Ok, let me make a slight change then. There are countries who sometimes try to be civilized. And there are some that don't give a shit.
Creationism strikes back
- Thread starter spuriousmonkey
- Start date
Not professional. I am a biologist.
Nasor,
Yeah. But none of these are disguised as science. As I said in a previous post, the way that intelligent design is structured, it allows believers to pretend that its science. The 10 commandments, bible reading, prayer, etc... These are all blatant.
Intelligent design is intelligently designed to be more treacherous.
Spidergoat,
Ah. Didn't know that.
So did this happen before and then Boeing killed it and now it's been snuck in again?
The problem is, as One Raven pointed out, that to argue against this decision is tantamount to saying there is no God. There are a lot of very religious people in Kansas and maybe they wouldn't necessarily vote to teach Intelligent Design, but I bet they'd fight if they thought the argument was the existence or nonexistence of God.
Ophiolite,
And body hair.
Lots of body hair.
Yeah. But none of these are disguised as science. As I said in a previous post, the way that intelligent design is structured, it allows believers to pretend that its science. The 10 commandments, bible reading, prayer, etc... These are all blatant.
Intelligent design is intelligently designed to be more treacherous.
Spidergoat,
Ah. Didn't know that.
So did this happen before and then Boeing killed it and now it's been snuck in again?
The problem is, as One Raven pointed out, that to argue against this decision is tantamount to saying there is no God. There are a lot of very religious people in Kansas and maybe they wouldn't necessarily vote to teach Intelligent Design, but I bet they'd fight if they thought the argument was the existence or nonexistence of God.
Ophiolite,
And body hair.
Lots of body hair.
invert_nexus said:
Well, that's not correct. The board members DID vote for the ID in schools, BUT .....the voters of Kansas ELECTED the board members. Presumably to represent their interests. So you see, in much the same way as our nation is run, so is it in the Kansas school system.
Baron Max
Yes. You already said that.
And. This is the time that the voters show whether or not the school board is truly representative or not.
However, as stated, intelligent design is specifically designed to rile up the religious and to vote to remove it from the schools would be tantamount to denying the existence of god.
I think that the school board overstepped itself. This is a drastic step to take without some kind of voter approval. Specific voter approval.
And. This is the time that the voters show whether or not the school board is truly representative or not.
However, as stated, intelligent design is specifically designed to rile up the religious and to vote to remove it from the schools would be tantamount to denying the existence of god.
I think that the school board overstepped itself. This is a drastic step to take without some kind of voter approval. Specific voter approval.
one_raven said:
you can be educated through experience, he has experience in,
bieng a moron
lying
corruption
war mongering
not bieng able to construct verbal sentances
appearing to not even be able to read his own speaches
saying enough bs on camera recorded to make a dvd blooper show of dumbest diplomatic leaders in there prime,
so he is educated, but peole can be educated down the wrong path.
peace.
Would you consider yourself a culturalist?
You do have a tendancy to persecute people based on their place of birth, their mannerisms, and their accent.
Personally, I wish that President Bush was a Machiavellian, bloodless athiest with a tongue that could slice through stone. It wasn't fated to be, but it doesn't make him a member Pan troglodytes like you happen to believe.
You do have a tendancy to persecute people based on their place of birth, their mannerisms, and their accent.
Personally, I wish that President Bush was a Machiavellian, bloodless athiest with a tongue that could slice through stone. It wasn't fated to be, but it doesn't make him a member Pan troglodytes like you happen to believe.
invert_nexus said:
Well, so far, all of the negative news that I've heard or read is coming from OUTSIDE of the state of Kansas. So my guess is that the board voted in accordance with the wishes of the people of Kansas.
invert_nexus said:
I agree. But why haven't we heard anything about objections from the voters/citizens of Kansas? It seems many people, in many parts of the world are upset with the vote, but few, if any, from Kansas. Why? Again, my guess is that the voters are in approval of the school board vote.
invert_nexus said:
That's nothing but idle, unfounded speculation and accusation! It might even be consider slander directed at the school board and the citizens of Kansas.
And one must remember that this is not the first time that Kansas has attempted to get ID into the schools of that state ...so to keep doing it, to keep trying, they must be serious about it AND, more to the point, they must have wide voter support.
Baron Max
Baron Max said:
They certainly weren't thinking about promoting science.
spuriousmonkey said:
Well, I don't know about that. From what I've read and heard, evolution will still be taught in the schools. As I understand it, ID will simply pick up and answer what evolution/science can't .....how did it all start ...what happened at the VERY beginning of everything ...where did the original energy come from ...where did the planet come from ...and many of those questions which evolution nor science can answer. Those with faith in god consider that they have those answers ...so why shouldn't they get a chance to explain it?
