A simple proof Einstein got it wrong with GR

[paddoboy]

From one of your fav GR Profs? Or is it a case of having already tried, and no-one willing to bite?

You mean one of the ones that have debunked your stance in the past?
And no I havn't E-Mailed anyone, as in reality I don't believe this is worth it.
Just another anti GR forum expert.

Try reading - and digesting - my posts on p1. Or your memory is getting really bad? And try avoiding foul language - it really doesn't help.

My foul language? You mean the f*&%?
Did that upset you? C'mon q-reeus, you're a bigger man that that surely?
I mean we already have one unstable nut doing the rounds.
Oh, and as far as substance is concerned, my view aligning with what mainstream accept re GR, obviously has plenty of substance.
It still stands as unchallenged despite forum cranks.

 

[paddoboy]

Xelasnave.1947:
I posted on science issue raised in discussion. You and paddoboy made it all about the person.

Not true. The first post raising past issues and whinging, whining, insulting and general unstableness was the following post at....28, specifically designed for stirring .....

Q-reeus:

Farsight:

James R:

rpenner:


Thanks Q-reeus for this thread.

Thanks to Farsight for his quote of Einstein, as follows:


Thanks for your comments James R and rpenner.

I make reference to my earlier thread which was aimed at trying to distinguish the actual determinants of cosmological redshift, as opposed to just assuming it was all due to SR velocity of expansion and differential Doppler effects.

This is my thread of some months ago:

http://www.sciforums.com/threads/distinguishing-cosmological-expansion-frame-from-sr-frame.156053/


In my opinion it was effectively sabotaged, and discussion of the alternatives shut down before proper discussion on the actual OP alternatives got under way, by posters who were adamant in misconstruing the alternatives put by me, for consideration on their respective merits, as somehow preferring one or the other. I hope by now it will have become clear that I just posed the alternatives for consideration and discussion to eventually hone in on the actual cause and mechanism responsible rather than just assuming SR Doppler because no distinguishing possibilities between the two existed or were so far identified.

The reason I bring up my past thread is that if proper discussion was allowed to proceed then without all the prejudicial misconstruing, we may have all arrived at the answer to the question raised by Farsight's quote of Einstein above.

It appears that those who effectively shut down my earlier thread are now claiming that the GR considerations of spacetime condition is not relevant?

Yet how can this be IF there is no SR or Doppler speed differential involved in the purely gravitational scenario where light is emitted/absorbed in gravitational well positions which differ and so create different frequency/wavelength photons as per the clock rate applicable at those respective locations according to GR experimental evidence confirming such clock rate differentials exist due to gravity well position?

As far as I can ascertain, Farsight has raised a valid point in quoting Einstein in the context of clock rate and photon frequency emitting/absorbing processes which are determined by such clock rates at different gravity well radial positions.

It is now on those who disagree with Farsight to explain why in my earlier thread the possible condition of spacetime during expansion was dismissed in preference for assuming SR/Doppler causes due to expansion speeds etc, but Einstein and GR clearly present the spacetime differences in different gravity well radial positions as being the determinant not any speed or SR considerations.

Maybe if my earlier thread and discussion had not been sabotaged and shut down so early by posters who didn't really understand what was being considered, then this question raised by Farsight and Einstein quote could already have been settled?

I can only conjecture what might have come of my thread if it had not been so carelessly mistreated and ignored by those very same posters who now cannot present any SR/Doppler arguments for emission/absorption frequency differences at different GR gravity well radial positions where spacetime condition differs between the two positions according to well proven scientific evidence from relevant GR-ONLY scenario clock rate experiments excluding SR/Doppler factors.

This post after long absence has been my overt expression of disappointment at the way my earlier thread and discussion was treated by those learned members who should have known better how to read that OP and how to discuss properly without prejudicial straw man and ego based dismissals out of hand like that was.

I am not going to participate further in this thread or indeed my above earlier thread, because I have come to realize very quickly that certain groups of posters here are more interested in politics and ego than in proper discussion based on objective merits of OPs. I have no objections to obvious pseudoscience etc being moved and ignored as appropriately; but I do have strong objections to the way my earlier thread and OP alternatives were treated by learned members who should have read properly before making misconstrued and straw man responses like they did and I was helpless against because it would have involved in never ending conflict and confusion brought by those who did not want proper discussion because they has already made up their minds and beliefs rather than discussing on merits/possibilities involved.

