tony1, Sir Loone, and anyone else that wants to chime in.

Now give me a break...you know exactly what I meant. Is there a difference between Paul finding shelter waiting him at every port and Jim Baker haveing 3 mansions and 4 summer homes? You must plan to plead ignorance in judgement, 'cause you are building one hell of a good case for it.

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) Sheeesh I still ain't figured out what we are discussing this for, we have yet to actually disagree. But it is good to keep the senses sharp, I'll consider it an exersize in intellect. LOL

 

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both are materialistic but one is the reward of fraud.

Ben

 

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I'm pissing myself laughing.......

"But it is good to keep the senses sharp, I'll consider it an exersize in intellect"


Two people discussing the depths of their delusions is now an exercise in intellect, ROFLMAO!!! at least you christains are still good for a laugh.

 

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) Hey a good debater could argue the color of rice. Hello, nice to meet ya!

 

I don't doubt it...

and nice to meet you.

 

*Originally posted by Taken
Well I am sitting down right now to write the home office and start bitching, cause I know 12 men who got seriously jipped.*

Are you on some kind of drugs?
They got to be the foundation of the Church.
Besides, did you notice how they paid their taxes with a gold coin?
Did you notice what their response was when Jesus said a camel could fit thru the eye of a needle easier than rich men could get into heaven?
They cheered, and said, "we're a shoo-in?"

Er, no, they didn't. They got seriously concerned.

When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
(Matthew 19:25, KJV).

*Paul, and John are sure to be pissed when they realize they missed that fine print in the contract,*

You mean the guy who wrote...?

But I have all, and abound: I am full, having received of Epaphroditus the things which were sent from you, an odour of a sweet smell, a sacrifice acceptable, wellpleasing to God.
(Philippians 4:18, KJV).

Or...?

Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.
(3 John 1:2, KJV).

What's this "above all things?"
Could that mean above such things as being broke, and pretending that that is piousness?

*and Stephen, my goodness what of poor Stephen, stoned and his clothing stolen!*

He's due for a pretty big reward.

*they did have many brethren, sinners all over the land welcomed them into their homes and fed and helped cloth them.*

You seem confused.
What sinner fed the thousands with a few loaves and fishes?

*They had a home among common men any where they traveled.*

They had a home among Jews who actually were their brethren.
Perhaps you are unaware of the following scriptures...

Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.
(Luke 22:36, KJV).

*Not one of them died in a palace, and each did far more for the promotion of the gospel in half a life than you have ever dreamed.*

What about the other people who did more for the gospel in half a life than you ever dreamed?

Abraham and Lot...
And the land was not able to bear them, that they might dwell together: for their substance was great, so that they could not dwell together.
(Genesis 13:6, KJV).

When's the last time you heard of two men of God who couldn't live in the same country because they had so much stuff?

David...
So David gave to Ornan for the place six hundred shekels of gold by weight.
(1 Chronicles 21:25, KJV).

That's a pile of gold.

Solomon...
And when the queen of Sheba heard of the fame of Solomon concerning the name of the LORD, she came to prove him with hard questions.
And she came to Jerusalem with a very great train, with camels that bare spices, and very much gold, and precious stones: and when she was come to Solomon, she communed with him of all that was in her heart.
And Solomon told her all her questions: there was not any thing hid from the king, which he told her not.
And when the queen of Sheba had seen all Solomon's wisdom, and the house that he had built,
And the meat of his table, and the sitting of his servants, and the attendance of his ministers, and their apparel, and his cupbearers, and his ascent by which he went up unto the house of the LORD; there was no more spirit in her.
(1 Kings 10:1-5, KJV).

When's the last time you saw someone go to a preacher's house with truckloads of gold and faint with embarrassment, because there was already more there than was brought?

*You serve the Lord for the promise of earthly wealth and prosperity, while you have no regard for the damage you do to the lost and in need?*

Give it a rest, dude.
What do you think those "in need" are in need of?
Poverty, hunger and misery?
Or do you think money might help a bit?

What kind of gospel is it to the poor to say, "Good news! You get to stay poor even longer! Yea!"
Are you nuts, or just very religious?

And it hath come to pass, in that day, Turned is his burden from off thy shoulder, And his yoke from off thy neck, And destroyed hath been the yoke, because of prosperity.
(Isaiah 10:27, YLT).

*You are blasphemous! How dare you assert yourself as a living testimony to God.*

Aside from the fact that I didn't actually assert that, you should consider reading the Bible once in a while.
And quit calling believers blasphemers, you'll live longer that way.

 

Cris,

***Blonde,

Thanks for explaining your position. Based on labels we appear to have opposing views. But judging from your demeanor I don’t think we are necessarily enemies.

I hope to see more of you around the forums.
Cris***

You are welcome. Yes, we do perceive life differently but I hope you do not consider me to be a potential enemy. If I have any enemies at all it is not by my choosing.

By the way, the quiz results show me as being of the Orthodox Quaker faith. My new label is "Friend". Thanks.

