Omniscient & omnipotent?

fess said:
How can God be both, they are mutually exclusive?
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om·ni·scient
\-shənt\
adjective
  • knowing everything
  • having unlimited understanding or knowledge
om·nip·o·tent
\äm-ˈni-pə-tənt\
adjective
  • having complete or unlimited power
Merriam Webster Dictionary

they are mutually exclusive

Don't look like to me

One knowledge, one power

What are your two definitions?

:)
 
If God is omniscient, he will know that a particular thing will happen at a particular time in the future. If that is true, he will be powerless to change it. If he changes it, and it doesn't happen, he was not omniscient
 
fess said:
If God is omniscient, he will know that a particular thing will happen at a particular time in the future. If that is true, he will be powerless to change it. If he changes it, and it doesn't happen, he was not omniscient
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What if there is no future, or past,from God’s perspective?
 
fess said:
If God is omniscient, he will know that a particular thing will happen at a particular time in the future. If that is true, he will be powerless to change it. If he changes it, and it doesn't happen, he was not omniscient
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Fair point. Sounds like a variation on 'can god make a rock so heavy he cannot lift it'?

However knowing everything includes knowing he won't attempt to change the future and he knows he doesn't

Most chats of this nature ether never end - turtles all the way down, or end when you look over the edge of the world, see the post of turtles vanish downwards, decide not worth it and back off

Backs away slowly

:)
 
fess said:
If God is omniscient, he will know that a particular thing will happen at a particular time in the future. If that is true, he will be powerless to change it. If he changes it, and it doesn't happen, he was not omniscient
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He can change it and know what it is after he's changed it. He creates the future while still interacting with the present.
 
fess said:
If God is omniscient, he will know that a particular thing will happen at a particular time in the future. If that is true, he will be powerless to change it. If he changes it, and it doesn't happen, he was not omniscient
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This is not true. It is only true for those of us who are doomed to travel through time.

Let's take a trip to Lineland for a moment.

The Linelanders (red dots) all live along the straightedge of a ruler (grey bar). The ruler moves across a surface (green). They are powerless to stop it or see where it will go.
The black lines are their unmolested futures.

I am omniscient in that I can see the Linelander's destinies. I am also omnipotent in that I can change their destinies at-will (blue).


lineland.png
 
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In my religion there is a reason that Lucifer (fallen angel of light) knew all along we would suffer and did nothing to prevent it.
 
I believe God can be both - all knowing and all powerful, but he can also allow for us to make our own choices. His will prevails over those choices - depends on one’s belief system, but that’s part of my faith, now.
 
kx000 said:
How do you mean? Like why is he innocent? He knows that...
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I'm not saying he's innocent he's a mass murderer, but you have to wonder who's he killing? Himself? Seriously, how can little satan compete againest God's will?

Sorry my spell checker isn't working.
 
kx000 said:
In my religion there is a reason that Lucifer (fallen angel of light) knew all along we would suffer and did nothing to prevent it.
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I thought Lucifer set up a heaven franchise to cater for those who would suffer and called it HELL

:)
 
davewhite04 said:
I'm not saying he's innocent he's a mass murderer, but you have to wonder who's he killing? Himself? Seriously, how can little satan compete againest God's will?

Sorry my spell checker isn't working.
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Michael 345 said:
I thought Lucifer set up a heaven franchise to cater for those who would suffer and called it HELL

:)
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I believe Lucfer and Satan are seperate entities all together, one knowledge the other hatred.
 
DaveC426913 said:
This is not true. It is only true for those of us who are doomed to travel through time.

Let's take a trip to Lineland for a moment.

The Linelanders (red dots) all live along the straightedge of a ruler (grey bar). The ruler moves across a surface (green). They are powerless to stop it or see where it will go.
The black lines are their unmolested futures.

I am omniscient in that I can see the Linelander's destinies. I am also omnipotent in that I can change their destinies at-will (blue).


View attachment 3098
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If god knows where those dots will be at a later time, his omnicense makes it impossible for that outcome to change or for him to change it
 
God is still omnipotent because he had to fight an invincible devil, and that resulted in middle earth, and is why there is suffering and evil in our existence.
 
Michael 345 said:
Well not sure about that
****
Many Christians believe the Devil was once a beautiful angel named Lucifer who defied God and fell from grace

https://www-history-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.history.com/.amp/topics/folklore/history-of-the-devil?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQCKAE=#aoh=15822596062371&referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://www.history.com/topics/folklore/history-of-the-devil

*****
Lucifer upstairs

Satan downstairs

:)
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Jesus is the true light of the world. Satan masquerades as a angel of light. Satans tail sweeps a third of the stars out of the sky.
 
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