That is my opinion on the above issue raised by Farsight-Einstein GR quote; and my personal reaction to what happened to my earlier OP and thread which taught me not to pursue any really serious discussion at this site in future; but merely make occasional comments, if at all, if and when I bother to read here, which is now seldom.

Thanks again Q-reeus, Farsight, James R and rpenner for giving me something of interest to comment on today. I will come in again next week to see how this thread gets on in the question of gravitational redshift cause and effects on photon frequency/wavelength and associated issues. See you then.

 

[paddoboy]

I am not going to participate further in this thread or indeed my above earlier thread,

Thanks again Q-reeus, Farsight, James R and rpenner for giving me something of interest to comment on today. I will come in again next week to see how this thread gets on in the question of gravitational redshift cause and effects on photon frequency/wavelength and associated issues. See you then.

The question of gravitational redshift, photon frequency and wave length are reasonanbly understood.
What do you misunderstand about them?

 

[expletives deleted]

paddoboy:

Now you can't read. Not only stupid but opens stupid mouth when obviously wrong. Now who is the "unstable nut doing the rounds", paddoboy. Oh, that's right, it's you, paddoboy. Foot in mouth syndrome; and compulsive with it. Give it a rest, paddoboy. Your tactic of just going along with the orthodoxy is all you got. If so, just post a link to your favorite person or source and be done. Why keep putting us all through your misery of repetitive spam of what we can all read for ourselves already in the science literature? Of course, then you would have no reason to be here, derailing threads using repetitive personal insults and orthodoxy links. Apologize like Xelasnave did and leave the thread and discussion alone, predictable paddoboy!

 

[Q-reeus]

You mean one of the ones that have debunked your stance in the past?

Nice vague assertion. I won't challenge for a specific example as that would lead to nicely fitting your derailing style here. Not that plenty of derailing hasn't already hopelessly diluted and sidetracked this thread. Nothing unusual there though.

And no I havn't E-Mailed anyone, as in reality I don't believe this is worth it.
Just another anti GR forum expert.

Translation; 'I don't care - GR is Truth and that's that'.

My foul language? You mean the f*&%?
Did that upset you? C'mon q-reeus, you're a bigger man that that surely?

Comment in #51: "...it really doesn't help." Why do you interpret that as me getting upset?

I mean we already have one unstable nut doing the rounds.

Good old paddoboy - ad hominem as stock-in-trade substitute for reasoned, appropriately targeted dialogue.

Oh, and as far as substance is concerned, my view aligning with what mainstream accept re GR, obviously has plenty of substance.
It still stands as unchallenged despite forum cranks.

See above. Go on, give it a whirl. Email several of your fav GR Profs. Let's see if someone out there in GR land can land a telling counter-punch.

 

[expletives deleted]

paddoboy:

The question of gravitational redshift, photon frequency and wave length are reasonanbly understood.
What do you misunderstand about them?

You are the last poster here anyone would go to for help on any science issue. You don't even understand what the issues are, let alone realize that "reasonably understood" is not equal to 'understood in fact'; which is why the discussions arise and continue until the understanding is spot on. Go for a walk and stop making a fool of yourself even in this thread, paddoboy. Just keep your mouth shut for a change. Listen and you may learn from all the points of view being discussed.

 

[paddoboy]

paddoboy:
You are the last poster here anyone would go to for help on any science issue. You don't even understand what the issues are, let alone realize that "reasonably understood" is not equal to 'understood in fact'; which is why the discussions arise and continue until the understanding is spot on. Go for a walk and stop making a fool of yourself even in this thread, paddoboy. Just keep your mouth shut for a change. Listen and you may learn from all the points of view being discussed.

A few facts for you...[Ignoring your continued instability and rage]
SR/GR, the BB, universal expansion, explains how the Universe is, but not why it is.
Very Important!
And secondly no amateur is going to rewrite accepted mainstream science from forums such as this, despite how overwhelmingly strong your agenda or anger is.
It ain't gonna happen my friend!

 

[paddoboy]

Not that plenty of derailing hasn't already hopelessly diluted and sidetracked this thread. Nothing unusual there though.

If you were honest you would address that to the chief derailer.

See above. Go on, give it a whirl. Email several of your fav GR Profs. Let's see if someone out there in GR land can land a telling counter-punch.

