Star Trek: Nemesis
- Thread starter Pollux V
- Start date
I saw the movie and really liked it too. In fact i was in a daze afterwards for a few hours. It was the best Star Trek movie i've seen, and i would even put it in my top category of favorite Star Trek episodes, along with others such as most Q episodes and when Picard played the flute. I would give Nemesis a 9/10 -- there were a few illogical things that i noticed, though they didn't detract from my overall enjoyment of the movie.
SPOILERS SPOILERS
SPOILERS SPOILERS
Like after the Enterprise had rammed into the other ship, and the other ship backed away. Given the nature of things in outer space, i would think that the other ship would have simply pulled the Enterprise along with it instead of ripping apart from it as if the Enterprise was somehow being held in place by something.
Or how Riker yelled "Cover me!" to Worf and immediately ran straight out into the open and jumped into the hole after the telepathic alien dude, that seemed kinda hokey to me, a stupid foolish risk made to look cool. I can see Riker doing something that foolish but i think he should have taken a phaser blast for it as he ran towards the hole.
LOL
As always i'm amazed at how bad the enemy foot soldiers are at aiming their weapons. These are the soldiers that were referred to as terrifying and formidable when the Enterprise senior staff were sitting around their conference table discussing them. And yet they fire and hit the ceiling and floor more times than not at point blank range. This goes for stormtroopers in the Star Wars movies as well as in Star Trek.
There was something else too that isn't coming to mind at the moment. Maybe it was how quickly Data was able to get the cargo bay door open on the alien ship, considering the no doubt astronomical mathematical odds of him entering the right combination of glyphs within that brief period of time.
But again, overall, i thought the movie was fuckin' awesome. I came away from it thinking, "Now THAT'S the way a Star Trek movie ought to be..."
SPOILERS SPOILERS
SPOILERS SPOILERS
Like after the Enterprise had rammed into the other ship, and the other ship backed away. Given the nature of things in outer space, i would think that the other ship would have simply pulled the Enterprise along with it instead of ripping apart from it as if the Enterprise was somehow being held in place by something.
Or how Riker yelled "Cover me!" to Worf and immediately ran straight out into the open and jumped into the hole after the telepathic alien dude, that seemed kinda hokey to me, a stupid foolish risk made to look cool. I can see Riker doing something that foolish but i think he should have taken a phaser blast for it as he ran towards the hole.
LOLAs always i'm amazed at how bad the enemy foot soldiers are at aiming their weapons.
These are the soldiers that were referred to as terrifying and formidable when the Enterprise senior staff were sitting around their conference table discussing them. And yet they fire and hit the ceiling and floor more times than not at point blank range. This goes for stormtroopers in the Star Wars movies as well as in Star Trek.There was something else too that isn't coming to mind at the moment. Maybe it was how quickly Data was able to get the cargo bay door open on the alien ship, considering the no doubt astronomical mathematical odds of him entering the right combination of glyphs within that brief period of time.
But again, overall, i thought the movie was fuckin' awesome. I came away from it thinking, "Now THAT'S the way a Star Trek movie ought to be..."
From Imdb.com:
Patrick Stewart said Tuesday that whether or not Paramount decides to produce another Star Trek movie, he will not return as Captain Jean-Luc Picard. Speaking to reporters at the London premiere of Star Trek: Nemesis Tuesday night, Stewart said, "You never want to outstay your welcome. Just like an athlete, it's horrible to go on when the best is over." Although the Nemesis episode opened to mixed reviews, Stewart maintained that it was the best Star Trek movie he had ever done. "I could think of no better way to bow out," he said.
Patrick Stewart said Tuesday that whether or not Paramount decides to produce another Star Trek movie, he will not return as Captain Jean-Luc Picard. Speaking to reporters at the London premiere of Star Trek: Nemesis Tuesday night, Stewart said, "You never want to outstay your welcome. Just like an athlete, it's horrible to go on when the best is over." Although the Nemesis episode opened to mixed reviews, Stewart maintained that it was the best Star Trek movie he had ever done. "I could think of no better way to bow out," he said.
CounslerCoffee
Registered Senior Member
Lykan you wouldnt happen to have an article link for that would you? I trust what your saying is the truth, I just want to read it for myself.
SPOILERS SPOILERS
SPOILERS SPOILERS
The dune buggies part did seem a little far-fetched to me. Unless they were aware of many details regarding the prevailing society on the planet and created it to try and blend in so that if they were seen by the inhabitants while they were moving around on the planet, their culture wouldn't be affected by seeing a spaceship flying around. (Prime Directive and all...)
SPOILERS SPOILERS
The dune buggies part did seem a little far-fetched to me. Unless they were aware of many details regarding the prevailing society on the planet and created it to try and blend in so that if they were seen by the inhabitants while they were moving around on the planet, their culture wouldn't be affected by seeing a spaceship flying around. (Prime Directive and all...)
