He's supposed to be perfect - where's his promotional material --------------- That material....His word is part of himself and the most powerfull force in the universe. Needless to say; He is not "trying" to sell it or even give it away. Mater of fact He has hidden it and Himself from the eyes of man. There is a purpose for the way everything has been done.
Is it hidden... or just not there? I know you can't say because it's by definition hidden from you. But he did want the Bible to exist surely? Or is it a form of ancient paparazzi journalism? You are spreading the good news, but you sound like a freaky fortune teller when you get all mysterious and vague like that. That's what people say when they don't have a proper answer.
Interesting. I might disagree with this. If religion is the holding of beliefs based on faith, then is not free inquiry complete anathema to this position? Really, if one engages in and is encouraged to question all of nature without regard to authority, then how can anything akin to religion survive?
I know you can't say because it's by definition hidden from you ---------------- Speculation, to your own hurt.... It is hidden from "man" or the multitudes in general but revealed to His called out ones. Let me give you a couple of examples.... He asked Peter; "who do you say that I am?" Peter said "thou art the Christ the son of the living God" He said then to Peter; "Flesh and blood hath not REVEALED this, but your father who art in heaven hath REVEALED it. Things are not spiritually discerned by the carnal mind of the flesh. Satan can operate there, even as he did later in Peter when Jesus told him...."Satan get thee behind me" Also, after speaking to the multitudes in parables, the disciples asked him; why do you not speak to the people plainly..? He said to them; "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but unto them it has not been given." See the soverinty of God...He is dealing with two groups. The children of the devil and the children of God are mixed together here in this mortal world.....for the purpose of training, and maturing of the children of God. (remember the parable of the wheat and the tares) A table has been spead for his people in the presence of their enemies. They are dining on the word of God, revealed by God. This is now the "day of the Lord", it has started. He is raising His people up, and calling them by name. They "in that day" shall all be taught of God. While there is a famine elsewhere, and all the tables (churches of the world, where people go to "feed" on the word of God) are full of vomit. If you can see this....you may see many things. I'm not being purposly mysterious, God is, to some and speaking plainly to others.
In a nutshell, I'd answer (if I were a theist): I believe in a god that initiated the universe but remains intentionally hidden from us (at least during our normal lives). No revelatory truths, no holy books, no moral edicts, nothing. There is nothing in such a belief that would preclude me from studying nature with all the tools at my disposal. In fact I could say that God intended for us to learn all natural truths from science, since it is obviously what works best. But for some reason he has chosen not to reveal himself. In fact I think that is exactly how Martin Gardner would answer you. I know you don't like such thinking personally, but does that sort of make sense?
------------------ Yes, it does.......... Read my post above about God "hiding" Himself. Religion is not of God...it's a covering, like the animal skins of Adam and Eve, they were ashamed...... God has revealed Himself through gifted chosen vessels called prophets and those words are in a book. A description of His spirit, and what it did and would do in flesh. He hides himself from the masses and reveals himself unto "babes"...individuals, such as are willing to learn... God is the Word made flesh.. He is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
But at least you're clear he exists then? I'm not at all convinced by "Some people hearing the word". Having worked in psychiatry for a number of years, hearing the word is also called "psychosis". If it is significant that only a few people are chosen then there's as much evidence of aliens existing. Look. "God" wants his "children" saved I presume. So why in His name does he not just come out with it? Why does he mainly choose mad people? Why do people get more religious when they have Frontal Lobe Epilepsy? Perhaps "God" is a human condition. I'm sure Peter thought Jesus was the son of God because Jesus gave him some pretty big hints. But Jesus knew that if he said that to "the masses" then his ultimate "sacrifice" would have come a bit sooner. Just one more thing. I am not worried about God existing or not. I am open minded about it - just not in the least convinced at the moment. "TheVisitor", are you just as open minded? What if he doesn't exist, or you've picked the "wrong" God and you don't get to live with him?