No bud, I don't need to.
But again, if you believe there is anything of substance to invalidate GR, then you know what to do.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Well I think that nothing I have looked at via the OP really suggests anyone has presented a better model to replace GR and that is what wins the game.
I am not even sure anything that I have read falsifies GR.
And for the record I would love to be in the crowd when someone delivers a knock out blow to the champion who has held the belt for the last 100 years.
If the paper is calling GR done for you would suspect it would have been set out very much differently.
Alex

 

[expletives deleted]

paddoboy:

A few facts for you...[Ignoring your continued instability and rage]
SR/GR, the BB, universal expansion, explains how the Universe is, but not why it is.
Very Important!
And secondly no amateur is going to rewrite accepted mainstream science from forums such as this, despite how overwhelmingly strong your agenda or anger is.
It ain't gonna happen my friend!

You have that spam 'saved' for easy repetition no doubt. How many times do you think your peabrain is going to repost that spam while ignoring the substantive discussion? Ad nauseam is likely, given your compulsive parroting and opining from the obvious orthodoxy which is being discussed to see if it is correct orthodoxy all the way or not. What a nutcase. How the management allows this boring pest and spammer is another question all its own. This site has become the site to come to if one wants to gawk at the sad delusional paddoboy stupidx2 phenomenon. Other than that it's a dead loss for science discussion, thanks to that sad phenomenon and its "likers". Ridiculous site.

 

[paddoboy]

Other than that it's a dead loss for science discussion,.

But always a step or two above our agenda laden folk and speudoscience spewers, that like to pretend they are making a difference, when all they do is create a bit of side humor.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Just keep your mouth shut for a change.

You would do well to take the advice you offer to others.
Or can you contribute?
Do you think GR has been knocked out or not.
Here is your chance to show if you understand what the thread is about.
Talk so science or crawl out on your hands and knees.
Alex

 

[Q-reeus]

Well I think that nothing I have looked at via the OP really suggests anyone has presented a better model to replace GR and that is what wins the game.
I am not even sure anything that I have read falsifies GR.

Key phrases; "I think that...", "I am not even sure..."

And for the record I would love to be in the crowd when someone delivers a knock out blow to the champion who has held the belt for the last 100 years.
If the paper is calling GR done for you would suspect it would have been set out very much differently.

The author understands how the scientific community environment works and is appropriately restrained. A wise strategy if wanting to continue to get articles published. Those with any sort of objective, informed feel for the subject will however recognize the devastating logic there as posing insuperable problems for GR.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

How the management allows this boring pest and spammer is another question all its own. This site has become the site to come to if one wants to gawk at the sad delusional paddoboy stupidx2 phenomenon. Other than that it's a dead loss for science discussion, thanks to that sad phenomenon and its "likers". Ridiculous site.

Whats upsetting you I gave you another like.
Look give it a break I am trying to discuss the OP or at least of a view point from someone who is stupid and wanting to learn and you keep throwing mud. Stop it.
Help get the thread back on track.
GR may be overthrown and you are still upset because I am the only one giving you likes.
Just like the god who is probably crawling around on his hands and knees rehearsing his appology and practising for his return.
So are you going to put a coin on the table and play some stick.
Alex

 

[expletives deleted]

paddoboy:

But always a step or two above our agenda laden folk and speudoscience spewers, that like to pretend they are making a difference, when all they do is create a bit of side humor.

What a phenomenon! Too thick for even the thickest nut soup. Laughs when he should be crying at the phenomenal levels his own stupidity have risen too in even just one day. No cure for such ingrained stupidity. What to do with the paddoboy? What to do with such compulsive stupids? What to do? Ban them for their own sanity's sake. Management?

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

"I am not even sure..."

That is my way of saying I am keeping an open mind rather than just say there is nothing to see here.
I am probably a little conservative because I have heard many claims GR is wrong.. People make claims but I would like a bit more before I burnt any GR text books, no need to rush into anything.
Alex

 

[expletives deleted]

Xelasnave.1947:

You would do well to take the advice you offer to others.
Or can you contribute?
Do you think GR has been knocked out or not.
Here is your chance to show if you understand what the thread is about.
Talk so science or crawl out on your hands and knees.
Alex

You've been hanging around and "like" paddoboy too much. It has made you as stupid as he is. I assume you once had a brain and eyes. Can't you read and think it out? I just made clear that I tried to do all that, and did so, many times already. That last thread of mine (which I linked to in my first post in this thread) got sabotaged by incompetent commenters who didn't get what the OP was about. And that was that. It was obvious from that moment that this site and some specific members were more interested in personal attacks and political ego etc tactics than serious science discussion. That experience has cured me of trying any science discussion here now while ever those same posters are allowed to do the same again and again.

