Spanking children, a parent's right ?

Discussion in 'Human Science' started by Cazzo, Aug 20, 2008.

?

When it comes to parents spanking their kids butts :

  1. The UN should be able to criminalize spanking for ALL parents everywhere.

    4 vote(s)
    10.3%
  2. Only individual states or countries should criminalize spanking if they want.

    7 vote(s)
    17.9%
  3. Parents should be allowed to spank their own children, it's their buisness alone.

    25 vote(s)
    64.1%
  4. Other.

    3 vote(s)
    7.7%
  1. madanthonywayne Morning in America Staff Member

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    For someone who has never done something to sit in judgement of those who have is arrogant beyond belief. When everyone with any real life experience is on the opposite side of the argument, you might want to re-think your position.
     
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  3. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Currently, my position is waiting for you to provide some meat and potatoes with that side of word salad.
     
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  5. Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

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    MAD have you commited murder?
    raped someone?

    would you judge those who have?
     
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  7. lepustimidus Banned Banned

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    Good gal, you managed to note my very clear distinction.

    I don't consider it appropriate for a child to retaliate to being hit by a parent, because:

    1. The child is currently living off the parent, and it's the height of disrespect to bite the hand which feeds you. This is irrespective of the parent-child bond. I also wouldn't consider it appropriate for a guest to hit their host, even in retaliation. Better to just remove yourself from the situation, although a child doesn't have that luxury, I guess. Still, I do believe in not biting the hand which feeds you.

    2. It subtracts from the parents authority, which is essential in a child-parent relationship. If a parent loses their authority over a child, then all hell breaks loose.

    There are some exceptions to a child hitting back, such as to defend themselves against serious physical abuse (eg. Your parent is about to break your arm in a fury), or sexual abuse (eg. rape).

    But once you're an adult, you'll note that my two justifications above no longer (usually) apply. If you're an adult, you're usually independent and living by yourself, so justification 1 is no longer applicable. And since you're an adult, the parent-child relationship no longer exists.
     
  8. shorty_37 Go! Canada Go! Registered Senior Member

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    12,140
    I think the parent-child relationship always exists no matter how old you are.
    My parents consider me their child, even though I am 38. Things change as you get older and you become more dependent and start living your own life. My parents will always be my parents and I will always be their "kid".
     
  9. lepustimidus Banned Banned

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    979
    You're their daughter, not their child. Child has certain implications, such as dependency on your parents/caregiver. For someone to refer to a 38 year old as a child/kid is demeaning, IMHO.
     
  10. shorty_37 Go! Canada Go! Registered Senior Member

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    12,140
    Well my mom passed away a few yrs ago, but until then I could still depend on them both to be there for me no matter what. I can still depend on my dad for anything. He would bail me out of a jam in a heartbeat, if I asked. I still asked for their advice well into my adult yrs. So I don't see how the parent-relationship just suddenly doesn't exist anymore, just because I don't live with them, and they no longer need to support me. I still respect my dad just as I did when I was a kid.

    I guess I just see it differently then you. I think I will always think of my boys as my "kids" even when they are adults 30, 40 whatever. I will help them whenever I can, support them, be there when they need advice etc.
     
  11. lepustimidus Banned Banned

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    979
    So if you depend on a friend/loved one, you consider yourself to be a kid to them? That you have a child-parent relationship with them? And do you mean to tell me that parents don't even ask their offspring for help? I know many elderly parents who rely on their offspring for the most basic of needs (being fed and changed). Once that occurs, are the offspring entitled to call their dependent parent 'child'? I doubt it, that would be rather disrespectful.

    For me, the word 'kid' or 'child' holds certain connatations which become insulting once you're independent.

    You can respect your mother/father as your parents, without being a 'child'.
     
  12. shorty_37 Go! Canada Go! Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,140
    If it was a friend/loved one why would I consider it a child-parent relationship.
    They are not my parent and I am not their child.

    I don't know every family is different I guess. I just remember my mom helping me out through a rough time (divorce) and her saying. "Listen no matter what we are always here for you. No matter how old you are you are still my child and I will do anything to help you.
    I guess that kinda stuck with me. Like I said I had a rough time with my mom for a while. I was smacked quite a bit as a child, but when I got older I put it all behind me and we had a good relationship. She had a great relationship with her grandchildren too, until she passed away.
     
