Scotland Assisted Suicide Legalization Bill Narrowed, Still Targets Disabled

"Oregon doesn't cover life-prolonging treatment unless there is better than a 5 percent chance it will help the patients live for five more years"

 

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another thing is that i dont think you know what this treatment involves. your putting your cart in front of your horse here brian.

 

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And it followed..........

Isnt that 'forcing ones hand'?

What Horse and whose cart?

Its all about choice.

 

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Brian who would have paid for this treatment that had a 95% chance of failure? there is no universal health care in this country and if his insurance won't cover it who is responsible for payment?

 

Randy Stroup was uninsured:

And this outfit paid for his treatment:

So according to the above there must be some form of free medical treatment available Lucy.

 

Well yes I think there should be some form of national health care.

 

as mad would say, in the US life and death are just comodities to be bought and sold. why do you think i refuse to debate brian based on the US model. its because its incompadable to the health care models that VE would work under where we both live.

 

And that would be true for all western first countries. The U.S is a mercenary state.

 

There is it states in the article "he applied to Oregon's state-run health plan for help", so there is a socialized system of healthcare availible in America for those who cannot afford Insurance.

The Dutch healthcare system is like Australias, its free, you can always start there.

 

The slippery slope is finished.
We are right at the bottom of it.
Either be productive or you are a criminal.
The punishment for said crime is a lethal injection.

 

um no your wrong about that. all westen countries (to my knowlage) EXCEPT the US have at least some form of universal health care system. ie all the other countries know that health care is a human right not a comodity

 

Oh Really?

While the Bible neither explicitly condemns nor explicitly condones it, historical interpretations vary.

Suicide being committed for a noble cause?

What does the Bible say about suicide?

What is the Christian view of suicide?

Let's take a look at a few contemporary examples:

Today, both Judaism and Islam teach that human life is sacred and they forbid Suicide and Euthanasia under any circumstances, while Christian denominations are somewhat divided:

How can you be so sure? Early childhood experiences can sometimes have a profound affect on adult behavior...

Good to hear you have changed your mind on this:

Which part of "Other than the pain of loved ones left behind" did you not comprehend?

And this has what to do with my question?


Brian, is your stance that assisted suicide should be permitted if society takes precasutions against the practice evolving into state sponsored eugenics / abuse? If that is the case, than all these pages of discourse really should be redirected to question "what precasutions against abuse are reasonable", right? Is that all that is left of your argument? If so, than I feel considerable headway has been made...

 

That's what I said Asguard

 

If you want a religious ethics debate your ringing the wrong number here cupcake.

Im no different from 99% persons of my generation who grew up with some religious experience, however Im a Socialist.

No I was very clear from the start as my opinion on this:

I don’t condemn people for a personal choice, I am more concerned with the wider implication as a whole on society.

Well tell you what start here :

Do you agree with what I quoted here?

 

Americas state-run health plan isnt that a universal health care ?

 

No they are not.

 

no brian they ARNT universal health care. A country where the elderly tend to go bankrupt to pay for there health care is NOT a sociaty with universal health care. Thats what i keep trying to beat into your brainless head, ITS NOT A RELIVENT COMPARISION

 

Well, that's a relief, if you can believe that there are no vestiges of that early influence left. The last thing I wans to do is debate with someone whose god whispers morality in their ear...

You have also been clear from the start that you don't want assisted suicide legalized, therefore your support of "personal choice" is a farce, at best.

Well, that's a lot of ground to cover, so let's start with Oregon.
All quotes from Oregon.gov "Death with Dignity" FAQ's page
Specifically:

It has nothing whatsoever to do with euthanasia:

It meets the "majority" criteria outlined in your post #134:

It is not a "state ran" program:

There are somewhat stringent safeguards in place (IMO):

As to insurance:

Your concern over family members and others making the decisions on behalf of the patient:

Click here for the statutes.
Click here for the administrative rules.


Now, without resorting to your slippery slope argment, what do you see that's wrong with Oregon's version of "Death with Dignity"?

It would seem that it counters most, if not all, of your objections.

If you resort to the "proper enforcement" fear, that can apply to many situations and should not be sufficient grounds to dismiss this act out of hand. Enforcement of any law or regulation is going to incur exceptions where peoples lives are adversely affected.

Take dispensation of medications in general. You have US Federal statutes, regulations and enforcement agencies, coupled with any number of state and local laws and rules - all regulating and proscribing what can and can't be dispensed. In addition, health care professionals (Doctors, pharmacists, nurses, etc) all are subject to stringent licensing requirements. The net effect? There are still occasional mistakes in filling prescriptions, resulting in sickness or even death. Does that mean we shouldn't dispense medications at all?

Once again, at least in the case of Oregon, I find it hard to see where your objections lie if we are to take your previous posts at face value. On the other hand, if you are following some other agenda...

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Are you sure?

Not a universal program as we would know it, but the Goverment does pay for healthcare for those who cannot afford it.

 

god sake, where the hell did you get that artical? right wings r us? 7 lines of text on the anti UHC argument and 1 small line on the other side of the argument