Do Atheists Come Out of the Closet?

[KilljoyKlown]

Before I found science forums I very rarely ever met anybody that claimed to be an atheist. So when do atheist ever make the opportunity to talk about not believing in God? My bet is mostly at parties and get togethers where someone else is talking about God.

When you find yourself in the presence of a God conversation, do you declare yourself to be an atheist and talk about your reasons for not believing or do you just listen or participate without declaring yourself?

When the neighborhood religions come knocking at your door. Do you say your not interested and close the door? Or rub your hands together thinking this is going to be fun?

As the title implies, do you feel that the people who admit to being atheist are just the tip of an iceberg? And that most atheist stay out of the picture to avoid conflict and family strife?

 

[420Joey]

I think athiests are in the closet

Really, everytime there is a discussion that is based on the premise of reality or speculation about our frame of reference I hear (or read, rather, since most people arent bold enough that ive met) is "Everything your saying is wrong!" , "Prove it" than when someone asks.... so what is your belief to contrast (notice I said belief) there reply is summed up by "I'm an athiest!!" to me this equates to "I'm in the closet!!"

For god sakes. If you dont have any belief to contrast why bother trying to get other people to conform to your lack of belief. What does it matter really? Especially on that note that apparently "God cannot exist" and "We cannot be god (A focal point of)" than really, what difference does it make !?

Unless ofcourse it affects somehow that people have "beliefs" it would seem to me that most athiests are thiests in the closet if they spend so much time on the subject? (Ofcourse not applying to all athiests as most are smart sensible people which cant be said about thiests) but the athiests who continue to perpetuate conflict are the ones to me are the closet thiests.

I esspecially hate the athiests who make suppositions themselves on the premise of reality!! It's hilllarious.

It's as if they feel better about it if it has some loosely based science dogma, not adressing the premise, and going on like its conclusive when there just as confused as theists.

I want someone to prove to me that god cant be experience and that all contigent matter in the cosmos and beyond to nothing is god. Prove there is a you here in short. What is so different about you and something inanimate? The interaction, correct? This proves that god does not exist?? Or does???

Neither. Athiests are reasonable but not those who attack the concept of god. If they do, there in the closet.

Simple as that.

 

[KilljoyKlown]

I think athiests are in the closet

Really, everytime there is a discussion that is based on the premise of reality or speculation about our frame of reference I hear (or read, rather, since most people arent bold enough that ive met) is "Everything your saying is wrong!" , "Prove it" than when someone asks.... so what is your belief to contrast (notice I said belief) there reply is summed up by "I'm an athiest!!" to me this equates to "I'm in the closet!!"

For god sakes. If you dont have any belief to contrast why bother trying to get other people to conform to your lack of belief. What does it matter really? Especially on that note that apparently "God cannot exist" and "We cannot be god (A focal point of)" than really, what difference does it make !?

Unless ofcourse it affects somehow that people have "beliefs" it would seem to me that most athiests are thiests in the closet if they spend so much time on the subject? (Ofcourse not applying to all athiests as most are smart sensible people which cant be said about thiests) but the athiests who continue to perpetuate conflict are the ones to me are the closet thiests.

I esspecially hate the athiests who make suppositions themselves on the premise of reality!! It's hilllarious.

It's as if they feel better about it if it has some loosely based science dogma, not adressing the premise, and going on like its conclusive when there just as confused as theists.

I want someone to prove to me that god cant be experience and that all contigent matter in the cosmos and beyond to nothing is god. Prove there is a you here in short. What is so different about you and something inanimate? The interaction, correct? This proves that god does not exist?? Or does???

Neither. Athiests are reasonable but not those who attack the concept of god. If they do, there in the closet.

Simple as that.

Sorry Joey, I'm not an atheist because I disbelieve in a God, but because there is no evidence of a god. Show me the evidence and I won't have any problem believing. The problem is no theist has ever provided any believable evidence based on fact and no God has ever asked me to believe in him.

 

[Stryder]

I'd probably get termed to be an atheist, although I do have some thoughts that would seem odd to an atheist. Am I in a closet? No (although the room I'm in right now isn't much bigger than one.)

My reasoning is that Neither (Athiests and Theists) are Right and neither are Wrong, in the sense that some have some points right. For instance Evolution is Real (Sorry theists but it is), but we didn't evolve from nothing which meant there has to be an intelligent design to the function that made us (Potentially placing someone at the helm of putting us here). Was it an individual god? No (sorry again theists, it's just too much work for one entity, no matter how superficially superfluous they are.), was it multiple gods? No... you'd really have to define what a God was and/or is and technically isn't.

For the most part the entire human species has over millennia's composed a long list of what they transposed should make up a god, but it's become as mythical as dragons.

