# What can be discovered, will be discovered?

Discussion in 'Intelligence & Machines' started by Syzygys, Dec 2, 2006.

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1. ### SyzygysAs a mother, I am telling youValued Senior Member

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This subdirectory has so few entries....

Anyway, I thought I would start a philosophical discussion on discoveries,inventions in science.
Somebody mentioned Einstein (or Edison) in another thread, what if he hadn't been born? Well, the short answer to that question, that humankind sooner or later would have done the same discoveries, it could have been just a question of time, and maybe who else makes that particular discovery.

A simple and quick evidence for it would be the invention of the radio. Marconi and that Russian guy Popov invented it INDEPENDENTLY from each other pretty much at the same time.(let's throw in the Indian Chandra Bose too) Another example is the discovery of non-Euclidean geometry by Bolyai and also by Lobachevsky.

So it seems that what can be discovered, will be discovered. Of course, it is also possible that humankind seriously overlooks something and never discovers it. But of course, we wouldn't know...

3. ### RomanBannedBanned

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Edison had a lot of patents, but they weren't all his inventions. He patented his employees invetions as his own. Edison was a real douchebag. That's why Tesla and he had a falling out.

Then Edison electrocuted Topsy the elephant to get back at Tesla.

5. ### SyzygysAs a mother, I am telling youValued Senior Member

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It is all nice, but really has nothing to do with the topic...

7. ### draqonBannedBanned

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Mr. Syzygys....please refer to *that russian guy Popov as Mr. Popov.

As to what will be discovered: link between gravity, electromagnetic force, strong and weak forces, and other forces will be discovered...thus paving way to antigravity.

8. ### RomanBannedBanned

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Nothing to do with the topic?
Think critically. See if the information I provided could possibly support your hypothesis.

Maybe someone could give him a hand?

9. ### SyzygysAs a mother, I am telling youValued Senior Member

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Just for your sake I will try:

I asked a philosophical question and provided a few examples. You had a little extra fact concerning my example. It might be interesting, but rather irrelevant to the original question.. The examples were there just to prove that things are being/can be discovered parallel by more than one person thus sooner or later things can be discovered if one, let's say Mr. Popov would have never lived.

So the question is still: What can be discovered, will be discovered??

Think critically...

10. ### RomanBannedBanned

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Inventions are often parallel discoveries.
Leibniz and Newton with the calculus, for example.

11. ### madanthonywayneMorning in AmericaStaff Member

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Sometimes, a discovery is a straight line continuation of existing knowledge and it's discovery is practically inevitable. But other times, someone has an insight no one else had and sends things in a whole new direction.

12. ### kmguruStaff Member

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Somethings may not be discovered ...or more accurately may not be manufactured because of cost. For example, Microsoft spent $10 Billion to make Vista that is an incremental improvement on XP...but no one will spend$15 Billion to build the first Hot Fusion reactor even though we know the fundamentals....

Similarly no one will build a stand alone artificial intelligence computer - because it would cost too much. The Japanese gave up long ago. But once wideband internet is available to Billions of computers - a evolutionay virus could morph to an intelligent entity in a matter of months.

We still have not played with massive magnets (MegaTesla?). When we do, who knows, we could punch holes in space...move products from Tokyo to New York in a few seconds or make deserts green.

The point is if the discovery needs a lot of money, then that discovery is doomed.

13. ### mackmackRegistered Senior Member

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this is why they say al gore is the inventor of the internet. because he signed the bill to fund the massive project. if he didn't the internet may not be around today. although he had nothing to do with the ideas and technical stuff he provided the money and resources to bring that technology to the world.

14. ### nerxRegistered Member

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Einstein once said that he is quite sure that had he not made his discoveries, someone else would have...

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16. ### SyzygysAs a mother, I am telling youValued Senior Member

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OK, so the lack of funding is a good point.

Here is a philosophical point: It is simply impossible to know what we are missing out on, because well, they just not happening. Let's say antigravitation could be possible somehow, but humankind failed to prove it and discover it, so we will just never know, that we missed it...

17. ### kmguruStaff Member

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Sorry, I did not see that. Looks like my monetary estimation is right on! As long as those people are ready to quickly commercialize the research, we will be OK...if not, we will never hear the end of it....

18. ### shakushinnenRegistered Senior Member

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Hi Syzygys,
Yes, it would seem to be the case, certainly in modern times. I think that it depends on the proliferation of convergent technologies. When several countries are technologically advanced to the same degree, then the likelihood is that they'll all reach the same point around the same time. I'm thinking that this phenomenum was not so prevalent in ancient times, when countries were more isolated and not technologically advanced to the same degree. It's an interesting point.
This raises an interesting question. Assuming that (big leap here) the human race were to evolve all over again, from the same world, would it be the same as it is today?
John

Last edited: Dec 14, 2006
19. ### SyzygysAs a mother, I am telling youValued Senior Member

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Probably yes. I am trying to think of a major discovery or lack of it that could change the path of evolution, but nothing comes to my mind...

20. ### draqonBannedBanned

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...lack of evolution perhaps? maybe humans with all the surgeries...and artificial organs...are stopping evolution in its tracks by allowing crappy organisms pass their genes to the future generation...so that all genes get passed and noone doesnt pass their genes.

21. ### SaunaBannedBanned

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If it is possible to conceive a discovery, that is already the discovery, there being no hard and fast division between the conception and the implementation.

22. ### SyzygysAs a mother, I am telling youValued Senior Member

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By path of evolution I meant evolution of discoveries. Sorry for the ambiguity.

Well, as an example, antigravity. Just because we talk about it, until someone can prove it mathematically or better yet, build a machine, it is still not "discovered".

23. ### EndLightEndThis too shall pass.Registered Senior Member

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Discovery itself is inevitable. If we never discovered anything, even on accident, we would be in a stagnant prehistoric society. This question could also be phrased, 'What can be learned, will be learned', and the human race has always been curious =).
Geniuses just speed up the process.