Why Mathematics?

Discussion in 'Physics & Math' started by skyline, Apr 3, 2003.

  1. skyline Registered Senior Member

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    What is exceptional bout mathematics as a language?

    Is it the only way to describe nature?
     
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  3. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    <i>What is exceptional bout mathematics as a language?</i>

    Its precision.

    If you have a set of axioms and a proof which follows mathematically from those axioms, nobody can argue that your proof is not valid. There is nothing equivocal about a mathematical theorem. It is either true or false. There's no room for debate - a proof settles the issue one way or the other.

    When applied to the real world, the validity of results derived using maths rests solely on the validity of the axioms - the assumptions made in the mapping of the real world onto the world of the mathematics.

    <i>Is it the only way to describe nature?</i>

    No, but it is really the only effective way to quantify nature. And quantification is the basis of all solid science.
     
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  5. skyline Registered Senior Member

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    James R
    Do you mean by Its precision that it will always give a (true, false) judgments?

    Then why it is not possible to use it in describing subjective experiences?

    Can I conclude from this sentence that all phenomena should be quantified before Mathmatizing it?
     
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  7. hlreed Registered Senior Member

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    Mathematics is a language, that is a system of objects and actions. Its origins are counting. Quantizing is counting. Since mathematics is a restricted language, we can talk about it in verbal languages. There is no meta language so we can talk about verbal languages as a system, although we may create a math to do that.
    To do math, you read something, abstract it, rearrange it, and write out the result. This is also how brains work.
    The universe appears to be a mathematical machine. Nature does arithmetic. That is why we can describe nature with mathematics.
     
  8. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    skyline:

    <i>Do you mean by Its precision that it will always give a (true, false) judgments?</i>

    Using mathematics, it is always possible to show whether a conclusion is true or false, based on the basic assumptions made in deriving the result. If the assumptions are garbage, any predictions derived from them will be garbage, too. That's why the assumptions of all the best theories are very simple - so that evrybody agrees they are valid.

    <i>Then why it is not possible to use it in describing subjective experiences?</i>

    Subjective experiences are not accessible to objective analysis, by definition. Any science based on them must be based on second-hand accounts of the experiences rather than direct observation. Nevertheless, statistically significant results can be derived by collating the experiences of a number of different people.

    <i>Can I conclude from this sentence that all phenomena should be quantified before Mathmatizing it?</i>

    What do you mean by "mathmatizing"?
     
  9. wesmorris Nerd Overlord - we(s):1 of N Valued Senior Member

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    That was very well put.
     
  10. On Radioactive Waves lost in the continuum Registered Senior Member

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    Let me take this oppurtunity to point out, that after 200 years, the Reiman hypothesis has neither been proven to be true or false.
     
  11. Blindman Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,425
    Can mathematics prove that this program will ever exit..
    Code:
    line 10 goto line 10
    line 20 end
    
    NO it cant..

    Or what about the traveling sales man problem..

    We know of many problems that math just does not seem to handle…

    There has to be a higher language then math… (I hope)…
     
  12. Blindman Valued Senior Member

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    1,425
    One more thing..


    Solve the problem of infinity.

    Irrational numbers make Math a kludge.
     
  13. qfrontier Captain Of Starship Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    114
    Math is just another language, when you really understand it, its a really beautiful mix with physics
     
  14. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    39,426
    ORW:

    <i>Let me take this oppurtunity to point out, that after 200 years, the Reiman hypothesis has neither been proven to be true or false.</i>

    And your point is ... ?


    Blindman:

    <i>Can mathematics prove that this program will ever exit.. [snip]

    NO it cant..</i>

    Why can't it?

    <i>Or what about the traveling sales man problem..</i>

    What about it?

    <i>We know of many problems that math just does not seem to handle…</i>

    The travelling salesman problem isn't one of them.

    <i>Solve the problem of infinity.</i>

    What's the problem of infinity?

    <i>Irrational numbers make Math a kludge.</i>

    How so?
     
  15. skyline Registered Senior Member

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    38
    James R

    To Mathmatize something is to describe its behavior by mathematics..

    This word has no root in the dictionary
     
  16. inam Registered Member

    Messages:
    11
    Just tell me...

    One obligation at this point :
    To solve any question of Mathmatics we have alot number of ways to do it.But in some cases the result of our way is wrong whyyyyy ????
    sorry if my question is so weak to be asked.

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