Zionism - What exactly is it?

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by Red Devil, Dec 7, 2010.

  1. Red Devil Born Again Athiest Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,996
    Following on from another thread, in which I got totally confused (and wrong) I would like to know, in purely laymans terms, what is Zionism and how does it affect middle eastern politics and thinking? I wrongly said somebody was anti jewish when in fact the person was anti zionist. My misguided notes on this led me to believe this was the same as semitism, which it obviously isn't. My fault.
     
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,822
    Nein, no problem. Zionism is the belief that the Reinrassig nation of Jews have a lebensraum national homeland in Palestine which gives them prior claim to it over all the untermensh indigenous peoples who are not of the Jewish faith.

    Some Jews consider antizionism as antisemitism for example, Abe Foxman, who heads the ADL in the US

    http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/foxman-is-zionism-racism-you-bet-it-is-all-nationalism-is-.html

    Most other people can tell the difference between a nationality and race based nations.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2010
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,087
    Excepting among other things of course that Jews are indigenous.
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,822
    Yeah homo sovieticus is indigenous to Canaan alright After all, Bejamin Milikovsky Netanyahu found a ring in Jerusalem with his Lithuanian Palestinian ancestors name on it. And Evet Lvovich Avigdor Liberman is a Russian Canaanite bouncer. Clearly they take precedence in the fatherland homeland of the Aryans Jews before the Palestinian refugees who were kicked out during the naqba. After all they are atheists Jews and God gave them this land! It says so right there in Der Judenstaat the Torah!
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2010
  8. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    51,727
    Historically, Zionism is the belief that Jews should have a state. Modern Zionism is the belief that the Jews should continue to rule Israel.
     
  9. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,087
    Shall I assume your categorization of Jews as a different species is merely double-irony, or the final emergence of that natural disposition of the religious extremist?
     
  10. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,822
    Call it the perusal of blogs by Israeli journalists instead

    http://ygurvitz.net/?p=72
     
  11. Red Devil Born Again Athiest Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,996
    Thanks so far. SAM: are your scored out words a dig at me? If so, I accept

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  12. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,822
    Nope not at all. When I aim them at you, there will be no doubt. Its just that as an Asian, I have to cross through the minefield of western antisemitism to express what are very obvious signs of neocolonialism to us battered post colonialists :bawl:

    Hence I am very careful to use mostly, Israeli or Jewish POV even when there are equivalent Palestinian or non-Jewish ones available. Of course, now that such Jews have also been classified as Ahusal [better known as bigot or racist] or self haters, its very confusing to make your point about basic humanitarian rights being abrogated by the Israeli government. Like Yossi above, I have determined that on principle I shall just have to learn to live with it
     
  13. Red Devil Born Again Athiest Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,996
    I am of the opinion that we are all one family in a global village, sadly the neighbours do not get along.
     
  14. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    33,264
    Zionism (Hebrew: ציונות‎, Tsiyonut) is primarily a nationalist or national liberation Jewish political movement that, in its broadest sense, has supported the self-determination of the Jewish people in a sovereign Jewish national homeland. Since the establishment of the State of Israel, the Zionist movement continues primarily to advocate on behalf of the Jewish state and address threats to its continued existence and security. In a less common usage, the term may also refer to non-political, Cultural Zionism, founded and represented most prominently by Ahad Ha'am; and political support for the State of Israel by non-Jews, as in Christian Zionism.

    Zionism does not have a uniform ideology, but has evolved in a dialogue among a plethora of ideologies: General Zionism, Religious Zionism, Labor Zionism, Revisionist Zionism, Green Zionism, etc. However, the common denominator among all Zionists is the claim to Eretz Israel as the national homeland of the Jews and as the legitimate focus for the Jewish national self-determination (as shown, among others, by Gideon Shimoni).It is based on historical ties and religious traditions linking the Jewish people to the Land of Israel.

    More...
    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...8YiwCw&usg=AFQjCNGGlGZJ-cQz4OTlQX2LHrJqnT9g3g
     
  15. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,822
    Glad to meet you. I'm a world citizen myself with my corner of the world in Mumbai and I believe in a borderless world where all people are considered as human beings sharing the same planet
     
  16. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,087
    Begs a new term also: Homo islamicus. Similar sentiments, different direction.
     
  17. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,822
  18. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,087
    Well they do say there's nothing new under the sun.
     
  19. quadraphonics Bloodthirsty Barbarian Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,391
    Most modern nations are defined in ethnic/racial terms. For example, pretty much all of Europe and the vast majority of Asia. Israel is no outlier in this sense - nothing about this would be particularly controversial if the nation in question hadn't been distributed all over the world over the previous centuries.
     
  20. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,087
    Yes, but Europe and Israel are evil, you see.
     
  21. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,822
    The "Jewish nation over the world" can be substituted by the Christian nation over the world or the Hindu nation over the world or by the Muslim nation over the world to understand why France, Mauritius and Indonesia is not the same as Israel. There are some people who think Jews should be held to a different standard, their mythology given more credo, but I fail to understand why they cannot be treated just like any other religion. Why can't Jews be civic members of society just like other religions? Why do they have to be a nation requiring a homeland even when it means evicting the natives of the place they have determined is their religious homeland? And if the latter, what is the position of Jews outside this homeland? Are they still a nation that has been distributed over the world?
     
  22. rcscwc Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    721
    Sorry SAM. Hinduism has no doctrine of establishing a Hindu nation on the world. If you can can quote a scripture I will examine it. If needed I SHALL distance myself from it. But such a doctrine is clearly there in the three desert religions.
     
  23. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,087
    Gut qvestions!

    There are people all over the world who think the same of Muslims, among other religions. What's your point here?

    Excuse me? Define in which cases this has not been so, in context.

    This is also true of other nations. How is this a specifically 'Jewish' (not Israeli) condition, Oberst?
     

Share This Page