What does religion do for mankind that the statement "Be kind" doesn't do better?

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Seattle, Apr 7, 2019.

  1. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    It was never lost.
    To you, perhaps. To the beneficiary, it's meaningful any way they can get what they need.
    You mean, under threat from religion or for an advantage in community appreciation?
    Either way, the beneficiary gets what they need and your ego is secondary.
    That applies equally to church and secular charities.
    Either way, the beneficiary gets what they need.
    And this is a problem, why? Religions have sprung up from the worship of much worse things.
     
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  3. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Well, I wasn't denying that; I even added one myself.

    I was responding to Bowser, who somehow managed to turn not having to pay for the privilege of being kind into a sort of miserliness.
     
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  5. Capracus Valued Senior Member

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    I don’t deny using philosophy, I just don’t refer to it as a method to positively connect to actual things. How does philosophy allow one to make a positive connection to actual divine beings?
    The examples of authority you cite above all produce tangible results. Cite an example of a religious authority that could provide an unquestionable connection to a supernatural deity.
    Like I mentioned above, these authorities you list do produce empirically valid results.
    A rational observer.
    Ideally the merit of particular case is decided on the quality of the evidence presented. How would you convince an objective judge that you have an actual connection to a specific deity?
    Atheists realize that giving a god credit for anything, good or bad is folly, because the theists has no reasonable way of demonstrating the connection of a god to either.
     
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  7. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    The premise was: It is better to give people the protection of the law than not to give them the protection of the law.

    By analogy, a Kevlar vest may not always be effective but it is better to have one and not need it than to need one and not have it.
     
  8. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    Yes indeed, your example was silly. You have not shown that mine is.
     
  9. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    Asking for the difference between two obviously disparate things is silly. If you want to take your question out of the realm of the silly, you will have to explain the similarity, as you see it. Otherwise the whole exercise just becomes an opportunity to ask further silly questions.
    "So how long does it take to eat a car?"
    "What if one made a miniature car too small for a pineapple"
    ... and so it goes on.
     
  10. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    Depends entirely whether the system is simply being rorted to protect criminals. History is full of narrations where the contemporary law of the day was thoroughly rejected for the greater good or whatever .... Hence the slide of the slope.
     
  11. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Unless they're not disparate - say, when it comes to their efficacy in healing, or bestowing wealth, and prosperity.

    You know perfectly well what he's asking. Why is it that God-believers are unable to just come out and say "there is a statistically significant degree of improved health and welfare directly correlated with praying - and here's the link to the researh paper" - or some such thing.

    Why is manifestation of God as mysterious - even to God-believers - as ESP and ghosts?

    You won't answer this directly. Because it has to be magical. And smoke and mirrors.
     
  12. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    Because healing, bestowing wealth and prosperity are symptoms of the efficacy of a connection to God?
    How do you figure that?

    So far it seems to be yet another exercise in silliness, courtesy of our resident atheists.
     
  13. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I don't. But I'm open your offering of symptoms of a connection to God. That's kind of what SSB is asking.

    So, no response then. Noted. Chalk another one up for atheists.

    There is really little point in you engaging, if, on any of the tough questions, you just holler 'silly' and then don't answer. If, as you've suggested elsewhere, God can only be discussed on the terms you set, then you're not discussing; you're preaching.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
  14. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    Has anyone noticed?
    Kind people tend to give everyone, even cruel people, the benefit of a doubt and the protection of the law; go out of their way not to blame anyone unfairly.
    Religious apologists tend to go out of their way to misrepresent and denigrate atheists; to blame them even for things they didn't say or do.
    Why are the defenders of religion so frightened of those who disagree with them?
    I do believe that's the one constant; the one thing religion does better by far than kindness: instill fear.
     
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  15. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    The problem with that steaming heap of fallacious excrement is that it advocates cruelty, and does nothing to guard against it because cruelty is its purpose.

    The juxtaposition of kindness and religion as opposite, per your second and third paragraphs, is inappropriate. That kind of bigotry does nobody any good. Or maybe it does: Did you feel better for a few seconds for having said it? Was that worth it?
     
  16. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    That's exactly why we have to set a high standard. Be kinder than we need to be.
     
  17. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    To which of the many heaps of fallacious excrement does this purely unbiased comment refer?

    There was none such. The OP question invites comparison between what the injunction "Be kind" and religious dogma, respectively, offer mankind.
    My comparison was between the advocates of these two guiding principles, as manifest on the forum (in specific reference to Musika's frequent attacks on atheists, but others' also, if the shoe fits) not the principles themselves.
    Do you mean to deny that religion instills fear in people more effectively than kindness does?
    If so, I would like some proof.
    I never feel any differently before and after an observation i believe to be accurate.
    I can afford a few seconds' wasted typing.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
  18. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    If it's obvious, you should be able to show the disparity. If you can't show the disparity, it isn't obvious.
    Rubbing crystals and expecting miracles can not be demonstrated to work reliably. Praying to God and expecting miracles can not be demonstrated to work reliably. That's the similarity.

    Now you. Show us the difference.
     
  19. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    Well let's hope you bring more to the party than the legal system.
     
  20. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    You've lost me.
    Rubbing crystals causes miracles?
    You don't sometimes find yourself eating a pineapple when you to find your car, do you?
     
  21. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    Reads like an onion article.
     
  22. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    Truth is where you find it.
     
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  23. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    You have enough time to respond with snarks, but not enough to be sincere.
     

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