Republican resentment

Discussion in 'Politics' started by billvon, Oct 24, 2020.

  1. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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  3. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Out of courtesy and because I respect you I will reply to you.

    Your vagueness got worse.
    I contend you simply can not rattle off like you have and think you have proved a case which in the first instance you have not even made clear what it is.
    I am still wondering how Hitler going to jail for treason suggests anything.

    Providing more links without any observation is meaningless.

    Further if you feel I threatened you perhaps you could be specific so that I could apologise...well if you have taken offence I apologise now so I dont feel bound to return yo this thread.

    Goodbye.

    Alex
     
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  5. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    The Beer Hall Putsch,
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer_Hall_Putsch#
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2020
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  7. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    You think this may have something to do with it;
    Trump administration budget cuts could become a major problem as coronavirus spreads
    BY CHRIS MORRIS, February 26, 2020 9:45 AM PST
    https://fortune.com/2020/02/26/coronavirus-covid-19-cdc-budget-cuts-us-trump/

    Trump retweets call to fire Fauci amid coronavirus criticism

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/13/politics/donald-trump-anthony-fauci-tweet/index.html
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2020
  8. river

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    15,494
    From the Outside looking in , into to the USA , from the North of the Country . Canada . USA Neighbor . They are very messed up .

    They don't know whether they are coming or going .
     
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  9. river

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    15,494
    Who do the people trust ? Politician , Wall Street ?

    Trust has been so eroded , that democracy may pay a deep price , before it rebounds .

    trump has reminded people of democracy , at least should , ( unintentionally ) , of what the people of China , Russia and any People in a Dictatorship goes through in the begining of the Dictatorship manipulation of the UnEducated , at the time .

    Once in power , eliminate the intellectuals .
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2020
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  10. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    The other night, as a panel guest on Bill Maher, Anthony Scaramucci openly called Trump a coward, said the man has never faced a conflict in his life.
     
    river likes this.
  11. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    This is a person who probably knows Trump's character best. Watch the video.

    Trump’s former attorney Cohen doubts peaceful transition of power
    https://www.msnbc.com/am-joy/watch/...ubts-peaceful-transition-of-power-94611013527
     
  12. river

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    15,494
    Depends on the margin of defeat . Large , 5 to 10 and more points its over . One can only hope today that the common American gets trump , and wants a better Future .
     
  13. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    As the Republican sickness spreads in real time...

     
  14. Bells Staff Member

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    23,511
    No one likes a troll or flame.

    What alternatives do you think should be presented?

    They were presented with access to healthcare (as one example), yet they went out of their way to vote against it.

    So what would you call voters who go out of their way to vote against their own best interest? Particularly Trump voters:

    "How can we explain this seemingly contradictory behavior? According to Ciulla, drawing on Ruth Capriles book, Leadership by Resentment, poor, working-class whites have become deeply frustrated and resentful. They perceive that social programs don’t help them as much as they help (and are targeted toward), ethnic minorities."
    [https://www.psychologytoday.com/au/...-do-people-vote-against-their-best-interests]

    "The president recently signed into law a tax bill whose benefits, according to the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center and the Congressional Budget Office, accrue principally to corporations and super-rich individuals; many middle-class and working-class families will ultimately face a tax hike. The administration and its congressional supporters have also taken steps to make health care less affordable or altogether inaccessible, destabilize retirement security for working-class families, and allow industrial polluters to despoil the air they breathe and the water they drink. Despite what Trump said on the campaign trail, his agenda does little to help and much to hurt struggling white families.

    Of course, whiteness still delivers other dividends—as it always has. It makes one less likely to be killed by a police officer during a traffic stop. It enables white men to carry assault weapons (including long guns) in places of public accommodation, while a black man might be shot and killed by law enforcement officials merely for picking up a BB gun displayed on a sales rack at Walmart. It affords working-class white families the peace of mind that the government won’t invade homes or hospitals in pursuit of undocumented children or grandparents. Whiteness, in other words, continues to pay tangible benefits, and rightly or wrongly, it makes some sense that its primary beneficiaries are loath to support candidates who expressly promise to disrupt this privileged status.

