# SuperLuminal's Experiment

Discussion in 'Physics & Math' started by Rosnet, Jul 25, 2005.

1. ### superluminalI am MalcomRValued Senior Member

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Correct. It's the mechanism of length contraction. Length contraction is a result of the way space and time are measured for a moving object. Just as is time dilation.

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QQ,

5. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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Well, regardless of what we measure the lengths to be, the pulses shouldn't be seen as simultaneous. So this is all we would need to check. The length between their detection can then be analyzed later.

7. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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Perhaps the "pulse" could be a laser pulse perpendicular to the direction of motion so that any length contraction that may occur wouldn't have to be taken into account to see the simultaneity effect.

8. ### superluminalI am MalcomRValued Senior Member

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Well, I am certain that length contraction and simultaneity are intimately related.

9. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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Yes, they are intimately related. However, length contraction only occurs in the direction of motion, x. If the laser pulses were in the direction y, then their detection would be at different times in the Earth frame regardless of length contraction.

10. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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I'll be honest. To me, it makes no sense for the Earth to detect these pulses at different times. It also doesn't make sense to me that things length contract.

Though, I am willing to accept that my sense maybe be nonsense in reality - but I want to see good hard proof first

Time dilation does make sense to me - that is, I've come up with a quantum level explaination that makes sense to me. But it is not consistent with Special Relativity. Specifically it forbids length contraction.

11. ### superluminalI am MalcomRValued Senior Member

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Oh. I get you now. You mean this:

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ---> laser
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |
----------------> x (motion)
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ---> laser

Yes? If so, why would the laser pulses not arrive at earth simultaneously assuming they were directed at the earth?

12. ### superluminalI am MalcomRValued Senior Member

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Loss of simultaneity only occurrs in the relative direction of motion.

13. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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No, the laser pulse is perpendicular to the x direction.

14. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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Well this makes things impossible, no? And how does that make sense?

15. ### superluminalI am MalcomRValued Senior Member

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Well then they will show closer together. ?

16. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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If we had a normal pulse, that scattered in all directions, then based on our sensors, we'd be able to conclude that an event in the moving frame as simultaneous would be detected simultaneous in the Earth frame. Because we could always just measure the portion of the pulse perpendicular to the motion.

17. ### superluminalI am MalcomRValued Senior Member

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----------------> x
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|
V&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;V

This? Then they just show length contraction which is a result of loss of simultaneity.

18. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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OK - if you say so. I hope you are sure about this. As I said - I am always at a loss for what is happening when length contraction is involved.

19. ### superluminalI am MalcomRValued Senior Member

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It's very late for me and I'm losing my ability to understand things.

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Aer,

21. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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Quite awhile ago.

22. ### superluminalI am MalcomRValued Senior Member

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Ok well, it's not a hard read and can clear up a lot.

23. ### AerRegistered Senior Member

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I fully understood it at the time