Who's to blame for the US financial situation?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by BenTheMan, Jul 11, 2011.

?

Blame somebody:

Poll closed Aug 31, 2011.
  1. Democrats

    50.0%
  2. Republicans

    50.0%
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  1. BenTheMan Dr. of Physics, Prof. of Love Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    8,966
    Let's see how this goes over.

    1.) Two sentences max.

    2.) One sentence must be a fact, one sentence may be an opinion.

    3.) You must post a link to support your fact.

    Example:

    The non-partisan CBO projects that entitlement spending (as a percentage of GDP) will more than double by 2050, and Democrats refused to budge on reforming the funding of these programs. Arrested Development is the greatest series ever.
     
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  3. BenTheMan Dr. of Physics, Prof. of Love Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    8,966
    MODS: Meant to post a poll here, can you help a brotha out?

    Two choices, Dems and Republicans.

    Thanks!
     
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  5. joepistole Ordo Ad Chao Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    18,283
    It would help if you obeyed your own rules. Your reference is from the very partisan Heritage group that claims to be referencing CBO data. That is not very honest. And the Heritage Group is not a very reliable source. So if you want to play this game. I think you need to use credible sources. If you don't then you will have any number of people posting garbage from right wing nut web sites and claiming it is truth when clearly it is not.

    http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/78xx/doc7851/03-08-Long-Term Spending.pdf
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2011
  6. Telemachus Rex Protesting Mod Stupidity Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    249
    There were multiple causes (rather than a single or even single predominant cause) the importance of each of which is disputed. Source: I cant't post links yet, but see Jickling, Mark, "Causes of the Financial Crisis," CRS Report for Congress, April 9, 2010.

    Anybody who tells you they "know" "the cause" of the current dire straits is either a fool or is trying to get you to buy into his or her pet policy position.
     
  7. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    32,992
    Greed


    Greed is an excessive desire to possess wealth or goods with the intention to keep it for one's self. Greed is inappropriate expectation. However, greed is applied to a very excessive or rapacious desire and pursuit of wealth, status, and power.
    As a secular psychological concept, greed is an inordinate desire to acquire or possess more than one needs or deserves, especially with respect to material wealth.

    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...36nGDQ&usg=AFQjCNHUXHP3DDlyGbKQXT5VrovL6kz5_g

    All politcians were and are involved with making this problem because they all fall into this definition. Every congressperson can vote "no" but few ever do.:mad:
     
  8. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

    Messages:
    23,433
    The morons who invented the subprime mortgage. They don't understand business, economics, or math.
     
  9. iceaura Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    17,647
    We are assigning blame, not fixing a single "cause".

    As the OP clearly is not serious about the "fact" and "link" part (posting irrelevant bullshit linked to well-established propaganda sources), we are free to respond more or less as our best understanding would indicate.

    The people and ideologies in control of the relevant circumstances would be the first candidates for blame. That would be the Federal level Congressional leadership since about 1978, and if Partisan considerations are considered, the entire Republican Party and all of its supporters during that time.
    Subprime mortgages have been made routinely and successfully for hundreds of years.

    Even in modern times, they were no trouble at all for fifty years under the New Deal banking regulations. Routinely made, routinely paid at higher interest to cover the extra risk.

    And the recent small uptick in the rate of defaults on them in the US did not involve nearly enough money to bring down the international financial system, or even crash the five largest US banks as happened. We need a cause or causes in some way commensurate in scale to the events.
     
  10. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

    Messages:
    31,516
    GOP punching America's doughnut

    Budget-conscious Republicans helped raise the debt ceiling for President Bush seven times without a whimper. They ought to think about the increased interest payments that resulted from the last default in 1979.
    ____________________

    Notes:

    Poe, Catherine. "Are debt worried Republicans "rebels with a cause" or dangerous?". The Washington Times. July 10, 2011. Communities.WashingtonTimes.com. July 11, 2011. http://communities.washingtontimes....10/are-republicans-rebels-cause-or-dangerous/

    Dennis, Brady. "Delayed payments in 1979 offer glimpse of default consequences". The Washington Post. July 10, 2011. WashingtonPost.com. July 11, 2011. http://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...consequences/2011/07/10/gIQARRBj7H_story.html
     
  11. Rhaedas Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,516
    I wish the solution was as easy as the poll makes it out to be.
     
