Our first ancestor does not come from Sub Sahara

Discussion in 'Human Science' started by timojin, May 23, 2017.

  1. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    For all those weisenheimers about human ancestry.
    https://www.thelocal.de/20170522/first-human-ancestor-not-african-german-research-team-claims
    I really love that all those hard nosed.
    New finding say our earliest ancestor comes from Greece
    The lineage of humans and apes possibly split at a point several hundred thousand years earlier than currently assumed - and in the eastern Mediterranean rather than sub-Saharan Africa, a German research team claim.
    After studying the only two fossils found that belong to the hominid Graecopithecus freybergi, researchers at the Senckenberg Centre for Human Evolution and Palaeoenvironment (HEP) in Tübingen came to the remarkable conclusion announced on Monday, and set to be published in the PLOS One magazine.

    Hominids include humans and our ancestors, plus apes and their predecessors.

    Scientists have still to definitively prove when the lineage of humans and apes split. But current established theories suggest that the ancestors of chimpanzees - our closest cousins - and our own predecessors split from one another in Africa at some point between five million and seven million years ago.

    But the team led by Madelaine Böhme have now placed a big question mark over this theory, after examining a jaw bone found in Greece and a tooth from Bulgaria, both belonging to the Graecopithecus freybergi.

    After detailed study, the researchers believe that the Graecopithecus freybergi is a previously unknown ancestor of humans. Researchers found that the root of the tooth is largely melded, a characteristic of humans and their predecessors, but not of apes, who have split roots.

    “We were surprised by the results, as previously pre-humans were only known from sub-Saharan Africa,” said Jochen Fuss, one of the scientists involved in the study.

    By analyzing the sediment in which the fossils were found, the scientists dated the jaw to 7.175 million years old, and the tooth to 7.24 million years old. That makes the fossils older than the oldest human ancestor known in Africa - the Sahelanthropus, which is six to seven million years old.
     
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  3. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    Well, I think it's cool you don't blab about Noah's Ark.
     
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  5. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    Agree

    But it's early years yet and the millennium has only just started

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
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  7. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    One deformed tooth and a jawbone (which does not confirm the deformed tooth) changes everything we know about human history?

    For that matter, how did early humans (tool users) also appear at the southern tip of Africa?
    Can anyone explain how Chimpanzees migrated to Africa if they are a close cousin to us? That presents a migratory riddle to me.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2017
  8. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    who is blabbing about Noah's ark, that is millions of year difference.
    What we know is only what we find and then we draw conclusion and extrapolate , so I am not sure we really know enough yet.
    Do we know if the split comes from chimpanzee or perhaps orangutan ?
    Do we know the environment in the mediterranean area was between 5 and 10 million years ago ?
    How did we arrive from one fingertip to call Dionysian man ?
     
  9. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    We know there were no chimps or orangutans.
     
  10. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    We know. Who are we and how do you know ? Could you explain how do you know were do you get your information ?
     
  11. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    I was responding to this statement.
    My question was how Chimps ended up in Africa. Somebody must have migrated from or to the Mediterranean area or Africa.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2017
  12. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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  13. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    Hominids didn't evolve from chimps or orangutans, but from a common ancestor which was neither.
     
  14. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Chimpanzee - based on genetics, not geography.
    Very dry. The Mediterranean dried up around that time (5 million years ago.)
     
  15. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Neither, The split from our common ancestor had already taken place long before that.
    Thus the question remains if the split happened in Africa and humans migrated north, or the split happened in the Mediterranean and chimpanzees (as well as humans) migrated south.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2017
  16. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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  17. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    From my understanding, during the early part of the Messinian (claimed date for the artifacts in discussion), one would expect warm and dry in the western mediterranean, and warm and humid in the eastern mediterranean and black sea areas.
     
  18. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Assuming this area was inhabited during that time, this might be causal to a migration away from this area.
     
  19. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    the fossils were dated @7.2 million years old---------when that area was moist and warm.
    Then, circa 6 mybp
    was the mediterranean basin much like modern day death valley?
     
  20. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Well, it is possible that this caused a mass migration to the tropical forests to the south.
     
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  21. Walter L. Wagner Cosmic Truth Seeker Valued Senior Member

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    The genus Homo was widely distributed from Africa to Asia.

    The genus Equuus was likewise widely distributed from Africa to Asia.

    Same with Rhinoceros, global from Africa to Asia.

    Perhaps the only reason we've found pre-Homo genera only in Africa is we haven't looked in the right places. Now they've looked in a certain place in Greece, and found pre-Hom0. Perhaps we'll find lots of global distribution of various pre-Homo genera. Shoots the 'out of africa' theory out of the water, though.
     
  22. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    Perhaps. the "out of Africa" hypothesis was created by simple minds looking for simple answers to complex questions.
    From Lake el'gygytgyn to gobekli tepe much of what we thought that we "knew" we now understand to have been false.
    That's the great thing about archaeology (or any science): Tomorrow's understandings ain't here yet.
     
  23. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    I really go along with that.
     

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