Thousands of Religious Sects - Which one is right?

You could interpret Jesus as being a Hindu guru, Bob Cracknell does a good job of it at the begining(or close to the begining) of one of his books(I forget which one).

 

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Contradiction Number 1: Paths to the Goal

Hinduism believes there are many paths to "heaven".

Christianity believes there is only one path to "heaven"(belief that Jesus is number one, and that all other scripures including the Quaran and Vedic scriptures are BS and are FALSE)

Islam believes there is only one path to "heaven" (Allah, the Quran)

Contraction Number 2:

Hinduism believes in Avatars and that they exist.

Christianity rejects belief in any figure of history other than Jesus and deems any other scripture bullshit. It also states that every other scripture is NOT from God (Quran, Vedic Scriptures, etc.)

Islam rejects belief in Avatars and claims that Allah is the only God and is aided by the angel Gabriel. That's it. No mention of Avatars.

There are hundreds of other contradictions but I wanted to emphasize these ones for now.

So the Christians believe that the authors of the Vedic Scriptures and the author of the Quran (Mohammad), were not inspired by God but simply made up what they were writing.

The Muslims believe the same about the Bible and the Vedas.

The Hindus just believe all scriptures were inspired by God, even though they all contractict each other and say that if you believe the other scripture you will go to hell.

Let me ask you something LG and VitalOne:

If God truly inspired the authors of the Quran and the Bible, then why does the Quran state with authority that if anyone believes what the Bible says then they will go to hell? And why does the Bible say the same about Islam?

Either one of the scriptures was truly inspired by God, or neither of them were. Clearly both couldn't since they say the other is going to hell to take swim in the lake of fire.

The Hindu religion is very rediculous if it really suggests that all religions were divinly inspired.

 

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the vedas says there is only one way to attaining the transcendental realm

BG 18.55: One can understand Me as I am, as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, only by devotional service. And when one is in full consciousness of Me by such devotion, he can enter into the kingdom of God.

it says there are many paths to many destinations and results (some of them more elevated than our earthly norm)

SB 2.3.2-7: One who desires to be absorbed in the impersonal brahmajyoti effulgence should worship the master of the Vedas [Lord Brahmā or Bṛhaspati, the learned priest], one who desires powerful sex should worship the heavenly King, Indra, and one who desires good progeny should worship the great progenitors called the Prajāpatis. One who desires good fortune should worship Durgādevī, the superintendent of the material world. One desiring to be very powerful should worship fire, and one who aspires only after money should worship the Vasus. One should worship the Rudra incarnations of Lord Śiva if he wants to be a great hero. One who wants a large stock of grains should worship Aditi. One who desires to attain the heavenly planets should worship the sons of Aditi. One who desires a worldly kingdom should worship Viśvadeva, and one who wants to be popular with the general mass of population should worship the Sādhya demigod. One who desires a long span of life should worship the demigods known as the Aśvinī-kumāras, and a person desiring a strongly built body should worship the earth. One who desires stability in his post should worship the horizon and the earth combined. One who desires to be beautiful should worship the beautiful residents of the Gandharva planet, and one who desires a good wife should worship the Apsarās and the Urvaśī society girls of the heavenly kingdom. One who desires domination over others should worship Lord Brahmā, the head of the universe. One who desires tangible fame should worship the Personality of Godhead, and one who desires a good bank balance should worship the demigod Varuṇa. If one desires to be a greatly learned man he should worship Lord Śiva, and if one desires a good marital relation he should worship the chaste goddess Umā, the wife of Lord Śiva.

SB 2.3.8: One should worship Lord Viṣṇu or His devotee for spiritual advancement in knowledge, and for protection of heredity and advancement of a dynasty one should worship the various demigods.

SB 2.3.9: One who desires domination over a kingdom or an empire should worship the Manus. One who desires victory over an enemy should worship the demons, and one who desires sense gratification should worship the moon. But one who desires nothing of material enjoyment should worship the Supreme Personality of Godhead.

SB 2.3.10: A person who has broader intelligence, whether he be full of all material desire, without any material desire, or desiring liberation, must by all means worship the supreme whole, the Personality of Godhead.

does it say that explicitly in the bible? (considering that the quaran wasn't even around then, I don't think so)

when the greeks were thirsty where they drinking something different from water because they called it ύδωρ?

Once again, does it say this explicitly?

