not stop the tyranids from flying past it/ sometimes they might not but I dont see it often.
...It's called TV. American (and really most) sci-fi are shown at closer ranges because otherwise you wouldn't be able to see the ships fighting. They'd be little specs at even relatively close distances, absolutely invisible at the ranges that ships are actually capable of engaging at. That's not to say that they don't engage at closer ranges or never try to close the gap (shorter range = shorter reaction time), but they are very much capable of longer ranges.
I dont know what agreesive technolgy means but anything could easily destroy a tyranid fleet if they have enough time so I don't know how that helps.
Biogenic weapons are illegal in Star Trek, at least in the Alpha-Beta Quadrant area. They literally have weapons that instantly destroy all organic matter in seconds on a planetary scale from the Klingons to the Romulans. Even Starfleet's Section 31 managed to whip up a virus that is so malicious that it infected a species that can literally shapeshift into liquid, solids, gases, plasma, and photons and was slowly killing them. Compared to the difficulty of infecting the Tyranids--which is that a virus that is based off the original genes of the fleet queen, is enough to ensure total destruction against that strain of Tyranid.
If they do use these plamsa bombs do you know that they will work in space without an atmosphere to propogate through.
There's no reason why they shouldn't. It's plasma. But I wasn't really thinking of that weapon. Starfleet, or rather, Voyager, developed a biometric warhead based on the Borg's nanoprobes. The species they used it against, called Species 8472 by the Borg, were so resistant to assimilation, that their cells instantly destroyed any sort of nanoprobes that attempted to assimilate them. Their ships were so powerful that even a Borg cube couldn't destroy one--in fact, it's implied that perhaps even a single bioship was able to destroy about a dozen Borg cubes without taking any significant damage.
Voyager's modified Borg nanoprobes allowed the probes to penetrate the cells of the bioships long enough for them to detonate; the nanoprobes literally destroyed them on the cellular level. These nanoprobes? They were delivered through torpedoes with matter-antimatter warheads as well as ship phasers, which as far as DET is concerned, kicks up into the megawatt range, perhaps even the gigawatt.
Also tyranids are biological but they are really tough and use inorganic compounds for armour.
...Since when? Last I checked, those armored bits are just really strong shells. Which is fine, but they're still organic.
The codex still describes the gifts of technology of the ctan and you cant say its a canonical error unless someone from gw agrees
Which Codex? The latest codex pretty much rewrote a great deal of Necron back history and technological capability.
If it was a torch ship then it wouldnt have been able to ravage a sector. A sector is larger than a single system and can comproise hundreds of star systems. If it is a single ship then it is a single ship the size of a planet so its more than big enough to be dangerous! Necron ships and units also use interspatial corridors to quickly move things across the galaxy so the World Engine or any ships that had to use ftl could bring things with them
also it is not a singular special ship. There is more than one world engine.
What is the source?
I spoke about this before and they do have the webway?
Sometimes.
Necron ships can only move at interstellar distances through the webway, but only in certain parts of the webway and such connections are always small, since the Webway apparently actively resists them.
Or the necrons could quickly learn to penetrate their shielding. The necrons are renowned for their tech solutions
Assuming they can monitor the Borg's shield frequency...sure? But it's not like that'd do them a world of good. As soon as they try it, the Borg can adapt by creating a scattering field to block any sort of transporter in or out (I would actually like you to quantify this ability of theirs).
The necrons are a bit deadlier.
Not really, no. Perhaps in their peak time, yes, but the grandest technological feat they have belongs to a small cult that has a device that can destroy any star they choose--but are too afraid to use it because of how delicate it is and how much work it would require to maintain or restore balance if it were used.
Necron nanotechnology aggressively destroys enemy tech that attacks it. Even magic daemon axes are destroyed. An entire necron lord can assemble himself from nano-scarabs, and their nano tech can repair their own hardware in minutes and seconds as well.
Source?
What energy damping field has been used by the borg to do something like that? Also necron nano-tech will self destruct the necrons if required.
Some Borg drones used it to foil Harry Kim's phaser and effectively neutralize the bombs he was planting throughout the ship.
Yes they use wave attacks. But as you agree they don't just do this. As you were talking about them being smart with the other fellow.
Except they sort of do. Yes, they also try sneaking into the city, or having a few tyranid breeds stir up trouble within the city, and occasionally they pulled a quick one on their enemies by taking advantage of terrain that the enemy didn't consider--but throughout it all, their main form of attack was brutally beating on the front door with wave after wave after wave.
It will not end like warriors of ultramar i dont think a federation away team would survive inside a tyranid ship
The full run the Space Marines ran through? No. Beaming into the main chamber with four times as many guys from a cloaked ship, stunning/killing/vaporizing all enemy targets, and dealing with the Queen in record time? Yeah, they could do that.