  12. billvon Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,428
    And the "morons" who got subprime mortgages, or who invested in mortgage backed securities, or who bought houses they could barely afford with any sort of mortgage. In other words, most of us.
     
  13. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,300
    I see several people sort of hitting the target - but only around the edges with nothing striking the bulls-eye.

    It's absolutely amazing how quickly you folks have forgotten the CDO (collateralized debt obligation) mess!!!! THAT was the real cause that built the bubble that was BOUND to eventually burst. You could fairly well compare it to dozens of Ponzi schemes running in parallel.

    Just to jog your memory: Several large (and many smaller) financial institutions bundled practically worthless subprime and toxic loans and sold them to each other and individual investors. And when the house of cards started to fall, it was like a large scale avalanche - no way to stop or control it.
     
  14. spidergoat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    48,085
    If I may be succinct: the rich. The rich are to blame for lobbying for deregulation and tax loopholes, for starving the education system, for promoting ignorance of global warming and the energy crises. We let them get away with it because their money pays for elections.
     
  15. Me-Ki-Gal Banned Banned

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    4,641
    And you fuckers stole my future while you did it fuckers . Every body was a fucking contractor . Funny thing I kept telling all of you ( Who would ever listen , IT IS GOING TO CRASH , BAIL OUT NOW , THE SHIP IS GOING DOWN . But Me being Like the good Captain could only go down with ship . It sank and now you got to live with Davey Jones crawling out of the deep like the lochnest, except he is called Flat Head around this parts "and he is pissed" O.K. who be the locust in the bible if the Beatles are the 4 horse Man . Ah look in the mirror Locust
     
  16. Me-Ki-Gal Banned Banned

    Messages:
    4,641
    How bout Barnie Frank and Nancy Pelosi and the back door deal they made with Freddy Mac and Fanny Mae . Oh don't let my ears deceive me. I heard then lie about it and say " Stick with Me everything is going to be O.K. . Make more loans . How much are those to in big trouble ? Still are
     
  17. Me-Ki-Gal Banned Banned

    Messages:
    4,641
    P.M.I. anybody ? Privet Mortgage Insurance. No collateral house buying. Now you got big trouble cause it violates all banking principle. You do and shit happens . Evey fucking real estate person learns this , but when the money is to tempting like a beautiful woman to a Man with a hard on . What you going to do ?
     
  18. spidergoat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    48,085
    Fanny and Freddy are not the problem. The problem was that Wall Street paid off the government to allow them to operate their bizarre schemes so that banks didn't care who they loaned money to because the loans would just be sold off, packaged in bundles and sold off with fake ratings.
     
  19. Me-Ki-Gal Banned Banned

    Messages:
    4,641
    That is bull shit Spidey . I am one of those rich Developers you slander. You don't have a clue I am sorry to say . You pick scape goats to hang on the cross . I will not be the scape goat anymore . You can live with all your laws and there is plenty more coming down the pike . You could say there is an escalation of do good initiatives with side effects that paralyze economies. You know what that does don't you ? It drives activity under ground . It makes for non conformance . Did you ever think we could reach the day when no one is compliant( Oh yeah that is how Jesus lovers look at things )
     
  20. spidergoat ... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    48,085
    I have no idea if you are serious.
     
  21. Me-Ki-Gal Banned Banned

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    4,641
    Bull shit Spidey , They Guarantee Under collateralize loans . They are in big trouble because of it . They are Intimately tied to the Housing Market . You tell Me if that is not right with all your Real _ Estate experience bro
     
  22. Me-Ki-Gal Banned Banned

    Messages:
    4,641
    I am serious as a fucking heart attack bro . Fuck Me any way
     
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