So what would a god be? Well theists would hate this and I'm pretty sure most Athiests would get on board with it (if possible) A "God" is an entity much like a Google (or any other company) is an entity, it's got a particular mission statement, goal and develops towards those goals based upon the interaction of all the people that make that company up.

The god that theists believe in could actually be something of their own making if they banded together to create the company that makes it happen, of course it could also be a group of scientists that just happened to fathom the unfathomable state of the universe and all it's inner workings creating a "god" entity just so they can rub it up the noses of theists. After all if the Atheists made theists God(s) it would definitely prove a few things.

 

[birch]

but we didn't evolve from nothing which meant there has to be an intelligent design to the function that made us (Potentially placing someone at the helm of putting us here)

why does the function have to be a design? then who designed the one at the helm? the idea of a creator as being totally separate from it's creation doesn't fly.

 

[Dywyddyr]

so what is your belief to contrast (notice I said belief) there reply is summed up by "I'm an athiest!!" to me this equates to "I'm in the closet!!"

Since the definition of atheism is "lack of belief in god" how can they be "in the closet"?

For god sakes. If you dont have any belief to contrast why bother trying to get other people to conform to your lack of belief.

What requirement is there for a "contrasting belief"?

Unless ofcourse it affects somehow that people have "beliefs" it would seem to me that most athiests are thiests in the closet if they spend so much time on the subject?

Wrong.
As has been explained to you a number of times.

I esspecially hate the athiests who make suppositions themselves on the premise of reality!! It's hilllarious.

The way you persist in doing?

Neither. Athiests are reasonable but not those who attack the concept of god. If they do, there in the closet.

How so? Because that's what you believe?

 

[Dywyddyr]

When you find yourself in the presence of a God conversation, do you declare yourself to be an atheist and talk about your reasons for not believing or do you just listen or participate without declaring yourself?
And that most atheist stay out of the picture to avoid conflict and family strife?

Fortunately, me living in England, being an atheist isn't a problem in any way.
It's more or less taken for granted that, unless otherwise stated, most people you encounter will be atheist (or at least "lukewarm" with regard to religion). The local vicar is more of a "community figure" than a "spokesman for god" and I've not yet encountered a vicar (or even a parishioner) who has "problems" with me being an atheist.
Which footy team you support (or don't) arouses far more ire than god vs. atheist in my experience.

 

[cosmictraveler]

I've never been asked if I am an atheist anywhere except here. One of my long time friends is a minister and I just let him believe in anything he wants to because that's his right. Just as it is mine not to. We get along fine and have never had an argument about religion but have discussed religions at length.

 

[KilljoyKlown]

I'd probably get termed to be an atheist, although I do have some thoughts that would seem odd to an atheist. Am I in a closet? No (although the room I'm in right now isn't much bigger than one.)

My reasoning is that Neither (Athiests and Theists) are Right and neither are Wrong, in the sense that some have some points right. For instance Evolution is Real (Sorry theists but it is), but we didn't evolve from nothing which meant there has to be an intelligent design to the function that made us (Potentially placing someone at the helm of putting us here). Was it an individual god? No (sorry again theists, it's just too much work for one entity, no matter how superficially superfluous they are.), was it multiple gods? No... you'd really have to define what a God was and/or is and technically isn't.

For the most part the entire human species has over millennia's composed a long list of what they transposed should make up a god, but it's become as mythical as dragons.

So what would a god be? Well theists would hate this and I'm pretty sure most Athiests would get on board with it (if possible) A "God" is an entity much like a Google (or any other company) is an entity, it's got a particular mission statement, goal and develops towards those goals based upon the interaction of all the people that make that company up.

The god that theists believe in could actually be something of their own making if they banded together to create the company that makes it happen, of course it could also be a group of scientists that just happened to fathom the unfathomable state of the universe and all it's inner workings creating a "god" entity just so they can rub it up the noses of theists. After all if the Atheists made theists God(s) it would definitely prove a few things.

No doubt about it, you imagination is alive and well.

 

[SciWriter]

On science forums people want to get to the bottom of things. There are also a small handful in regular life who do and so I discuss it with them.

 

[420Joey]

This reality certainly is something I guess it had to have came from nothing, eh? Your imagination is in full swing if you think you are right.

You have a vivid imagination, sir. Better yet, you don't. Let me get this straight. You could say "Hell, I don't know" making you an athiest and thus smarter than the sheeple who "believe in god/source"

Isnt it like me saying 1+1=2 is wishful thinking and the people who believe in this arithmetic is ignorant because no "1" is shown to exist?

Can you prove 1 is a value for something?? Outside an abirtuary sense.

1 is god than? All matter is postulated from the same source? This is a crank theory but the theory that

there really is "unique" consciousness isnt and is "normal" when really it's just the same experience in different formats inffered from what we know in biology.

Why the hell do you feel the need to make others conform to your lack of belief??? What is the point.