Except for gabriel?

to take this discussion further you will need to provide scriptural references

"all" ?
The vedas delineates qualities that enable one to distinguish between a scripture/person inspired god or inspired by false ego/gross materialism

SB 7.15.12: There are five branches of irreligion, appropriately known as irreligion [vidharma], religious principles for which one is unfit [para-dharma], pretentious religion [ābhāsa], analogical religion [upadharma] and cheating religion [chala-dharma]. One who is aware of real religious life must abandon these five as irreligious.

for the sake of discipline - eclecticism is of no use to a practitioner, particularly if they are in danger of jeopardizing their spiritual life due to being unable to resolve what appear to be contradictions between one's path and another's path

One goes to hell by neglecting religious principles - perceiving contradictions between religions may catalyze someone to abandon religious principles, so they could both be correct (If a person in a predominantly muslim community attempts to be a christian, or vice versa, there is a good chance that they will face greater difficulty in adhering to religious principles which in turn could lead to siinful life which in turn would lead to descending to hell .... so both views could be correct)

I think I addressed this earlier

 

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Perhaps all religions talk about the same God if they can see beyond their dogmatic view on God. Else reconcilation would be a mirage.

 

what matter of religion when world works not by mind of man but by his actions and more by laws of universe. Apocalyptical future...ready to create desolate world.

 

After all searchings, it's your heart to determine the best.
Religion is not brain-only business. It both brain and heart (hence soul). You can control your brain (think what you want to think as you like), but never can you do to heart. The heart keeps truth, never deceives, and never been deceived. It is always in truth condition.

If you are really trying to search god, thru any religion, one that best fits you will come to your heart.

brain is manipulator, heart is your guard.

 

given that our actions are limited by laws, the question of the lawmaker naturally arises

 

Your heart is just a blood pump. What you mean by 'heart' is simply emotion, and that's rarely worth trusting. If it came down to "brain only" then nobody would be religious.

 

mind me english. its not the physic that i meant. in my language, it's called 'nurani', maybe the more proper english is 'conscience'.

 

LiveinFaith,

Can we stop talking in these vague, meaningless terms. If you want to present an argument, let's be specific and use terms that mean something.

You commit the same error that millions of other people do in giving the Spirit and the Body a plethera of different names (heart, soul, conscience, etc.)

Assuming a Spirit, humans are two things:

1. Body - This includes obviously brain/mind, emotions/conscience, feelings, etc.

2. Spirit - A spirit has the ability to enter any living entity (possibly any entity at all) and is an individual person or consciousness.


There is no soul. The soul is the brain. When you die, your soul dies. The Spirit, which is the invisible, continuous thing, will then leave the physical body and either A) go into another animal (Hinduism) or B) go to heaven or hell.

 

Lightgiagantic,

Every argument you have made so far is your individual beliefs.

So you believe that both Islam and Christianity are incorrect in their beliefs that every other religion will lead to hell. While Christianity and Islam believe that YOU are incorrect, and that if you believe in Avatars and Brahman, and Vishu, and Krishna, them YOU will go to hell.

When you die, you will find out which one was right.


Let's take this step by step:

Question 1:

There is an angel called Gabriel in both the Bible and the Quran.

Is the Bible and the Quran referring to the same Gabriel?

 

Wow, that was one idiotic post.

Yes, they did cause problems. That doesn't mean religion doesn't also cause problems.

Does it really matter if they were in the sky? I was trying to make a point, and as heaven is regarded as 'above', I assumed that God was in the sky.

THERE YOU GO AGAIN.

Atheists are not a coherent group, they are just people who don't happen to believe in a God.

That says more about people like you than it does about 'the atheists' (I like how you refer to atheists with that 'us and them' attitude.). If you only behave morally because God/Allah/Yahveh/whoever will punish you if you don't, you're a pretty deficient person.

 

Interesting .....
Given that I am yet to see you quote much in the way of scripture (or quote someone who does) I would have thought that would have been an apt description of yourself

The problem is that you haven't actually established this yet, mainly because you haven't quoted the relevant scriptures

first you need an argument based on scripture, other wise you are just utilizing you r personal beliefs (or, if you quote someone else who has an argument bereft of scriptural references, the personal beliefs of someone else)

both the first and last 5 minutes of life are definitely interesting

given that I am only partially familiar with the bible and vaguely familiar with the koran, on what authority do you expect me to answer this (If your q was something more like, "do you think that both the bible and the koran give indications of higher entities, such as Gabriel, who are also more elevated in their perception of god/transcendence" I could hazard a guess)

 

Needless to say.. which scripture?