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Tony said....."They had a home among Jews who actually were their brethren. "

I now ask......

Paul was called to the ministry of the Gentiles... and so he didn't always find himself among Jews, did he?

Were they (the Gentiles) his bretheren?
I seem to recall him being around and welcomed by many non-Jews.

Do you discount his teachings?

Am I missing some verse where he says the gentiles are not his bretheren ,after the vision of the sheet comeing down from heaven?

Did he not also say not to put your yoke upon them?


Since when does "prosperty" have to be measured in dollars?


Is 32:6 For a fool speaks nonsense,
And his heart inclines toward wickedness:
To practice ungodliness and to speak error against the LORD,
To keep the hungry person unsatisfied
And to withhold drink from the thirsty.

 

Why did you only quote a verse that condemned Tony for something you accuse him of and no verses to support your position which would justify your accusation?

Ben

 

You have a point, KalvinB, but ...

It's an interesting point, KalvinB, and one which can be said to be legitimate, depending on your interpretation of Taken's words. I'm not here to argue that aspect of it, however. You're welcome to perceive what you will.

But I find it kind of ironic that you're making this point while defending Tony1's exploitation of the concept, and your own subscription to devoting more to what isn't than what is. It seems that between the two of you at least, you've set a standard that Taken is merely meeting. Don't be piggy, don't be hypocritical. I think it's hilarious that you're raising this complaint given how you've rushed to the defense of the same device when the resulting perspective agrees with your presuppositions.

On a slight digression, but still relevant: when you charge someone as you have Taken, with using a device of diminutive integrity, it is worth your while to cite that device. There are a couple of citations Taken has included in her posts, and I don't know to which one you refer. However, my initial guess is the Isaiah 32 quotation, which is nothing more than I've accused Tony1 of in the past, and nothing more than he's admitted to in the past. It's stated in a Biblical term, so I'm not sure what's so wrong with putting a well-established fact into a Biblical context.

thanx,
Tiassa

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I do not take offense to Tony singularly as one person...as much as I do to his methods which represent a large portion of Christians. (unfortunately)

I, therefore, am condeming the un- Godly practices of "Christians", of which I am one, and also stand accused.

As for my choice of verses..I am judged by the measure I use to judge others...(Do you need that verse or is it familiar to you?) So I also stand accused and must check myself.

This verse is an example of what I hope to keep in remembrance of my spirit when I represent the Lord. Is it wrong for me to share that? Is the verse not Biblical? Does it do harm to a Christian or guide them? I would think it is a verse that would instruct and inspire us to be more Godly in our actions towards people, not tear us down.

 

"But I find it kind of ironic that you're making this point while defending Tony1's exploitation of the concept"

Tony uses verses to condemn people but he makes an effort to support his accusations. You accuse me of being a hypocrite. And I'm not saying I'm not. I'm probably guilty of as many things as I accuse you and others of but that doesn't make you or the others any less guilty or give them or me justification to remain guilty.

Taken:

"So I also stand accused and must check myself."

Actually I just wanted you to verify Tony was in fact a fool before using the Bible to condemn him. I really don't care if you're guilty. I care that you made no effort to prove Tony was guilty. We have all these personal evaluations going around and I thought it might be a good idea to verify their authenticity.

According to Tiassa he's been guilty of that verse in the past but you didn't establish his guilt now.

Would you appreciate me tossing out "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor" like you're guilty of it before discovering whether or not you have valid points against Tony?

You accuse him of not being saved, of not actually casting out demons, of turning people away from Christianity, and there may be a couple more I missed.

Do you really believe those are true and do you have proof of them being true?

Can you document it?

Ben

 

Only by the same means you use to document mine or tiassas statements as being false...your own words. Only by the same means that Tony verifys the supposed truth of his statements..by his own words. Tony will be judged by his own measure, just as we all will. Let his words speak for him.

 

This is rediculous.....

Laughable at best. Tony1 claims to have tossed out demons, even given dirrect order to it?. LOL, Then of course KalvinB shows his gullibility by arguing that how would we know, this not to be true.

If Tony1 would claim that he can walk on water, the same reasoning would be used by his gullible friend. KalbinB then would argue that he may walk on water, how would we know this not to be true.

Tony1 can claim anything, however it is the gullible who buys into his whims and wild assertions. However even Taken a claimed Christian does not buy into the claims of Tony1, which by the way are sounding as if he could walk on water, and would argue that "he" could cast out the first stone. But Taken does not believe, or buy into these assertions, as you do Kalbinb, what makes you so sure, that the claims Tony1 makes are true?, is it because you are Tony1?, or is it cause he's your preacher? are you going to belive anything that Tony1 claims to have done, only because you yourself can't prove that what he claims is true, even though it sounds rediculous?.

Take Tony1 to a psychiatric phisician and he would probably have an opinion that this Tony1 is a dellusional individual that is having a problem in dealing with reality, and escaping it with fantasy.