Do androids eat cheesecake? 'cause I'm gonna have to go ahead and agree with the whole "gross" statement. Is there some logical reason that he would recieve additional chins in an upgrade? Anyway, the movie was doubleplus ungood. I think a DS9 movie is overdue, but they should leave the whole franchise alone if they're gonna make tripe like THIS.
Pollux just likes movies with bright lights and pretty colors.
Thor likes brown.
Pollux just likes movies with bright lights and pretty colors.
Thor likes brown.
Good movie, the special effects were extremely good. I'd buy it just for that.
The tone and music invoked a more sinister theme than other ST movies.
The storyline was about clones and how they are very different - Picard, and then Data. Sounds like the producers were trying to make a pro-cloning political statement.
The tone and music invoked a more sinister theme than other ST movies.
The storyline was about clones and how they are very different - Picard, and then Data. Sounds like the producers were trying to make a pro-cloning political statement.
It looked fanfiction, considering all the tired plot devices and recycling of previous Star Trek material. Not quite as bad as I, V or First Contact (at least it didn't have hippie drunks or religious maniacs and wasn't quite as slow as TMP), but close.
It gave me some good fodder to beat up on for the film class I'm in, though. I like to recycle, so I'll just copy and paste that in here:
Star Trek: Nemesis is an exceptionally mediocre film. It excels at nothing in particular other than blandness, and seems more like a remix of elements of earlier Star Trek films rather than anything original.
Suspension of disbelief has limits, and this film shoots past them at warp 9. It begins with a rather oddly humorous scene that sets the tone: the entire Romulan Senate turns to stone and then cracks into dust on the floor (in slow motion, naturally) due to some green light, later revealed to be a new type of radiation. Never has it been more unintentionally comical to see an entire government assassinated. This happens with no real introduction to motives and certainly without giving the audience reason to care... it simply comes off as over-dramatized and uninteresting, inserted as a halfhearted attempt to explain later events.
On the Enterprise, pieces of a deactivated android in a distant solar system set off an audible alarm on the bridge. It's quite odd how positronic signatures never did that before even at close range... never was the Enterprise able to locate Lore from a distance by any such method, and yet now a positronic signature in another solar system sets off an alarm simply because the writer (if there actually was one) couldn't be bothered to think of a reasonable way to bring the ship to that planet. The next blatant plot device is an ion storm, which conveniently lingers just close enough that they must send a shuttle down to a planet rather than use transporters, and just close enough that scanners are interfered with enough to not be able to precisely locate the positronic signature (which had been so easily noticed light years away). Simply because somebody wanted to film it, they roll an open-air jeep-like vehicle out and drive around recklessly. Somehow, in the 24th century it's supposed to make sense to leave the very comfortable and maneuverable and safe shuttle behind in order to drive around in a heavily armed jeep that might be out of the 1940s (excepting the phasors). Of course the audience knows that this is all just for the sake of making sure they're out in the open so that natives in tanks can appear and begin shooting at them... which is in turn so that the director can show them driving over a cliff (in slow motion, naturally) to just barely land their truck in the hovering shuttle. All this time, it's unclear where the film has gone or if anyone remembered that there was supposed to be one.
Later on, yet more plot devices appear. Most notable is the invention of the magic transporter pin. Conveniently there's only one of these, as though Data couldn't carry two or three, especially when he knows he's going to rescue someone. Also conveniently, it has the curious ability to function even when the transporter has just minutes earlier been very clearly established as offline. Although perhaps excusable as a device most every action movie resorts to, the Remans must inexplicably leave Picard alone with only one guard just long enough for him to escape. The way in which Picard was cloned to make Shinzon, the choice of Picard as somehow the most key person in the Federation to want to clone, and the way in which a clone of a human would become the leader of the Remans, is all left unexplained for the simple reason that there is no reasonable explanation. The worst spot, however, may be the scene where Troi locates a cloaked ship via telepathy -- this is highly overdramatized, with errie music and rectangular lighting focused on her eyes completing the unintentionally comic moment which looks as though it came from an old episode of "In Search Of...".
The acting has one minor bright spot, that being Tom Hardy as Praetor Shinzon. The villainous part is portrayed very well, with a sense of complexity behind the lines. For the rest of the cast, early on the dialog seems forced and unnatural (though perhaps the writer is more to blame than the actors). Later there isn't as much dialog, as it gives way to explosions and shooting, which is by then a welcome relief from having to listen to them read such pathetic lines. As Picard, Patrick Stewart seems to be either flat and disinterested, or oddly cheerful at the wrong times. No longer the reserved, diplomatic commander, he seems playful and reckless. As he prepares to ram his ship and perhaps see many in his crew die, he smiles while talking to Shinzon, as though he gains so much fun from preparing to do something his clone doesn't expect that he can be genuinely cheerful as his crew faces possible death. The sense here is that the characters don't take the danger seriously, Picard and Data especially acting as though they might turn around and say "oh, don't worry, it's just a movie", and so it becomes impossible for the audience to take their danger seriously either. When Data is killed off at the end, it's oddly incapable of bringing forth any real emotion... there's no real lead up to it or indication of a fatal choice being pondered, so it has no particular impact.