 

Ok...this doesn't really say anything you just dodge out of what I'm saying and re-instate your beliefs.....

If most Christians believe that Vishnu, Krishna, etc...is made up BS...then how do they explain the strikingly paralells in what Krishna says and what Jesus says? Its almost as if they are the same person, they say the samethings, sometimes word-for-word....

Whats so different about it? Jesus himself says the holy spirit is above him, so if you really believe in Jesus, then you would believe in what he says....

They CAN both be right, whats so complex about it? Hinduism says there's One God, as does Judaism, Islam, and Christianity. Hinduism describes God in a much more intellectual way, but its still basically the same...

Actually, the Hindu prophecy has many strikingly paralells to the one in Revelations, for instance, they both say Jesus or Kalki (who BOTH are considered to be God) will return on a white horse, wage righteous war, etc...and start a heaven on Earth...this heaven on Earth in BOTH is also described to be free from old age, disease, death, etc...and BOTH say it will last for a thousand years...in fact the Hindu prophecy and the one in Revelations are CLOSER than the Islamic and Judaic prophecies...

There is heaven and hell in Hindusim (and Buddhism too)....I can bet you that if Jesus were alive today he would tell you that reincarnation was true...and that Hebrews quote in the Bible (that says something about "men appointed once to die") has nothing to do with Jesus, or any divinity, it was a letter written by some guy....

Extremely different? Whats so extremely different? They both say there's only one God, they both say you can go to heaven or hell...they both say to do good deeds, etc...

I'm not denying it at all, thats what I've been trying to tell you. For one who sees the actual truth, they will not see much difference in these religions...as I illustrated in my 168 example...

 

Ohh I get it...its real idiotic if a theist says atheism is cancer...but if an atheist says theism is cancer its not idiotic...its intellectual....

As for heaven, Jesus says the kingdom of God is within you, and comes not by observation....

Again with what? The fact that its ok for atheists to insult theists but not the other way around..otherwise you're doing something so wrong..hahaha

Atheists are a coherent group, although they don't like to admit it....

I used that as example to illustrate how someone could easily say atheism was a cancer. If an atheists feels like "sinning" there's no religious reason to not go ahead and do it.....maybe the law and thats it...Stalin probably didn't care how many millions he killed...its not like he's going to hell after death there's just nothingness...so no consequences at all...

 

Whatever the term is. You right, leave out the term, let's describe function.

I am talking a part in human that TELLS anyone which choice/decision is FIT for them, so one can SENSE that their decision is fit. Your brain can not control what it would tell you (though most of the time brain triggers it to work), your brain then RESPONDS to it's abstractive whisper.

Sometimes you do something you THINK is reasonable, but deep in your (heart.. whatever..), you feel / sense that something just not SEEMS right. On the other hand, your brain maybe lack of data/information, which rationally you should not make decision, but something inside tells you to immediately take such action, which several cases of religion converts happened that way. In LG & VO analogy, which vessel / combination numbers suits you best, that part will tell.

Motivated to find contradictions among religions, one will find many. On the other hand, sincerely searching truth (or maybe god thru any religions), this part will tell which suits one best.

 

well if you want to argue about christianity, the bible, islam, the koran etc etc -

 

I've already quoted from the scriptures of the Bible and Quran in my argument that the two scriptures, and thereby religions, contradict each other. LG, you never responded to that post, but I think it's simply because you missed it.

Here is post#138 by me which you never responded to:

Why do people keep denying that A cannot be B?

Our solar system either has one sun or two. The earth is either round or flat.

God is either a Trinity (pluristic) or a singular entity. Jesus either was or was not the Son of God.


The Bible says God is a Trinity.

The Quran says:

"People of the Book (Jews and Christians)! Do not exceed the limits in your religion, and attribute to God nothing except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, was only a Messenger of God, and His command that He conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in God and in His Messengers, and do not say: ‘God is a Trinity.' Give up this assertion; it would be better for you. God is indeed just One God. Far be it from His glory that He should have a son. To Him belongs all that is in the heavens and in the earth. God is sufficient for a guardian" (Quran 4:171).

The Bible says Jesus is God's only son:

"For God so loved the world that He gave His only Son that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. For God sent the Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through Him (Bible: John 3:16).