I appreciate your openness, I wasn't raised on a church step... I looked at many religions and denominations within christianity before God revealed His plan to me. Life is passed through the body in the natural... So it stands to reason that life (eternal life) is passed through the body of Christ in the spiritual also. Someone with that life speaks with you the words of life, and you recognise it's of God. Organized religions of Christianty don't have life to give... They only make church members, adding more baptists, methodists, or pentecostals, ect... I'm still open minded...and still learning but I haven't picked the wrong God...I didn't pick Him at all.... He picked me, and came looking for me in the midst of my lost wanderings. If you hear the truth you will know....theres something that rings true in your soul. A deep calling to the deep within you... You'll know. Thats a pretty good thought I admit... The Jews were pretty jealous about the're beliefs for sure, but Jesus wasn't worried about them. He disappeared in their midst while they were looking to kill Him once before. He did what the Father (Spirit) showed Him in obedience. He knew the appropriate timing and the sign for the time to go. When the gentiles came looking, saying; "sirs we would see Jesus"...it was time to go. He was only sent to the lost sheep of Israel as a prophet....even though He was a sacrifice to all nations..... His revealing to the Gentiles as son of man, was yet two thousand years away. (mal.4:5-6)(Rev 10:1-7)Mal. 3 is John the baptist's ministry, Mal. 4 is a prophet coming to the gentiles fore-runing the son of man's revealing from heaven, in a time just before the earth "burns as an oven". Rev. 10: 1-7 is Christ revealed as the son of man from heaven while this gentile prophet is on earth to introduce Him. The King has a porter to introduce his arrival.Thats why John came before Him the first time. This may just seem like another story unless you check out the fact that it has happened and is happenning, just that way. Just current events today.
you were talking to yourself, go to the docs your may have bipolar disorder. it seems your hallucinating. why do you keep preaching, to deaf ears. do you realise Revelation and Apocalypse are the same word and have the same meaning in ancient greek.
Yeah, well Noah held the door open till the last minite. This is about your last minite..... You see Russia over in the middle east "saber rattling", they warned us not to go into Iran, they've got financial interests there. A bible prophet, a "seer", 50 years ago said when Russia goes down for the oil....America gets nuked... His visions were never wrong... But that really doesn't mean your even guaranteed to wake up tomorrow, even if the rest of the world does... Do you realize that?.
Yes! But that description is a far cry from what I call religion. I suppose that's whay they call it "deism". I completely applaud the deists (even though it's still irrational) because they have no organized group/dogma dedicated to saving everyone from their evil selves.
50 years ago Russia was the USSR, things have change somewhat since then, wake up. well they are now. oh but of course, that is the only intelligent thing you've said, ever. theres over nine million ways to die why worry about one.
Perhaps I have done myself a huge disservice by using the term religious far too loosely in this forum, then. To me, if an idea has anything to do with god, gods, revelation, or faith, it's a religious concept. That includes deism and Martin Gardner's fideism. And please bear in mind that when I defend a notion of religion, what I am defending is strictly this kind of perrsonal and private belief that is not used as an excuse for mob idiocy. I despise organized religion as much as any atheist here does. I despise the institution. I try not to despise the individual practioners, unless they give me cause. Which many do. But some do not. I live in Minnesota, where I am surrounded by easy-going, liberal Lutherans. I don't have a problem with most of them. But I used to live in rural Kansas, where people literally had signs in their yards warning of hellfire. Which was the main reason I got the fuck out of Kansas, Dorothy, and moved to Minnesota where fewer people have their heads up their asses.
No, I didn't mean to imply that. If he exists, he is an idiot. I'd be ashamed to have the god of the bible as my "savior." I'm agnostic.
Is that what they are spouting these days? When I was southern baptist, there were a few other requirements. I really feel sorry for them. Sounds like some are wasting a lot of potential on a god that may or may not exist.