You have the belief that you lack a belief? Your point should be invalid at default. You have no place in an argument for god if you say "I dont know"

Than again if you have some abstract "scientific" supposition about the premise of reality your no better than a thiest at any rate so really,

what is the point arguing about religion? I'm just curious to what purpose it would serve us being athiest. (I dont believe in religion but to question god when we have the consciousness to question is ridiculous if your taking a scientific approach to the subject) I'm not saying god created anything I'm saying that consciousness itself is god. The experience. Matter experiencing itself in a meaningful way.

:shrug: Let's make fun of the people who believe in god to give them a frame of reference for the premise of reality.

How stupid???

Than again, 1+1=2 Right....................
It's when we question the value of 1 is when and only when god becomes blurry.

 

[KilljoyKlown]

Fortunately, me living in England, being an atheist isn't a problem in any way.
It's more or less taken for granted that, unless otherwise stated, most people you encounter will be atheist (or at least "lukewarm" with regard to religion). The local vicar is more of a "community figure" than a "spokesman for god" and I've not yet encountered a vicar (or even a parishioner) who has "problems" with me being an atheist.
Which footy team you support (or don't) arouses far more ire than god vs. atheist in my experience.

Here in the U.S. religious fanaticism can crop up on a moments notice and it can be very dangerous, such as bombing clinics or forcing schools to teach creationism. Anyway not advertizing that you are an atheist (staying in closet) might be viewed as the safest strategy for staying out of trouble. It never feels good to always be one against many. Especially when the many might become a mob looking for a scapegoat to vent their anger on.

 

[420Joey]

On a side note I was watching one of those local broadcasting channels and it was on a church and fundraising and they were discussing the evils of finding information online. When asked why is it evil the guy responded that "You go to a church. Talk to a pastor face to face to find information about god. Pastors are the link to god. You dont go online if you want real information"

Later on they promoted there website and the whole premise of the broadcasting was to get fundraising to finish there pastor schools and they talked about the need for pastors in the next 30 years and the demand that is going to be needed. I couldent stop laughing if I find it I will post it.

This ofcourse is the reason why I believe in god. We have too much will.
We could literally do anything we please damn near and from what is inffered the universe does not work this way so I am inclined to believe GOD (consciousness) was first and is the premise of all matter. Experience itself is god. Experience is immortal. To give it meaning we have life, death, and a focal point(ego)

 

[Dywyddyr]

This reality certainly is something I guess it had to have came from nothing, eh? Your imagination is in full swing if you think you are right.

Why so?

You have the belief that you lack a belief?

No. I'm certain I lack the belief in god.

Than again if you have some abstract "scientific" supposition about the premise of reality your no better than a thiest at any rate so really

Why?

(I dont believe in religion but to question god when we have the consciousness to question is ridiculous if your taking a scientific approach to the subject

To sate that consciousness indicate incontrovertibly means god exists is far from scientific.

I'm not saying god created anything I'm saying that consciousness itself is god.

What consciousness? Ours? If so how do account for the creation of the universe before we gained consciousness? Oh right, you're "scientifically" assuming that this consciousness existed before we were here.

It's when we question the value of 1 is when and only when god becomes blurry.

Or when someone states "consciousness is god"...
Time for a visit to the optician for you, methinks.

 

[KilljoyKlown]

This reality certainly is something I guess it had to have came from nothing, eh? Your imagination is in full swing if you think you are right.

You have a vivid imagination, sir. Better yet, you don't. Let me get this straight. You could say "Hell, I don't know" making you an athiest and thus smarter than the sheeple who "believe in god/source"

Isnt it like me saying 1+1=2 is wishful thinking and the people who believe in this arithmetic is ignorant because no "1" is shown to exist?

Can you prove 1 is a value for something?? Outside an abirtuary sense.

1 is god than? All matter is postulated from the same source? This is a crank theory but the theory that

there really is "unique" consciousness isnt and is "normal" when really it's just the same experience in different formats inffered from what we know in biology.

Why the hell do you feel the need to make others conform to your lack of belief??? What is the point.

You have the belief that you lack a belief? Your point should be invalid at default. You have no place in an argument for god if you say "I dont know"

Than again if you have some abstract "scientific" supposition about the premise of reality your no better than a thiest at any rate so really,

what is the point arguing about religion? I'm just curious to what purpose it would serve us being athiest. (I dont believe in religion but to question god when we have the consciousness to question is ridiculous if your taking a scientific approach to the subject) I'm not saying god created anything I'm saying that consciousness itself is god. The experience. Matter experiencing itself in a meaningful way.

:shrug: Let's make fun of the people who believe in god to give them a frame of reference for the premise of reality.

How stupid???

Than again, 1+1=2 Right....................
It's when we question the value of 1 is when and only when god becomes blurry.