I also think many of you are wrong ...I don't think that kids are going to be FORCED to take those classes. I also don't think that they're going to be teaching any particular "religion", and I'm just sure that they aren't really going to be trying to "brainwash" the kids! ...LOL!
Just for curiosity: What do y'all think the kids will be like when they graduate from Kansas schools in, say, 10 years? Ya' think they'll be wailing religious chants and kneeling to pray five times a day? Perhaps burning "witches" in their backyards? Going on Crusades around the world to force their beliefs onto others using big guns and bombs?
Baron Max
Avatar said:
Well, about a gazillion people in the world DO believe it's true! ...just because YOU don't believe it, doesn't make it NOT true. Just because there is no "scientific proof", also doesn't mean that it's not true.
Avatar said:
Well, they just missed it be a few zeros! But that's not, I repeat, NOT what the Kansas school board is planning to teach. From my reading about this, they simply want to include the teaching of ID with the teaching of science ....not to replace science!
I wonder .....how many people would be upset if a state like, say, California, began teaching students a NEW class in how to grow Marijuana? Or Idaho decides to teach a NEW class in how to handle and shoot handguns? Would everyone get really pissed off because those classes are not approved in, say, Mass-a-two-shits?
Baron Max
Belief means shit, knowledge means everything.
Riiiiight, just some 4.5 billion years :bugeye:
ID is not science, it's fantasy,
let them then teach also world standing on four elephants standing on a tower of turtles
btw - Actually I have nothing against Kansas or other states learning these things, will be fun to watch your decline into dark ages (till you don't blow up the rest of the Earth)
At least evolution is still being thaught.
I'm scared that they'll insist that there's a God (most likely the Christian God) behind all of it, instead of merely insinuating that there's a possibility for it.
Also,
http://www.venganza.org/
I'm scared that they'll insist that there's a God (most likely the Christian God) behind all of it, instead of merely insinuating that there's a possibility for it.
Also,
http://www.venganza.org/
Baron Max said:
ID doesn't explain that either.
When I was in high school in Georgia, at my school at least, and I think it may have been the entire county, they had to put a sticker in the front of all the biology books to the effect that evolution is just a theory and has as much weight as creationism. I had a good biology teacher though, and she took questions from all the students who were concerned, said that she, like 99% of biologists accepted evolution, but that it didn't replace God, and that she herself went to church every Sunday.
For someone who is not a biologist I would say that I have a pretty good understanding of evolution and creationism and what science does and does not explain, and my school had to treat ID as an equally scientific theory. Those of us who cared enough to try to understand the truth were free to do so, and those who wanted to keep their fingers in their ears were free to do so as well. And honestly, if you are in high school and still think that evolution says that there is no God/our ancestors were all monkeys then biology is probably not the field for you. Students who are interested in actual science have more information available to them than anybody in all of human history, and those who aren't can just enjoy being ignorant. Right?
For someone who is not a biologist I would say that I have a pretty good understanding of evolution and creationism and what science does and does not explain, and my school had to treat ID as an equally scientific theory. Those of us who cared enough to try to understand the truth were free to do so, and those who wanted to keep their fingers in their ears were free to do so as well. And honestly, if you are in high school and still think that evolution says that there is no God/our ancestors were all monkeys then biology is probably not the field for you. Students who are interested in actual science have more information available to them than anybody in all of human history, and those who aren't can just enjoy being ignorant. Right?
Yes, they have a right to their opinions about the world/universe/life having a supernatural origin. They do not, however, have the right to use the government to force everyone to undergo indoctrination on their religious beliefs. I have already pointed this out three times. Are you not understanding that there is a difference between having a religious belief and having the government force that belief on everyone else? The former would be an example of you exercising your right to religious freedom. The latter would be an example of you violating other people's rights to be free from government interference in their religious beliefs.Baron Max said:
The difference here, of course, is that teaching people how to grow pot or shoot hand guns doesn't infringe on people's right to be free from government-sponsored religious indoctrination.
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spuriousmonkey said:
It's a "theory" in much the same way that evolution was a "theory" for a great many years before it became accepted as factual. The "theory" of relativity was also a "theory" long before it was accepted by science. That crippled guy who came up with a new "theory" recently is still being discussed by science and probably won't be accepted/proven for a good number of years .......but that doesn't stop people from "believing" in it, does it?
Baron Max