Overall, "Star Trek: Nemesis" seems to be a weakly contrived excuse to blow things up. Special effects are where most of the budget seems to have gone, but while they show detail and financial commitment the effects are often strangely out of place and distracting. The effect at the beginning of the film of Romulans breaking into dust on the floor of the senate is clearly intended to evoke horror, but accomplishes only mild amusement. The choice of a neon green glow with swirls in it to be the deadly radiation which threatens the universe is also odd, as it looks more like an interesting kind of light than like anything threatening. The film throws together elements from previous films, notably making Data replay Spock's exact role from Star Trek II and making Shinzon's whole situation a direct copy of Khan, and nothing in the script (written by long-time fan John Logan) seems particularly original or creative. This is nothing more than a rehash of familiar ground, presented less effectively than ever.
It gave me some good fodder to beat up on for the film class I'm in, though. I like to recycle, so I'll just copy and paste that in here:
Star Trek: Nemesis is an exceptionally mediocre film. It excels at nothing in particular other than blandness, and seems more like a remix of elements of earlier Star Trek films rather than anything original.
Suspension of disbelief has limits, and this film shoots past them at warp 9. It begins with a rather oddly humorous scene that sets the tone: the entire Romulan Senate turns to stone and then cracks into dust on the floor (in slow motion, naturally) due to some green light, later revealed to be a new type of radiation. Never has it been more unintentionally comical to see an entire government assassinated. This happens with no real introduction to motives and certainly without giving the audience reason to care... it simply comes off as over-dramatized and uninteresting, inserted as a halfhearted attempt to explain later events.
On the Enterprise, pieces of a deactivated android in a distant solar system set off an audible alarm on the bridge. It's quite odd how positronic signatures never did that before even at close range... never was the Enterprise able to locate Lore from a distance by any such method, and yet now a positronic signature in another solar system sets off an alarm simply because the writer (if there actually was one) couldn't be bothered to think of a reasonable way to bring the ship to that planet. The next blatant plot device is an ion storm, which conveniently lingers just close enough that they must send a shuttle down to a planet rather than use transporters, and just close enough that scanners are interfered with enough to not be able to precisely locate the positronic signature (which had been so easily noticed light years away). Simply because somebody wanted to film it, they roll an open-air jeep-like vehicle out and drive around recklessly. Somehow, in the 24th century it's supposed to make sense to leave the very comfortable and maneuverable and safe shuttle behind in order to drive around in a heavily armed jeep that might be out of the 1940s (excepting the phasors). Of course the audience knows that this is all just for the sake of making sure they're out in the open so that natives in tanks can appear and begin shooting at them... which is in turn so that the director can show them driving over a cliff (in slow motion, naturally) to just barely land their truck in the hovering shuttle. All this time, it's unclear where the film has gone or if anyone remembered that there was supposed to be one.
Later on, yet more plot devices appear. Most notable is the invention of the magic transporter pin. Conveniently there's only one of these, as though Data couldn't carry two or three, especially when he knows he's going to rescue someone. Also conveniently, it has the curious ability to function even when the transporter has just minutes earlier been very clearly established as offline. Although perhaps excusable as a device most every action movie resorts to, the Remans must inexplicably leave Picard alone with only one guard just long enough for him to escape. The way in which Picard was cloned to make Shinzon, the choice of Picard as somehow the most key person in the Federation to want to clone, and the way in which a clone of a human would become the leader of the Remans, is all left unexplained for the simple reason that there is no reasonable explanation. The worst spot, however, may be the scene where Troi locates a cloaked ship via telepathy -- this is highly overdramatized, with errie music and rectangular lighting focused on her eyes completing the unintentionally comic moment which looks as though it came from an old episode of "In Search Of...".
The acting has one minor bright spot, that being Tom Hardy as Praetor Shinzon. The villainous part is portrayed very well, with a sense of complexity behind the lines. For the rest of the cast, early on the dialog seems forced and unnatural (though perhaps the writer is more to blame than the actors). Later there isn't as much dialog, as it gives way to explosions and shooting, which is by then a welcome relief from having to listen to them read such pathetic lines. As Picard, Patrick Stewart seems to be either flat and disinterested, or oddly cheerful at the wrong times. No longer the reserved, diplomatic commander, he seems playful and reckless. As he prepares to ram his ship and perhaps see many in his crew die, he smiles while talking to Shinzon, as though he gains so much fun from preparing to do something his clone doesn't expect that he can be genuinely cheerful as his crew faces possible death. The sense here is that the characters don't take the danger seriously, Picard and Data especially acting as though they might turn around and say "oh, don't worry, it's just a movie", and so it becomes impossible for the audience to take their danger seriously either. When Data is killed off at the end, it's oddly incapable of bringing forth any real emotion... there's no real lead up to it or indication of a fatal choice being pondered, so it has no particular impact.