    Yet Trump has also, arguably more than any other candidate for president in the past hundred years (excepting third-party outliers like Strom Thurmond and George Wallace), played to the purely psychological benefits of being white. From his racially laden exhortations about black crime in Chicago and Latino gangs seemingly everywhere, to his attacks on an American-born federal judge of Mexican parentage and on Muslim gold star parents, he has paid the white majority with redemption and revanchism. Trump might be increasing economic inequality, but at least the working-class whites feel like they belong in Trump’s America. He urged them to privilege race over class when they entered their polling stations.

    And it didn’t just stop there. As Ta-Nehisi Coates argues, Trump swept almost every white demographic group, forging a “broad white coalition that ran the gamut from Joe the Dishwasher to Joe the Plumber to Joe the Banker.” It’s not just blue-collar white people who seem blithely willing to sacrifice economic rationality for racial solidarity. After all, it arguably took a special kind of stupid for upper-middle class suburbanites in high-tax states to support a party that just raised their taxes. (No, this wasn’t a bait-and-switch. The GOP leadership has talked openly about eliminating deductions for state and local taxes since 2014.) Unless, that is, you account for the wages of whiteness.
    "
    [https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/12/31/trump-white-working-class-history-216200]


    What would you call these voters?

    Trump won because he appealed to an inherent fear in parts of America. If you call that besting professionals (I am assuming you mean politicians?), then you do you!

    And yet you do not seem to criticise the President who has an "us" vs "them" mentality and who has made it his goal to appeal to the baser racist instincts of his voters? And you are whining about "us vs them"? Come on dude! Pelosi did well to rip up his speech. Because it was a dumpster fire of a crap speech from a horrific President.

    I take it you completely missed the Obama presidency and what the GOP did back then? Did they help?

    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politi...-faced-by-governors-amid-coronavirus-protests
    You are in no position to complain, whine or suggest others make a coherent case when you come out with this kind of drivel:
     
  15. cluelusshusbund + Public Dilemma + Valued Senior Member

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    What do you see as Trumps agenda for the USA an how have you tried to help him acheive it.???
     
  16. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Yes I often just ignore them.

    I added the rev up comment because I wanted to sooth feelings rather than inflame them and hopefully have any one who reads this behave better when they lose ... for either side.

    I presume the fact you ask what alternatives should be presented gives some acceptance to the approach but rather than me listing alternatives they should come from the folk involved.

    Part of the us and them approach is that the other sides interests are not considered.

    I am in favour of free health and free education not only because that is a fair approach but such an approach you could think will produces healthier, happier and more productive citizens...I have no doubt that health insurance is inefficient and probably sees care being determined by what the policy covers.... and clearly the us and them attitude shines brightest in these areas and I find that most sad and indeed repulsive.

    Republicans?

    You did it..you actually said "Trump won"... the point is it was clear, at least to me, the game he was playing ..the rallies gave it away a little...and yet the professional politicians were incapable of countering such a base approach...I don't respect Trump for his tactic but I can not fathom why Hilary with all her experience could not beat such a simple tactic...The fault lays with those who were unable to beat a non professional politician..in my view...not to accept that is to ignore the basic reality of why we lost.

    Funny ...when I said the problem is everywhere I would have thought that could be taken to mean...everywhere...I suppose you would like to believe I was leaving Trump out of it for your reasons but perhaps realise I used the word everywhere meaning...everywhere.

    Come on yourself ... I say again the problem is us and them..do you have any intelligent comment to say why that is not so.

    And of course if the roles were reversed you would be saying what I said...

    There is nothing that justifies the diminishment of that occassion and no matter what bullshit may be going on the image, the custom and ceremony is untouchable...this is most important to any society and not to hold such values means mere opinion can undermine any public office or ceremony.

    Your stand is somewhat typical of the "us and them mentality" as I am confident if the roles were reversed you would think , for example, Trump tearing up Hilaries speech to be unforgivable.

    There is a right way and a wrong way of expressing oneself and using the important occassion of the Presidential speech to act like a spoilt child is in my view entirely inappropriate...and please realise just because I call out deplorable behaviour that does not mean that I therefore approve the speech or the president or his supporters it means simply I am able to call out deplorable behaviour on my side because it is deplorable behaviour.

    There is no justification for incorrect behaviour..if the speech and the president was so bad then why did she not turn around drop her pants and brown eye the audience? Would you say she did good...I expect so because your hatred has caused you to lose sight of the significance and importance of the presidential speech..it's not a day to express personal opinion can you not get that?

