The of begining life on earth

Discussion in 'Biology & Genetics' started by yaracuy, Feb 24, 2011.

  1. synthesizer-patel Sweep the leg Johnny! Valued Senior Member

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    I call appeal to authority fallacy with a plus 4 roll

    but more pertinently .....

    When watson and crick were noted biologists, we hadn't even heard of hydrothermal vents, let alone found any, let alone find that the plumes contained high concentrations of metal salts (including rare heavy metals), let alone begun to hypothesise that they might be ideal sites for the formation of early life, let alone test the hypothesis and find good supporting evidence for it.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6QYDdgP9eg&playnext=1&list=PL0696457CAFD6D7C9

    Way to win a Nobel Prize!

    (feel free to skip the bits that bash the fanatics (although that's always fun) and get to the meat which starts at about 2.40)
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2011
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  3. yaracuy Banned Banned

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  5. Hercules Rockefeller Beatings will continue until morale improves. Moderator

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    Mod note:

    Yaracuy,

    You have mentioned “God” and “creator” at least four times now.

    This is a science forum. If you want to discuss science, then please feel free to do so. The scientific method proceeds on the basis of a naturalistic mechanism behind observed phenomena and data. If there are gaps in scientific knowledge or science cannot explain something (which is certainly true of our understanding of abiogenesis), science does not throw its hands up and declare that ‘it must have been God’. If you want to speculate on the role of God or a ‘creator’ then you are no longer being scientific and I will move the thread to a non-science forum. (Note: depending on the nature of the conversation, this may be the Cesspool where threads are automatically locked.)
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2011
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  7. yaracuy Banned Banned

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    Thank you for the advice , I did not know keep track on how many time I have mentioned, In the future I will attempt to abstain .
    It is nice of you to be polite .
    Would you kindly detail as to what is meant by "depending on the nature of the conversation, this may be the Cesspool where threads are automatically locked.)[/QUOTE]"

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  8. ULTRA Realistically Surreal Registered Senior Member

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    Yaracuy, if a thread becomes un-objective and un-scientific when posted in a scientific part of the forum it risks being demoted into a part of the forum called the cesspool. This is where threads that are decomposing are sent to die..
     
  9. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    "Unscientific" means that it does not conform to the scientific method. This requires, among other things, that all assertions are supported by empirical evidence, and that there is no reliance on the supernatural to explain away phenomena that are not yet fully understood.
     
  10. yaracuy Banned Banned

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  11. yaracuy Banned Banned

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  12. Hercules Rockefeller Beatings will continue until morale improves. Moderator

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    Yes, in the sense that organic chemical reactions “create” new molecules. No, if it carries a creationist connotation and implies a creator. I think it is possible to use words like 'form', 'develop', 'polymerise', 'condense' etc. that imply only natural mechanisms.


    You’ve asked how nucleotides might have arisen in the pre-biotic Earth. I don’t know the answer; it’s not my field.

    But, from my point of view, there is nothing particularly unusual about a nucleotide as an organic molecule. It is composed of phosphate, ribose and a purine or pyrimidine. Phosphate occurs naturally in the Earth’s crust. Purines and pyrimidines are merely cyclic or bicyclic nitrogen-containing compounds. I believe these sorts of cyclic organic molecules form naturally. Similarly, ribose is merely a simple carbohydrate. The precursors to such molecules have been found both here and in outer space.

    I see no reason to believe that, given enough time, nucleotides could not have formed spontaneously via natural organic chemical reaction mechanisms.

    Besides, there are hypotheses that state there were self-replicating systems that pre-date nucleic acids and the “RNA world” and that drove the development of nucleic acids.
     
  13. yaracuy Banned Banned

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    ..........
    I read this there is a lot of hand waving , but very little facts.:bugeye:
     
  14. ULTRA Realistically Surreal Registered Senior Member

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    Well, what else do you need to know? So far all your questions have been answered. You've been told what you'd need to produce these proteins, even though you'd never be able to afford the equipment. You know that basic molecules have been produced using a chemical soup end electricity. You know that to make nucleotides you need to program another organism to make them for you. I don't really see what else there is to say on the matter.
     
  15. yaracuy Banned Banned

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    [ I don't really see what else there is to say on the matter.[/QUOTE]


    That is the end of my question.
    I am not a biologist , but in my discussion I have learned that I should learn more about the biochemical reaction in a cell to appreciate more in how thew organized or programmed system functions.

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  16. ULTRA Realistically Surreal Registered Senior Member

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    Actually Yaracuy, I've just thought of another way to obtain neucleotides. What you can do is this. Get a load of yeast, Smash it all up using an ultrasonic probe, and put it all in a bucket with 0.1% sodium Azide (preserves protein but extremely poisionous) and a solution of EDTA at about Ph 7.5. Then get a glass column and fill it with a molecular filter gel called octyl sepharose. Pour the liquid into the filter and test what comes out the other end. The proteins will come out at different times according to thier molecular weight and size. Once you know how long it takes for your neucleotides to come out you can collect them in a vial.
    Well, that's the principle. Refine it and you'll get some neucleotides. What you do with them after that is up to you.
     
  17. yaracuy Banned Banned

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    Pardon my ignorance at a PH of 7.5 the nucleotide will be ATP or ADP type I nudestad there will be different bases.

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  18. ULTRA Realistically Surreal Registered Senior Member

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    No, it would be one of the four bases. ADP and ATP are different things. They are found in the mitochondria and are used for generating the cells energy. Each of the bases, A,C,T,and D have different molecular weights so would come out of the molecular filter at different times. This is good as they would be quite pure.
     
  19. yaracuy Banned Banned

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    See I have learned one thing more . So you are saying , you get free bases without ribose attached , And that comes from Mitocondrium Ok

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  20. Alex3 Registered Member

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    Have you known about the big bang theory that is the origin of all the lives on the planet earth. Question of human existence on it is something else that includes other beliefs. But Big Bang is something that truly happened and let organic material survived on earth!
     
  21. yaracuy Banned Banned

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    Oy Big Bang and organic material on earth according to the theory they are to far in time I might agree that earth is a second generation planet , meaning that our planet was a planet before it is now earth.

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  22. Crunchy Cat F-in' *meow* baby!!! Valued Senior Member

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    Nobody knows for sure yet.

    With the truth.

    N/A based on the actual answer.
     
  23. Crunchy Cat F-in' *meow* baby!!! Valued Senior Member

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    That made absolutely no sense. The "big bang theory" is a model of how our universe rapidly inflated from a small structure. Human existence is not really related. It is a result of evolution on Earth.
     

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