No, that would require empathy. But they do want to fool the public about it.Why is it called a right to work law, not a restriction of Union power law.
Are they ashamed of their intent?
No, that would require empathy. But they do want to fool the public about it.Why is it called a right to work law, not a restriction of Union power law.
Are they ashamed of their intent?
So you want people to be able to take advantage of the Union's negotiating on your behalf and not pay them anything?This is the internet age, can't unions function online on voluntary or no fees? If employees under an employee feel subjugated they can still pseudo-unionize, aka walmart black Friday strike unions of factory labor our dying not simply because conservatives are trying to kill source of democratic funding but because we American's can't compete with the near slave labor jobs in Asia or with ever encroaching automation. There are jobs were foreign labor and automation had made little progress though and that is in the physical services, until the day robots are cheaper then labors at stocking shelves, waiting tables and answering questions at a front desk, humans can still do those jobs, and that is were organize labor can survive. Unions have got to shift away into the service sectors and provide protection for near free.
the government is going to lose in this endeavor.In a surprise move the Republican dominated state government in Michigan has passed a right to work law. What is a right to work law? It means that unions in Michigan will no longer be able to force employees to pay union dues. Workers are still free to choose to join the union and pay dues, but they will no longer be forced to do so.
It’s odd that “people” wouldn’t try something that made sense, first, like better handles on an obviously dysfunctional, corrupt, and predatory executive class;• No, I'm saying Michigan's economy is in a horrific condition in spite of strong unions and people are understandably ready to try something new.
The observation was merely that RTW is an apparent continuation of a severe decline – more of the same, leading to a visible and miserable future. The evidence would be the apparent effects of union busting wherever it has been successful – there is plenty of that.”clusteringflux” said:--- - - Then perhaps I should add that MI suffers also in spite of the Democratic leadership of the last decade. How does any of this translate to being "at the cost of the people" ? If the path of the past has led downward, are you suggesting that the decline will now somehow be faster because of RTW?..It's possible, but I don't think there is much evidence to support that.
The notable fact here is that this kind of dishonesty and public betrayal can recommend itself to an elected politician – a political representative who will betray their constituency like that must be counting on powerful support from somebody, and of a kind that can reliably induce amnesia or confusion in a voting bloc.In a surprise move the Republican dominated state government in Michigan has passed a right to work law. What is a right to work law? It means that unions in Michigan will no longer be able to force employees to pay union dues. Workers are still free to choose to join the union and pay dues, but they will no longer be forced to do so.
Clusteringflux said:
If the path of the past has led downward, are you suggesting that the decline will now somehow be faster because of RTW?..It's possible, but I don't think there is much evidence to support that.
That is a lie. I was forced to join a union myself and forced to pay union dues. I can assure you that I had no desire to be in the union and certainly had no desire to pay union dues.Right-to-work laws do not have anything to do with people being forced to join a union or pay dues for political causes they do not support. Federal law already guarantees that no one can be forced to join a union, and no one can be required to pay union dues that fund political causes they oppose.
Bullshit. Being forced to pay for something that you don't want is not "getting something for nothing".Interestingly, this is an occasion when Republicans want to use government to ensure that some people get something for nothing.
If making unions voluntary castrates them, they deserve to be castrated. Remember, workers are still completely free to join the union should they wish to. This just makes the union voluntary, as it should have been in the first place.In the end, this isn't about helping any workers anywhere; it's about castrating unions. Lafer's paper considered the move to make Indiana a right-to-work state:
I'm sure they'll remember, but that might not be a bad thing. Recall that the constitutional amendment enshrining closed shop union law in the state constitution was easily defeated in Michigan; Governor Walker easily defeated the the recall effort launched by unions after Wisconsin went right to work; and the Republican party elected a new Republican governor and elected a Republican supermajority in the state of Indiana after passing right to work legislation in that state.And some might even remember that in two years, when Snyder's term is up.
That is a lie. I was forced to join a union myself and forced to pay union dues. I can assure you that I had no desire to be in the union and certainly had no desire to pay union dues...