    I am absolutely aware of Republican opposition surrounding Obama..did you know that many including Trump were running around saying he was not born in USA...

    Not only did you miss the point where I wrote that but also you missed the explanation given later to make it entirely clear that in making such a wild statement I was attempting to show that Write 4 U's approach of making wild emotive comments with no tie down to any point he was attempting to make was in keeping with the nonsense I laid out to make that point...I was using nonsense for example and surprised how some folk were unable to notice.

    What you don't get is I am no fan of Trump or the idealology of the Republican party...I am probably more socialist than anyone here, I would support communism except that it requires revolution otherwise state ownership is fine by me...what pulls my chain is the way the dems have no ability to be functional and tied to emotion in dealing with opposition..the speech tear up is a fine example..just stupid and would have lost voters assuming there are dems that think that speech day should hold respect...acting like spoilt children and making excuses just does not go down well with me..you lose accept it work out why and get back to working on the next win...look at the dems since their loss..bitch and whine but no plan to win that I could see...I say rather than bitch and whine and tear up speeches put the energy into fighting and winning.

    Alex
     
  17. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    To make America great and I know I should buy a hat but I don't wear silly hats ...

    I do wonder why he bothered...it just seems like work to me...he is my age and yet I have no illusions that what I believe matters or should be followed by a nation...I often think how much luckier I am than him...I do exactly what I want and have no problem speaking the truth because I am not depending on anyone's support for my life style...I live in a caravan (trailer home) and could live in a tent if need be. What little money I had to spare I spent on my hobby...I don't need to impress anyone and can live with my flaws and lack of intelligence knowing if anyone is attempting to insult me by listing my inabilities and lack of whatever that they probably have left a lot out.

    I don't look down on anyone or look up to anyone and not swelled up with my own importance so not normal really.

    I can't see any of my philosophy being of any help to anyone really let alone Trump.
    Alex
     
  18. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Those where not wild emotive comments. Those were facts as reported by the news.
    That you cannot connect the dots and see the implications of this that is your failing. That is how all dictators come to power. But hey, you're 9400 miles from the US, so why should you give a shit?

    This is not an issue that can be resolved with some clever nonsense. This is serious business, people are dying.
    Well that doesn't seem to stop you from insulting me, does it?
     
  19. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    If you want to make a case I feel you could do more...that is my opinion you however clearly think differently..so be it...however I really did not mean to insult you and if that is how you have taken it I appologise...

    Sure it is...in your view.

    My view is if you are presenting a view which you now come out and mention you should point to a fact and then explain how there is a parrallel. It now seems you think that Trump is setting up to become a dictator ...if so I hope you are wrong...if he has any sense he will be happy if loses so he can't go home and enjoy his great wealth...build another mansion perhaps, fit out a new jet or boat...just take a couple of weeks off.

    Again I did not mean to insult you and if I have been clumbsy please forgive me.

    Because I am a caring person...I don't like to see USA tearing itself to bits. It is not nice seeing so many folk upset and pulling against each other.

    It is just terrible to see how fear runs wild...there are folk who want guns because they think the government wants to put them in concentration camps others such as you apparently who fear that a dictator will take over, there are those who think the end of the world is upon them...of course I care...it is very disturbing.

    Anyways you look after yourself and try not to worry and enjoy what you have today not what you may lose next week.

    All the best.

    Alex
     
  20. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    I specifically qualified those representative examples as being a condensed selection and asked if you needed more. Instead you accuse me of not providing enough.

    Again I ask if you need more? I can come up with about 20000 reasons why this huckster does not belong in the highest office of what is supposed to be the country that is a "shining example of truth, transparency, and democratic values".

    President Trump has made more than 20,000 false or misleading claims. July 13, 2020 at 12:00 a.m. PDT
    p.s that impeachment trial was over before it began. The Republican Senate refused to subpoena witnesses or allow introduction of documentary evidence. This has now become the political world of a dictator.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...e-more-than-20000-false-or-misleading-claims/

    And this is the man who promises to "Make America great again, any day now", every day for 4 years.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2020
  21. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    15,228
    More.......

    Insult after insult. All of Trump's ugly campaign rhetoric in one place

    And governance.
    https://mashable.com/feature/trump-timeline/

     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2020
  22. Bells Staff Member

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    23,511
    Do you want us to ignore you?

    Bullshit.