If you haven't got that message yet from all I've made clear on that score, then you are just being stupid again. Maybe you can't help it now; as paddoboy's stupidity and parroting malaise has infected you too deeply to dislodge.

You only have yourself to blame for choosing to "like" obvious parrot and stupid spammer of uncomprehended material which we all knew before raising the discussions and OPs.

But I do feel for you, Xelasnave.1947. You may have been more intelligent once; but paddoboy's exposure put paid to your chances in that direction for a while at least. Best wishes for speedy recovery, Xelasnave.1947.

On Edit: Now you're getting creepy, Xelasnave.1947. Please keep your "likes" to yourself and your boy. Ok? I don't want or need or even consider your "like" as being in any way a proper substitute for you actually engaging your brain and eyes before responding. Keep your creepy "like" for those who do not object to being "liked" by stupid and creepy posters. Thanks.

 

[Q-reeus]

That is my way of saying I am keeping an open mind rather than just say there is nothing to see here.
I am probably a little conservative because I have heard many claims GR is wrong.. People make claims but I would like a bit more before I burnt any GR text books, no need to rush into anything.
Alex

I see.

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

The author understands how the scientific community environment works and is appropriately restrained. A wise strategy if wanting to continue to get articles published. Those with any sort of objective, informed feel for the subject will however recognize the devastating logic there as posing insuperable problems for GR.

Well that sounds more than reasonable.
I have done somewhat similar where you slip something into the record and once its in build upon it.
But if you are sucessful (not you specifically but who knocks out the champ) will need to come up with so much more.
What we have probably does not mean GR has been knocked out but at worst may need some bleeding stopped.
But even if presented with a worst case one needs a better model.
I think you could suggest to all of us the implication if the position you seem to be taking is the future.
Do we throw out ligo etc and go back to looking at apples falling from a tree.

Mind you Newton gravity is great, his telescope better, but you see what I mean... We will still guide space craft because we dont need GR for that.... Where do we go from here in your view.
Alex

 

[Xelasnave.1947]

Xelasnave.1947:



You've been hanging around and "like" paddoboy too much. It has made you as stupid as he is. I assume you once had a brain and eyes. Can't you read and think it out? I just made clear that I tried to do all that, and did so, many times already. That last thread of mine (which I linked to in my first post in this thread) got sabotaged by incompetent commenters who didn't get what the OP was about. And that was that. It was obvious from that moment that this site and some specific members were more interested in personal attacks and political ego etc tactics than serious science discussion. That experience has cured me of trying any science discussion here now while ever those same posters are allowed to do the same again and again.

If you haven't got that message yet from all I've made clear on that score, then you are just being stupid again. Maybe you can't help it now; as paddoboy's stupidity and parroting malaise has infected you too deeply to dislodge.

You only have yourself to blame for choosing to "like" obvious parrot and stupid spammer of uncomprehended material which we all knew before raising the discussions and OPs.

But I do feel for you, Xelasnave.1947. You may have been more intelligent once; but paddoboy's exposure put paid to your chances in that direction for a while at least. Best wishes for speedy recovery, Xelasnave.1947.

On Edit: Now you're getting creepy, Xelasnave.1947. Please keep your "likes" to yourself and your boy. Ok? I don't want or need or even consider your "like" as being in any way a proper substitute for you actually engaging your brain and eyes before responding. Keep your creepy "like" for those who do not object to being "liked" by stupid and creepy posters. Thanks.

Sorry I do not understand what point you are trying to make or are your just trying attract more "likes"
I am probably too stupid for you to try and have a meani gful discussion.
But if I have any problems I blame the god he is the problem.
I bet he is getting cranky with you the way you have been sucking up to Paddoboy and trying your best to be my friend.
We are friends now aren't we Eddy I mean you tell me things about my problems only a friend would come forward and tell you.
But again try a fesh start and lay some science on us.
I know everyone has it out for you, the site the mods maybe and of course Paddoboy but I know you dont blame me. I am just a victim, they are using me to get to you.
Look give it a go contribute something relating to science.
I cant keep replying to you and be your accomplice in thread derailment.
Alex