If the federation cities dont have good enough defences and i doubt most federation cities have extensive defensive fortifications then the tyranids will drop on the city as well
Except even a minor colony on the edge of Klingon-Federation space had a shield protecting a small colony on the planet even after the Klingons took orbit and began to conquer specific colonies on the planet. At best said colony was a town or a small city.
starfleet will be occupied by being outnumbered by hordes of tyranid spaceships
How do you figure? It takes Tyranid fleets ays to move from the outer point of the system to the inner point, again, something we saw in Warriors of Ultramar. Starfleet, if it really needs to, has been known to cross the distance between Earth and Jupiter in half an hour at high impulse speeds. At their more typical velocities, they can still cross a system in hours.
when do star trek cities have nuclear grenade artillery as defences, is that from a novel?
It's from The Original Series. Kirk uses a mortar launcher to fire at some Gorns about a kilometer or so away. They all duck and cover and shortly after the explosion, a light breeze washes over them.
The same for the phaser banks
A Phaser II--that little hand phaser? According to the TM, it has a DET output of .01 MWs at its highest setting. Thanks to NDF, that's enough to blow up 3,900 metric tons of rock. To give you a hint; most small navy ships weigh in at 4,000 metric tons. And that's just the hand phaser. Imagine if they doubled that energy output. Imagine if they raised it to .1 MWs rather than just .01MWs.
and the nids can burrow really well, so they could bypass a shield if they have to do.
1) Star Trek sensors can read the temperature of a planet's core. Finding the Tyranids isn't going to be hard.
2) They can beam them back out.
3) Failing #2, they can beam bombs in.
But i dont think they do since federation cities dont have shields in general
Deep Space Nine disagrees.
no. Warriors of ultramar is hive fleet leviathan and Behemoth is the most straight forward. In Warriors the tyranids infiltrated gargoyle brood mothers and use imperial tactics against them several times. "swarm adapt and terrorise" is actually a very good tactic as well. And you have missed the Lictor infiltrating and trying to kill Kryptman.
And that's still remarkably primitive compared to what would happen in a Trek engagement. That army wouldn't even reach the edge of the force field thanks to multiple torpedo launchers, mortar launchers, and small phaser banks. The army would literally be reduced to a smoldering ruin.
You have to be able to do something about the movements of the enemy and know what is going on. You dont need to be invisible when encircling and misdirecting.
Yeah, but being able to hide your units is rather helpful in accomplishing that. If this were a Starfleet colony, there wouldn't be an issue of whether or not one wing of Tyranids might flank your or join up with another. You can nuke both of them from
halfway across the planet.
Why would implanting trek people with parasites not work?
Because transporters can filter out anything that doesn't bind to a life form on a molecular level. And even then, they still have options.
Trek people are not all capable of ignoring parasites and surgically removing them or beaming them out would use resources and would only work on people not immediately killed or killed before they are cured if they can be.
1) Transporters in the 24th century are so common that cadets can beam home for supper and back again. Even starships have multiple transporters ranging from units designed to move large cargo bulk to beaming people down. Later they even began learning to beam hundreds of people in the span of minutes. Hell, by Star Trek Nemesis, they have one-off transporter prototype devices that is smaller than most pins.
2) If the person is dead, they can still vaporize the body to prevent it from being used by the Tyranids.
I dont know what you are talking about with the cult leaders fleeting the hive fleet since they rise up and fight and welcome the tyranids with open arms. Your comment about accepted back is confusing as the tyranids consume and recylce their own troops after each attack and tyranid monsters are reincarnated in new bodies
Again, from what I've gathered, it depends on the cult leaders. Some of them leave the planet before the Tyranids arrive and others are simply not assimilated back into the tyranid bio-pool for whatever reason. Probably either because they're considered impure, diseased, or simply so they can go out and find more planets to draw the hive-fleet too.
This is a confusing statement. High intelligence is an evolved trait. Tyranids control their evolution. If they evolve the ability to perform a task, then they are deliberately planning for their creatures to perform in this fashion.
Apologies; what I am saying is that although there are certain breeds of Tyranids that do indeed show intelligence, maybe even a sense of individuality, these are rare and subservient to the instinctual nature of the Tyranids. Commanders for example, show cunning, not true intelligence. The fact that they can see things on a much grander scheme is also useful, like a dog looking down on ants and seeing what they're doing and responding to it. However, it is doubtful that the Tyranid Hive Mind will ever act with the same sort of intelligence that is more common with humanoid species.
I think you are misunderstanding me. I dont want to get around how tyranids use mass wave attacks because it is not the only thing they do, so why would I?.
...Because anyone with any concept of modern tactics would never, ever do anything the Tyranids do?
The horde of monsters will show up in phaser range after gassing, shooting and poisoning the people with the phasers.
...How? Again, they're behind a shielded wall and their weapons can fire out while the Tyranids cannot fire in. Phaser banks will blast large chunks of the swarm into chunky salsa, close range phaser banks will vaporize scores of them, and a single tactical nuke could destroy an entire army of them. And that's before they somehow find a way to try and penetrate the colony's shields.