    Your opening salvo in this thread was pure flame and troll and then you tried to suggest that it was all made up and then you basically went forward and repeated the same right wing rubbish again as your argument in this thread.

    You aren't here to soothe feelings. You are here to flame.

    The not so funny part of your schtick is that you think it is clever and original. It isn't.
    You said:

    "Listen to the folk that you put down as idiots and present to them alternatives that gives recognition to who they are and the matters they feel go unaddressed by polititians..."​

    I am asking you what alternatives do you think could be presented to voters who have thus far voted against access to healthcare, education funding, tax cuts, etc?

    I do want you to list them. I would not have asked you otherwise.

    Don't be lazy now. You stirred this shit, now you have to own it. So what alternatives are there for those voters who went out of their way to vote against their own best interests in the last election because they do not want minorities to have equal access?

    We are talking about "the other side" who voted against access to healthcare, education funding, tax cuts, because of their angst that minorities would also have access to it.

    So, you want to talk about interests and "us and them", how about you address the giant elephant in the room. Do you think the Democrats should be pandering to the racist perversion in American society to garner their votes? Should Democrats give these voters "alternatives" that would pander to their hatred and bigotry by creating an even bigger "us and them" divide between those white voters and minorities?
    That's nice.

    Poor white voters who voted for Trump in droves and are the open mouthed MAGA hat wearing morons will vote for him again in this election because he is taking away any chance of free healthcare and free education. And as I provided you in the previous post, their reasons stem from their anger that minorities would also have access to healthcare and education.. So they vote against what would benefit themselves directly, so long as the black family living next door, does not get to access it.

    So what alternatives do you think exists for these voters?

    The ridiculous irony of your posts in this thread is that you completely disregard the voters you are whining are not being presented alternatives and their "us vs them" attitude.. The Democrats present equal access to healthcare. And you don't think those voters are being presented with alternatives?
    Well Trump was elected by electors in the last election, despite gathering less votes. My quibble and disgust with the American electoral system aside, Trump is currently president.

    Are you suggesting that Democrats should simply have enabled him to carry out whatever the hell he wanted to do because their job was to now facilitate his craziness and racism in policy making? I'm curious? When he gutted access to healthcare, should Democrats have aided him in doing so? Because "he won"?
    You say everywhere, but you are whining about a ripped up speech and Democrats.
    Your identification of the problem is on par with a beauty pageant contestant citing "world peace" as their dream for the world.

    I'm sorry..

    You are more concerned with the visual than with the substance of the fact that he nuked access to healthcare, gave a speech steeped in lies and bigotry, awarded a medal to one of America's most racist and misogynistic radio hosts? I note you aren't complaining that Trump diminished "that occasion" when he refused to shake her hand when he walked into the chamber to give that horrendous speech to begin with, huh?
     
  23. Bells Staff Member

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    23,511
    If Hilary gave a speech that praised cutting access to healthcare, praised bigotry and racism, praised denying women their bodily rights, then I would expect people to rip up that speech.

    Of course.

    You are more concerned with the visual than with the substance and content.
    Good lord!

    Seek help.

    The speech, as well as the man giving the speech, was a joke.

    Presidents have bestowed the Presidential Medal of Freedom on some of America’s greatest writers, artists, entertainers, journalists, and humanitarians — from Toni Morrison to Ansel Adams to Edward R. Murrow to Betty Ford.

    On Tuesday night, President Donald Trump gave it to one of America’s most prominent racists.

    During his State of the Union address, Trump looked to Rush Limbaugh, seated in the audience with Melania Trump, and thanked him for his contributions to American life.

    “And Rush, in recognition of all you have done for our nation, the millions of people today that you speak to and that you inspire, and all of the incredible work you have done for charity, I am proud to announce tonight he will be receiving our country’s highest — you will be receiving our country’s highest civilian honor, the presidential medal of freedom.”

    Republicans cheered.

    John F. Kennedy established the Presidential Medal of Freedom in 1963 to honor Americans who have made “an especially meritorious contribution to the security or national interests of the United States, world peace, cultural or other significant public or private endeavors.”

    This is the content that you are referring to as "the significance and importance of the presidential speech"..

    You are more concerned about ripping a piece of paper, than the content of what was on that paper and what that speech represents..

    And you call yourself a socialist? Perhaps you should reconcile with yourself as to why you are pushing right wing talking points while claiming to be a socialist.
     

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