Liar. No one is ever forced to join the union. That's illegal. I see you want to enjoy the benefits of the union negotiating on your behalf, getting you things like paid sick days, weekends, and vacations, but you don't want to pay for it. I call that freeloading.
No, I didn't want them negotiating on my behalf. I didn't get paid sick days. I didn't get weekends off. In fact, I worked mostly weekends. I also didn't get any paid vacations. I did get time and a half on Sundays, but the people hired after me only got an extra dollar on Sundays, and the people hired after that got regular pay on Sundays. The union wasn't worth a shit. Every contract was worse than the one before, but they grandfathered the current workers into the old set up.Liar. No one is ever forced to join the union. That's illegal. I see you want to enjoy the benefits of the union negotiating on your behalf, getting you things like paid sick days, weekends, and vacations, but you don't want to pay for it. I call that freeloading.
No, I didn't want them negotiating on my behalf. I didn't get paid sick days. I didn't get weekends off. In fact, I worked mostly weekends. I also didn't get any paid vacations. I did get time and a half on Sundays, but the people hired after me only got an extra dollar on Sundays, and the people hired after that got regular pay on Sundays. The union wasn't worth a shit. Every contract was worse than the one before, but they grandfathered the current workers into the old set up.
No, I didn't want them negotiating on my behalf. I didn't get paid sick days. I didn't get weekends off. In fact, I worked mostly weekends. I also didn't get any paid vacations. I did get time and a half on Sundays, but the people hired after me only got an extra dollar on Sundays, and the people hired after that got regular pay on Sundays. The union wasn't worth a shit. Every contract was worse than the one before, but they grandfathered the current workers into the old set up.
As to not being forced to join, NO ONE WANTED TO JOIN THE UNION, but after a certain period of time they begain taking money out of your check for your union initiation fee, union back dues, and union dues.
According to Wikipedia:
The Taft-Hartley Act outlawed the closed shop in the United States in 1947, but permits the union shop, except in those states that have passed right-to-work laws, in which case even the union shop is illegal. An employer may not lawfully agree with a union to hire only union members; it may, on the other hand, agree to require employees to join the union or pay the equivalent of union dues to it after a set period of time.
So you don't have to join, but you do have to pay. A distinction without a difference.
so let me get this straight your craven regard for corporate power and hatred of unions derives from you working in a company where corporate power managed to do a better job harming employees than the labor power protecting them?
Liar. No one is ever forced to join the union. That's illegal. I see you want to enjoy the benefits of the union negotiating on your behalf, getting you things like paid sick days, weekends, and vacations, but you don't want to pay for it. I call that freeloading.
Your Avatar is so distracting gross that I'm not going to read anything you write.
So you want people to be able to take advantage of the Union's negotiating on your behalf and not pay them anything?
But it's a sexy woman! How is that gross?
No. At the time I was forced to join the union I was making minimum wage.So you wanted to enjoy the benefits of the negotiation they already did, but you didn't want to pay for it? I bet your pay would have been significantly lower without the union. Were you getting more than minimum wage?
Unions aren't outlawed under right to work, the union must simply entice workers to join (and pay dues) voluntarily.basically, how else are unions to function under these laws?
Funny how all that rightwing yak about freedom to take a job or leave it, employment being voluntary choice, working conditions being matters of free bargaining between employer and employee, yadda yadda yadda, goes right out the window when one of the conditions of employment is union dues.madanthony said:That is a lie. I was forced to join a union myself and forced to pay union dues. I can assure you that I had no desire to be in the union and certainly had no desire to pay union dues.
None of us entry level people wanted to join the union, but at the time our state was not a "right to work" state, so we had no choice.
I'm really into sexy woman. Maybe I should have left gross out. So you're a sexy woman. I thought you were a dude not a dudette. It's distracting dude or dudette. I shouldn't have said anything and just put you on my growing ignore list. That space is generally for cranks and crackpots which I don't consider you to be a member of either group. Just ignore me and I'll find a way to live with your Avatar. The vote in Michigan is really disturbing.
Unions aren't outlawed under right to work, the union must simply entice workers to join (and pay dues) voluntarily.