  13. madanthonywayne Morning in America Staff Member

    Messages:
    12,461
    Asguard, that's not the same thing at all, and you know it. The subject of debate is parenting, or more specifically, the role of certain methods of discipline (ie corporal punishment) in raising a child.

    Parenting is a normal part of human existance and has been done in a certain way for millenia. Now, before you go nuts, I'll confess that it's true that just because something is the normal standard way doesn't mean it's the best.

    But, it's damned arrogant for someone who has never been a parent to tell people who have that the person completely lacking in experience knows best! And when the opinion of those who have been parents is unanimously opposed to that of the complete novices, it should give you pause.

    You might just as well tell me the sky is orange or that up is down. I will not ignore the clear evidence of my own eyes for some study done (most likely) by someone with an agenda.

    As you yourself have said, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. Turning 94% of all parents into criminals is an extraordinary claim.
     
  14. lepustimidus Banned Banned

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    shorty:
    Yes, and people have different interpretations of words, too. It doesn't matter in the end. What matters is that you have a good relationship with your mother, and that you're happy.
     
  15. madanthonywayne Morning in America Staff Member

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    12,461
    That's only true if you're insecure about your independence. If some old dude, or my parents, calls me a kid (I'm 41); I take it as a compliment.
     
  16. Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

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    23,049
    100 credible scientific studies are your evidence
    the report of the insitute of criminology is your evidence

    the problem is you lack evidence for your argument that it ISNT child abuse and thats your problem not mine. im not going to do your job for you.

    get off sciforums, open google, medline, any of the hundreds of journals of psychology and find ONE credible study which says its a good thing

    as you just said "extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof". i have given you credible evidence now YOU show why you shouldnt be charged with child abuse
     
  17. lepustimidus Banned Banned

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    979
    madan:
    It's the same principle, though. If Asguard can't condemn parents who spank their children because he's never been a parent, then you can't rapists because you've never been raped or had the urge to rape someone. I mean, how can you judge them if you don't understand them or their situation?
    Granted, his comparison is extreme, but it's still valid. I would have instead used the example of a parent beating their child with an iron bar. "You're not a parent, you don't know kids. They push you to your limits, I'm tellin' ya! Who are you to judge me, childless one?"

    I don't agree with Asguard in all his points, but I'm not going to take a jab at his lack of parenting experience to discredit him. That's a jab below the belt and completely irrelevant, IMHO. It borders on elitism.
     
  18. lepustimidus Banned Banned

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    979
    madan:
    Nonsense. Acknowledgement of an adult's autonomy is just being polite.

    Added to which, someone may be insecure about their independence if their parents keep meddling well into their adulthood (telling them what to study, who to marry, where to live, what to wear), no?
     
  19. shorty_37 Go! Canada Go! Registered Senior Member

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    12,140
    You are kidding right? :bugeye: You think Madanthony should be charged with child abuse? lol

    I don't think a father who raises a child that is bright enough to go to University and sits down with that child and sends him off with a talk and a cigar that he has been saving just for that moment is a CHILD ABUSER...

    Get off the crack would you.....

    So you know I have hit my boys a couple times in their lives when they were toddlers. Should I be charged with CHILD ABUSE too?
     
  20. lepustimidus Banned Banned

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    979
    Personally, I think it's possible to acknowledge that parents have assaulted their children, without condemning them.
     
  21. Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    23,049
    yep, unless you can prove otherwise

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    SOO what your saying is that if a child is beaten to near death, broken bones ect as long as they get into uni that is ok and the person who did it shouldnt be charged?

    what about if they are sexually abused?

    your comment makes no rational sence, just because the victom recovers doesnt excuse the actions
     
  22. shorty_37 Go! Canada Go! Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,140
    Do you think that Madanthony has beaten his child to near death? landed him in the hospital with broken bones? From his explanations this isn't even close to the truth.

    When did I EVER say in this thread I think it is ok for parents to BEAT, or HIT their kids with BASEBALL BATS, BROOMSTICKS or any other objects ?

    We are talking a spanking on the bottom with an open hand.

    Don't bring up sexual abuse that is another topic. Can you not stay on topic at all?


    So you didn't tell me.....Do you think I should be charged with Child Abuse? Do you think my boys are victims of Abuse?


    This is funny coming from you.
     
  23. madanthonywayne Morning in America Staff Member

    Messages:
    12,461
    So is letting some old coot have some latitude in who he considers a kid.
    I suppose. But just because they say something, doesn't mean you have to do it. Just smile, nod, say thanks fo the advise, and then do what you want!
     

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