MacM, Just one question, 'smart guy': How on earth this 8.5 minutes of delay for sun ray to reach earth has anything to do with relativity, since earth and sun are more or less in the same inertial reference frame? You are such an ignorant, MacM. How much do you understand relativity actually? Time delation has been observed countless of times for elementary particles as well as for real (atomic) clocks and you still refused to accept it. When you drive from Texas to NY, carrying a stopwatch in your pocket, theoretically this stopwatch would run slower than your reference stopwatch you kept at home. You would -- theoretically -- find that your travelling stopwatch a small fraction of a second slower than your reference stopwatch after you return home. Or, you don't believe that, even theoretically? In that case, I would say it is a waste of time discussing relativity with you.