The Quran says otherwise:

"Say: "God is Unique! God, the Source [of everything]. He has not fathered anyone nor was He fathered, and there is nothing comparable to Him!" (Quran 112:1-4).

"Such was Jesus, the son of Mary; it is a statement of truth, about which they vainly dispute. It is not befitting to the majesty of God, that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! When He determines a matter, He only says to it, ‘Be' and it is" (Quran 19:34-35).

Sura 6:102 “The originator of heavens and earth! How can He have a child, when there is for Him no consort?”

Sura 72:3 “We believe that He - exalted be the glory of our Lord - hath taken neither wife nor son.”

Sura 112:1-4 “Proclaim, 'He is the One and only GOD. The Absolute GOD. Never did He beget. Nor was He begotten. None equals Him.”

Sura 25:2-3 “He to whom belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth: no son has He begotten, nor has He a partner in His dominion: it is He who created all things, and ordered them in due proportions. Yet have they taken, besides him, gods that can create nothing but are themselves created; that have no control of hurt or good to themselves; nor can they control death nor life nor resurrection.”

This is from Sura 19:88-92 They say: “(God) Most Gracious has begotten a son!” Indeed ye have put forth a thing most monstrous! At it the skies are ready to burst, the earth to split asunder, and the mountains to fall down in utter ruin, That they should invoke a son for (God) Most Gracious. For it is not consonant with the majesty of (God) Most Gracious that He should beget a son.”

“They say, `God has taken to Him a son' .... Say: `Those who forge against God falsehood shall not prosper.” (Arberry, Interpreted, p. 233) “Praise belongs to God [Allah], who has not taken to Him a son” (Arberry, Interpreted p. 315) “Warn those who say, `God has taken to Himself a son'; ... a monstrous word it is, issuing out of their mouths; they say nothing but a lie.” (Arberry, Interpreted p. 316)

Sura 18:4-5 “Further, that He may warn those (also) who say, “God hath begotten a son”: No knowledge have they of such a thing, nor had their fathers. It is a grievous thing that issues from their mouths as a saying what they say is nothing but falsehood!”



Hinduism claims that Jesus was just another avatar (4th or 5th in rank). Islam says that Jesus was just another messenger.

"The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, was only a Messenger of God, and His command that He conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in God and in His Messengers. (Quran 4:171).

The Bible paints a picture of Jesus completely opposite to the beliefs of Hinduism and Islam (and all other religions).

The Bible says Jesus is second only to God and that Jesus is the ultimate King (1st in rank, not 4th or 5th)

Col 1:16-20
16 For by him (Jesus) were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven
KJV

Heb 1:1-4
1:1 God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds; 3 who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become so much better than the angels, as He has by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
NKJV


Matt 28:16-20
16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, to the mountain which Jesus had appointed for them. 17 When they saw Him, they worshiped Him; but some doubted. 18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Amen.
NKJV


LG and VitalOne. You are seriously in error if you state that every religion has the exact same beliefs on who Jesus was.

If I told you both that the earth was round, you would say:

No, it is round and flat at the same time. LOL, good one.


If you can't see any contradictions between beliefs of religions which I have presented above, then, well, you cannot grasp the concept of the Law of Idenity and the Law of Contradcition.

 

Hello nds 1

i just have to deal with a few of your points:

Half true but the other half???

Just because something is not given by God does not mean it comes from a man. So other scriptures can indeed be inspired. I personaly believe the Quran was inspired,I don't believe that muhammed could have done it on his own. So no i do not believe the quran is the Work of a man, maybe it has been altered by men down through the centuries but i believe it was originaly inspired by an angel of darkness either satan himself masqurading as the angel Gabriel or one of many angels that have joined him in his rebellion against God.

Well not exactly. As far as i have been told by a few muslims. They believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God but that it has been tampered with and changed by humans to include fase teachings. So only bible passages and revealtions that are in agreement with quranic writings are inspired and all other writings in the bible that are in opposition to quranic text are the result of tampering by men.

nds 1 Yes you are right in your deduction on this point. Which makes me wonder why you persisting in your discussion with LG and VitalOne? How many angles can you reveal this basic truth before you come to the realisation that they are not interested in it? Are you persisting out of some kind of hope that they will see the truth or do you just like debating? Do you enjoy the fight more than you desire a result?


All Praise The Ancient Of Days