Not sure who you are replying to, but it looks like you tried to include something for everybody. Sounds like trolling to me, based on what I read over in the trolling topic.

 

[Dywyddyr]

This ofcourse is the reason why I believe in god. We have too much will.

How do you know we have "too much will"?
Do you have a manual somewhere that specifies how much we "should have" have?
How do you measure how much "will" we actually do have to compare it to the manual's figure?
You have a "willometer"?
Or is your "argument" just a will o' the wisp?

 

[420Joey]

Why so?

Same anwser you provides a thiest alternative view that consciousness would exist first. There is nothing scientific about any premise for reality. That is my point. Can you think of any?

No. I'm certain I lack the belief in god.

Ok. I'll believe for you. I suspect me and you are the same god and belief isnt required anyway. Only your will.

Why?

The premise of origin cannot be scientific by default, why ask dumb questions?

To sate that consciousness indicate incontrovertibly means god exists is far from scientific.

Why?

What consciousness? Ours? If so how do account for the creation of the universe before we gained consciousness? Oh right, you're "scientifically" assuming that this consciousness existed before we were here.

Can you "scientifically" prove this reality to be analog-based? In short, physical? How do you know matter was here before consciousness and not as a consequence to? Because the big bang proves it isnt? I'll give you a hint, it does not, unless you can show me how 'something' physical can appear from 'nothing' in the natural world and even than wouldent convince me that god doesent exist because postulating matter evolving (which is what I suspect we are a result of) IS god.

Or when someone states "consciousness is god"...
Time for a visit to the optician for you, methinks.

Let me get this straight. You think your important enough to have been accidently given this format of consciousness to physical reality. So were the only ones in the whole self organizing universe I suppose! This is a random fluke, just our luck.

Nah I'd rather believe god is everything and we are just an illusion. Well come and go. Come and go. Come and go. We are god experiencing itself in every possibility. It's what I think anyway.

If athiests are not closet thiests why care so much about religion??
Who cares if your right or not??
You dont even have a belief. The people that dont know shit keep there damn mouth shut in school. Its funny where peoples irrational contempt mostly comes from.

Religion says god is an authoritive guy.
Rap says to me that a woman is a sexy curvy chick.

 

[420Joey]

Not sure who you are replying to, but it looks like you tried to include something for everybody. Sounds like trolling to me, based on what I read over in the trolling topic.

Thats no fair you trolled me into it.

 

[420Joey]

How do you know we have "too much will"?
Do you have a manual somewhere that specifies how much we "should have" have?
How do you measure how much "will" we actually do have to compare it to the manual's figure?
You have a "willometer"?
Or is your "argument" just a will o' the wisp?

Well I suppose you know the reason will exists in the first place? I want to hear the scientific premise behind will existing.

So nothing turns into more nothing which turns itself into more nothing than a liiiiiiiiiiiiittle more nothing to create something(nothing) experiencing(nothing nothing to nothing) the nothing outside our nothing as we know it?

Or is your position, I dont know nothing, you dont "know" nothing, so conform to nothing? Or be called a nothing???

 

[Dywyddyr]

Same anwser you provides a thiest alternative view that consciousness would exist first. There is nothing scientific about any premise for reality.

Wrong. You have been pointed to this before now AFAIK...
Check the links in the first post.
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=92761

Ok. I'll believe for you. I suspect me and you are the same god and belief isnt required anyway. Only your will.

Utter nonsense. The subject is "belief" in god, not whether god exists or not. Your "point" is void.

The premise of origin cannot be scientific by default, why ask dumb questions?

Really?

Why?

Because you're making a statement based on personal inference. Can you show HOW it indicates this?

Can you "scientifically" prove this reality to be analog-based?

Does it matter?

In short, physical?

Why do think analogue = physical?

How do you know matter was here before consciousness and not as a consequence to? Because the big bang proves it isnt? I'll give you a hint, it does not

Are you sure? Where was this consciousness prior to the big bang? How did it manifest?

unless you can show me how 'something' physical can appear from 'nothing' in the natural world

Done.

and even than wouldent convince me that god doesent exist because postulating matter evolving (which is what I suspect we are a result of) IS god.

Ah right. So according to you god isn't god but the universe?

Let me get this straight. You think your important enough to have been accidently given this format of consciousness to physical reality.

Where do you get "important" from? I'm an "accident" of the universe.

So were the only ones in the whole self organizing universe I suppose!

Where do you get that idea?

Nah I'd rather believe god is everything and we are just an illusion.

An illusion of what? Whose "illusion"?

If athiests are not closet thiests why care so much about religion??

One more time: because why others hold a belief that we don't is fascinating.

You dont even have a belief. The people that dont know shit keep there damn mouth shut in school.

Unfortunately it's the ones that "don't know shit" and persist in espousing it without proof or evidence that tend not to keep their mouths shut. And then divert as much as possible when asked to provide support.