Overall, "Star Trek: Nemesis" seems to be a weakly contrived excuse to blow things up. Special effects are where most of the budget seems to have gone, but while they show detail and financial commitment the effects are often strangely out of place and distracting. The effect at the beginning of the film of Romulans breaking into dust on the floor of the senate is clearly intended to evoke horror, but accomplishes only mild amusement. The choice of a neon green glow with swirls in it to be the deadly radiation which threatens the universe is also odd, as it looks more like an interesting kind of light than like anything threatening. The film throws together elements from previous films, notably making Data replay Spock's exact role from Star Trek II and making Shinzon's whole situation a direct copy of Khan, and nothing in the script (written by long-time fan John Logan) seems particularly original or creative. This is nothing more than a rehash of familiar ground, presented less effectively than ever.
Last edited:
EvelinaAnville
Registered Senior Member
I liked it hmmmmph. I do agree with Patrick Stewart, though, in wanting it to be the last because it was so good. Yes, good!!!! It was corny, but I like the corniness. That is one of the reasons I like sci-fi, it is silly and FUN. So there
Oh, wait, I had a question. Where the hell did Shinzon come from? Why did he exist? (Besides giving Picard his existential confusion moments.) I would really have liked some explanation for his existence. I guess I must read the movie book to find out.
hmmmmph. I do agree with Patrick Stewart, though, in wanting it to be the last because it was so good. Yes, good!!!! It was corny, but I like the corniness. That is one of the reasons I like sci-fi, it is silly and FUN. So there Oh, wait, I had a question. Where the hell did Shinzon come from? Why did he exist? (Besides giving Picard his existential confusion moments.) I would really have liked some explanation for his existence. I guess I must read the movie book to find out.
Fraggle Rocker
Staff member
It was a farewell. Leave it at that.
This was clearly the end of the entire TNG-DS9-Voyager story line. No, it was not Great Cinema. It was just a double-episode of TNG. We'll reminisce with Captain Archer for a few seasons, back in the days before the Cardassians and the Borg, before the war with the Klingons hit a ten-digit body count. (Or was that in an alternate history? I'm not sure.) But eventually we'll have to move forward to another generation that has new problems and new enemies. Hopefully not as dismal as Rodenberry's other visions, EFC and Andromeda. Great shows but very depressing!
We were saying goodbye to our Virtual Family. A bittersweet moment. If it didn't touch you, ok. But TNG was one of my top three favorite TV shows of all time. ("Dinosaurs!" and "Farscape," if anybody cares.) Almost every episode touched on a Great Truth or some aspect of the Human Condition. That was TV As Literature. Ardra. A judge deciding whether Data was a person or Star Fleet property. The Romulans' Klingon penal colony.
It was one of the nicest things that's ever come along on the tube, and I'll miss it very much. I appreciated the formal goodbye.
Obviously this was "goodbye" from the entire Next Generation universe. Main characters getting married, getting killed, getting promoted and getting passed over for promotion. (How did Janeway get to be an admiral before Picard?) Wesley showing up for a non-speaking cameo. Guinan tending bar. Janeway in a teleconference. Peace with the Romulans.
This was clearly the end of the entire TNG-DS9-Voyager story line. No, it was not Great Cinema. It was just a double-episode of TNG. We'll reminisce with Captain Archer for a few seasons, back in the days before the Cardassians and the Borg, before the war with the Klingons hit a ten-digit body count. (Or was that in an alternate history? I'm not sure.) But eventually we'll have to move forward to another generation that has new problems and new enemies. Hopefully not as dismal as Rodenberry's other visions, EFC and Andromeda. Great shows but very depressing!
We were saying goodbye to our Virtual Family. A bittersweet moment. If it didn't touch you, ok. But TNG was one of my top three favorite TV shows of all time. ("Dinosaurs!" and "Farscape," if anybody cares.) Almost every episode touched on a Great Truth or some aspect of the Human Condition. That was TV As Literature. Ardra. A judge deciding whether Data was a person or Star Fleet property. The Romulans' Klingon penal colony.
It was one of the nicest things that's ever come along on the tube, and I'll miss it very much. I appreciated the formal goodbye.
*sniff sniff* It would totally suck if this was the last star trek movie, but then again, I can't see star trek without Data, because Data absolutely rocks, and definitely made the next generation awesome. However, they could always do another movie, not the search for Spock, but the search for Data.....