Study Proves Vaccines Are Behind Whooping Cough Outbreaks

Discussion in 'Biology & Genetics' started by mello, Nov 29, 2013.

  1. mello Registered Member

    Messages:
    41
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    23,049
    why is this shit still here?

    Psudoscience or cesspool
     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. leopold Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    17,455
    Scientists have now concluded that the effectiveness of the acellular pertussis vaccines (DTaP) available on the U.S. market today wanes after about five years. Apparently the old version of the pertussis vaccine was a whole cell vaccine, which supposedly lasted much longer; however, it was discontinued due to side effects such as inducing chronic neurological problems in some of the children who received it.

    With this latest study, baboons recently vaccinated for whooping cough were shown to actually carry the pertussis infection in their throats; although they themselves did not get sick, the vaccinated baboons readily spread the infection to other baboons who were not vaccinated.
    http://www.thedailysheeple.com/stud...rs-are-behind-whooping-cough-outbreaks_112013

    apparently a new type of whooping cough vaccine is being used that isn't as effective as the old version.
    the link also says the CDC is aware of the problem.
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. exchemist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,791
    The link you reference seems to be to a journal of the US lunatic fringe, full of preposterous articles about Obama and gun control etc.

    If you expect us to take this story at face value, please provide a reference to a reputable source.
     
  8. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,515
  9. leopold Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    17,455
    it wasn't my link, it was included in the OP.
    what i posted was an excerpt from it.
    i don't put much faith in something called "the dailysheeple" anyway.
     
  10. exchemist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,791
    Well nor do I!
     
  11. leopold Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    17,455
  12. exchemist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,791
    OK thanks. So what we have is a vaccine that may permit some vaccinated people to be asymptomatic carriers.

    But that, surely, is a far cry from Mello's claim in the OP that the vaccine "is behind the surge" in the disease and that it is NOT the people who have refused immunisation.

    Because obviously the asymptomatic carrier can only pass the disease to some who is UNvaccinated. So it's still the jerks that refuse it that put themselves at risk.
     
  13. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,296
    I agree completely.
     
  14. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,515
    While the baboons that were given the modern aP vaccine were protected from any severe pertussis-like symptoms after exposure, their throats still became colonized and they were unable to clear the infection more efficiently than their unvaccinated counterparts.
    ...
    “When you’re newly vaccinated you are an asymptomatic carrier, which is good for you, but not for the population,”

    The introduction of the new vaccine actual is a direct cause of the outbreak, because only in an ideal world would everyone get vaccinated all at the same time. Thus leaving many, not yet vaccinated, vulnerable to all the newly create carriers.
     
  15. billvon Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    18,548
    From the same site:

    A New Theory of Human Origins: Chimp and Pig Rendevouz Resulted in Your Ancestors
    Schools Are Obamacare For Children
     
  16. exchemist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,791
    But your "not yet vaccinated" fails to acknowledge the role played by people who REFUSE vaccination. It anyone is to blame surely it is those who deliberately increase the proportion of the population with no protection.
     
  17. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,515
    The CDC is investigating whether or not the increased numbers are due to the vaccine wearing off earlier. While whooping cough may be a cyclical disease, certain aspects of this latest outbreak have become concerning to officials, Schuchat said. In particular, across the United States, rates of infected individuals are rising in 10-year-olds, decreasing in 11- and 12-year-olds and increasing again in 13- to 14-year-olds. - http://www.cbsnews.com/news/cdc-us-whooping-cough-cases-rising-at-epidemic-rate/

    Pertussis vaccines are very effective, but they are not 100 percent effective. Vaccine protection wears off over time, so vaccinated people might still get pertussis. This is known as waning immunity. By five years, after their fifth dose of DTaP, 3 in 10 vaccinated children are susceptible again and can get pertussis. - http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/2012/08/whooping-cough-outbreak-cdc-answers-your-questions.html

    Do you have any statistics that the number of unvaccinated has changed significantly enough to account for the outbreak? Or do you think the CDC knows what it is talking about?
     
  18. Pete It's not rocket surgery Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,167
    That article is terribly misleading.

    This article is good: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/815247
    The original research paper is here: http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2013/11/20/1314688110
    A subscription is required for the full article, but if you really want it, PM me and I'll email it to you.

    Now, the real point of interest
    (Sidenote - Tod Merkel is the corresponding author, but not actually the lead author. He's 3rd of three authors.)

    I don't know if Tod Merkel mis-spoke, was misquoted, or if I'm really getting something wrong, but I can't see how his quote is supported by the research conducted.

    Administering the acellular pertussis vaccine does not, and can not, directly make someone an asymptomatic carrier, because it does not contain the whole pertussis virus.

    The issue revealed by the research is that vaccinated baboons (and potentially people) can become asymptomatic carriers if they are exposed to the virus (ie contact with an individual with a pertussis infection.) Note that they are not an asymptomatic carrier forever - the aP vaccinated baboons who acquired an asymptomatic infection cleared the infection in a few weeks, as did the unvaccinated baboons who acquired an infection (the vaccinated ones actually took a longer by perhaps a week, although the small study size makes this uncertain.)

    This is a problem, because if the baboon findings are true for people, it means that pertussis infections could still spread through a vaccinated community, and thus the virus (correction) vaccine would not confer herd immunity.


    As for the recent outbreaks, trying to pin blame on someone is pretty pointless, and can lead only to acrimony. Try to focus on how to move forward, rather than pointing fingers.
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2013
  19. exchemist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,791
    Good analysis. Thanks.
     

Share This Page