 

I never said I believed it. I said it's possible. I was just hopeing for a more intelliegent anaylsis before everyone threw him into the lake to see if he floats.

Ben

 

What is this?

KalvinB, what is this you're pushing?

Riddle me this, please, sir: By the standard you're pushing, how do we convict someone of a crime? The event happens, the people are identified and called to account. Now: we must acquit the accused if they don't kill someone in court.

This is exactly what you're pushing.

Tony1's posting difficulties are pointed out all over this site. What, is Taken obliged to spend the most part of a year failing to get any genuine answer from Tony1 in order to verify what is becoming so starkly clear so quickly?

The facts are already in evidence: why should Taken have to fly to Pisa with a couple of iron balls just so she can discuss gravity at Sciforums?

Why do you keep wanting the experiment reperformed? Are you expecting a different result, or did you just miss the places where Tony1 claimed his religion was about keeping people away from the Lord? Are you expecting a different result, or did you miss where Tony1 said that reality is whatever he thinks it is?

Nobody needs to throw Tony1 in the lake: he's jumped off the dock himself. And yes, he is dense enough to sink.

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thanx,
Tiassa

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KalvinB,

Taking Taken at her word, she has not just jumped on the bandwagon but has reviewed many of Tony's posts and has personally developed great general concern about Tony's specific demonstration of Christianity which he has been asserting in this forum.

Are her concerns founded? I don't know because I haven't reviewed the history which is relevant in this respect. Had she already been influenced, before reviewing his past posts, by the blaring music of the anti-Tony parade which I could not help but observe upon registering here? I don't know. But, for what it's worth, I think I do understand where you are coming from.

 

I didn't think it was that hard Tiassa. You seem to want to keep throwing Tony in jail for past crimes he's already done time for or been aquited of.

I believe they call that Double Jeopardy.

Ben

 

Kalvin...my first thoughts about tony when I came to this board were..."why is this guy getting such a hard line for talking about the Bible". I intentionally checked his profile and scanned his posts, it made no sense to me that a Christian would be takeing so much grief" After reading his statements and reading the hostile commentaries he was makeing, I realized why. His attitude was far less than a light shining out to the lost.

But for arguments sake...I have spent much of today reading all of tonys previouse posts. I will not copy them all, but this is what I found...

That countrys with out majority Christians are desert wastelands. That we didn't kill off the Indians, they killed themselves. That giving birth determines virginity as opposed to haveing sex. That America is prosperouse because it is mostly Christian. (Not true any more) That largly muslim populated areas of the USA are wastelands. That half the people here are demon possesed. That tiassa has been told daily that marijuana nullifies any thought, idea, or feeling tiassa could ever have. Pretty much tiassa is somehow less than human or worthy or even an intelligent life form. That Catholics are not Christians. That ...and yes he said this...his religion is not based on a book. The majority of his posts refer back to repititions of what amounts to roughly 1/100 of the entire Bible. That he is in fact a God and we all are...which he managed to back up with a scripture taken totally out of context. One minute the old testament doesnt apply because of the lack of the forecoming crucifiction but the next minute it does when it gives him power or a comeback for an argument. He actually even said once that he liked flowery conversation then later called someones flowery conversation a "liberal warm fuzzy". That the Bible and salvation are simple things but that he confounds people with them. Lets don't even go back to him saying his words make things happen just like Gods do. Moses is not a Christian but some how Tony is an isrealite. He said that people agreeing was a good thing when an athiest agreed with him, but when someone agreed with me he said I should worry when sinners agree with me. 2/3 of his posts speak of or elude to a Christians (usually his) superiority or power. While less than 1/8 speak of grace or love or forgiveness. He rarely speaks of Gods haveing done anything except judge, condemn, burn, destroy. He usually quotes..recites a verse..adds two maximum lines of sarcastic rebutal and moves on.

All of these things are actually said in his posts, and there are many others...I of course cant bring them all back to you due to space requirements but if you want one or two quotes tell me which and I will gladly retrieve them.

It isn't double jeapordy if the crime is repeated.

 

Taken, KalvinB

Taken

I'm sorry you had to do it in an afternoon; it's mind-boggling to me in the sense that I've seen it ... for almost a year, it seems. I, personally, can't conceive of trying to absorb what you've documented in the course of a single afternoon. God give you strength? Perhaps a compelling argument for the existance of God

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KalvinB

I'll run with the metaphor, as overblown and contextually retarded as it is.

Jail? When has he ever actually been accountable? He evades, denies, and outright lies. He's never "done time" for his BS routine in any fashion. Think of OJ Simpson for a moment: who really believed he was innocent? Has he "done time" simply because his conduct was discussed? Don't see him in jail, do you? So tell us please how your guru Tony1 has "done time". I'm curious about your take here.

Acquitted? Who has acquitted him? You? His "partner in crime"?

That's kind of like Ford pardoning Nixon.

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So Tony1 has "done his time". Tell me, KalvinB, just how has he "repaid his debt" to this online society?

And yes, this had better be darn tootin' good.

--Tiassa

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