Or they will tunnel underneath them.
Which will easily be detected by local sensors thanks to the geological instability it will cause. They then just beam the tyranids out or simply drop bombs in. Even if this works once or twice, once the secret is out that the Tyranids will use this method, Starfleet will simply start watching for the tactic.
Wide beam will not stop them being shot .
That's what the shield is for.
Based on them not having any? You are saying that shields mean that nids will not win a war of attrition in reply to the other gentleman. I was pointing out your claims about shields dont seem right
And what is your counter argument? A Starfleet science outpost had a small shield around it and some ruins in TNG's Gambit. DS9's Nor The Battle To The Strong had a shield over a single settlement on a border colony with shields that held off the Klingons for a few days despite constant attacks. Kirk didn't find it unreasonable to expect that a planetoid with a large, glorified library colony would have a shield to protect it. At least two penal colonies in TOS also had shields, one of which encompassed
the entire planet. Your limp response of "this doesn't seem right" doesn't hold out in weight of actual evidence.
The hive city of verghast had an energy shield as did the other hive cities on the planet verghast.
The fortress of the Silver skulls has a shield
In Blood reaver the marines errant have a shielded fortress
void shields are described in the planetstrike book as being used on many installations
Even the orks can put up a power field around a city in Grey hunter
the hive city in Blood Gorgons has interlocking multiple layers of void shields
even a penal colony in last chancers has a void shield or a prison in What price victory.
In eisenhorn the private residence of a rich noble has a spherical void shield and individual void shields are used to imprison psykers.
A pity that technology doesn't seem to be around when the Tyranis come to play. Or during most planetary invasions. You know, like 80% of them? Like when Orks invade? Or Necrons? Or Tyranids? Or Chaos? These seems to be more along the lines of exceptions or important places having shields. They don't appear to be available to the two planets we saw in Warriors of Ultramar. Were they even in play during the invasion of Ultramar itself?
The genesis device was using unstable protomatter nobody said it was because khan messed it up.
Yeah, one science officer said this. And yet despite her objections in regards to the actual make-up of the device, it was shown to have solid results when used properly in the first cave-test that we saw back in Wrath of Khan. Where as the Genesis planet was created in a nebula after some madman with a death wish detonated it like a bomb. Let's see, how was that device supposed to be used again? Oh, that's right. It was supposed to be released on a planet and reshape the planet's surface, not make an entirely new planet out of a nebula.
Was that said to be genesis device?
Writers specifically stated that he had continued in the steps of the Genesis project. All of his projects were based on building on teraforming and he used protomatter (key ingredient remember) to reignite the star.
In one possible future the eldar deploy weapons of apocalyptic power and destroy the iom they hit above their weight and the eldar could destroy the federation.
How did they destroy the IoM? Destroying the Emperor's Golden Throne would effectively doom the IoM as a single entity.
As I have said elsewhere, you are mistaken about the state of necrons. Also as i said before the necrons dont need to have more than one ship as a pathfinder due to their interstellar portal tech built into ships and units.
Are you saying they can teleport their ships across space or simply soldiers and units?
And the moving planet isn't alone
And the quote for this would be...?
Orks are described as numbering more than humans. They also occupy a greater portion of the galaxy than the imperium which does not control or occupy everything in each region it claims.
Ork waaaghs have numbers in the millions and billions, this would be a potent threat to any trek nation.
The difference is that Starfleet can come up with a means of destroying their entire race and their entire means of reporduction to the point where the orks are no longer a threat. The Imperium is rather brute force in how it tends to respond to problems.
The q did not stop Q when he was having all his own fun,
Except when they did in Deja Q. They were so upset with him that they stripped him of his powers and told him to choose a mortal form to live out the rest of his meager existence as. He was effectively given a death sentence, given how immortal a Q is.
and they did not stop they guy who killed the husnock
So what? What makes you think they cared? Q put humanity on trial for their past sins and apparently the Husnock were vicious and aggressive even as an interstellar species. That one god-like being killed off their entire race in a fit of rage and bitterly regrets it means what?
When did the Q stop anyone who wasn't Q from being godlike ? Also, I am not talking about gods doing everything. You jumped to them without reason.
True Q. Q specifically says that they were going to judge a young woman who was both Human and Q to determine if she was Q enough to become part of the Continuum. If she was--then she got to join. If she wasn't, they'd execute her because she was too dangerous to leave alone. In order to remain as a human and lead a human life, she would have to of lived without using her powers. It was the same thing her parents agreed to, failed, and were later executed by the Q for breaking their promise (we don't know what they did).
It seems to me that they take it pretty seriously. Simply because they do not stop all god-like beings from acting does not mean that they have shirked their responsibility. Given what Chaos is and how it acts, the Q are not going to want Chaos stepping into their universe at all.