On the circularity of faith

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by water, Jun 14, 2005.

  1. Crunchy Cat F-in' *meow* baby!!! Valued Senior Member

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    Water,

    The statement that brought about the response was a work of someone
    whom cared enough to be disrespectful. It's a shame for this person in
    particular.
     
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  3. §outh§tar is feeling caustic Registered Senior Member

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    I wasn't speaking of the spirituality of animals..

    You and I are quite unqualified to make such bold assertions so let's keep to the human domain for now. Could you please show me any examples of feral children who have on their own recognized the inherent evil of man? If not, can it be safe to suppose you are making all this up and can provide no reason for these claims?
     
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  5. Crunchy Cat F-in' *meow* baby!!! Valued Senior Member

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    I agree this definition is important. How is 'God' being defined at the forefront
    of the thread?


    Science isn't really looking for proof of 'God'. Its looking for truth and finds
    alot of contradictions to various assertions of 'God's existence. Regardless,
    for a life form that is supposed to exist right now at this very moment, the
    natural question of 'where is it' comes to mind.

    I wasn't focusing on belief in the original assertion. I was focusing on trust.
    A person can choose to upkeep trust (even unconditionally) regardless of
    the quantity and quality of the number of times that trust is broken.

    Interesting ideas. I will reply in the form of a question:

    Why won't 'God' take you up on an invitiation to go out for a cup of coffee?
     
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  7. ellion Magician & Exorcist (93) Registered Senior Member

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    yes your right, the the only qalification i have is a gcse in english.
    yes you right, i was making it up and if you re read you'll see i plainly say "I IMAGINE ......" so no i wouldnt be able to provide examples of such kids. can you give any examples (apart from mowgli) to support your claims ?
     
  8. ellion Magician & Exorcist (93) Registered Senior Member

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    science finds lots of contradictions for its own assertions. quite paradoxical really isnt it?
     
  9. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    The scientist suspended his already existing knowledge about something, allowing that there be a completely different explanation, with new evidence for a phenomenon, which in turn re-defined the phenomenon.

    No, the scientist uses existing knowledge based on observations and experiments to make predictions and test those predictions.

    Therefore, in order to test your hypothesis, the assumption and acceptance that gods exist is necessary. Without it, the hypothesis is meaningless.
     
  10. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    20,855
    science finds lots of contradictions for its own assertions.

    Can you provide examples?
     
  11. Crunchy Cat F-in' *meow* baby!!! Valued Senior Member

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    It's not paradoxical at all. If evidence is found that contradicts existing theory
    then theory is remodeled or discarded entirely. Take the Higgs Boson for
    example. In 2007 the Hadron Collider will definitively show if it exists. If
    it does it becomes evidence that supports many theories. If it doesn't then
    some theories will be remodeled and others will be scrapped.
     
  12. MarcAC Curious Registered Senior Member

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    When did spirituality become equivalent to recognising acts of God? Can you provide any support at all for this? As far as I know the greatest problem normal humans have had with feral children is communication. Failing that we shouldn't posture any claims regarding the "spirituality" of feral children much more their knowledge of God.
     
  13. MarcAC Curious Registered Senior Member

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    What's the difference between the two (2) statements dear Q?

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    Is it me or was the argument that was originally posted of a non-scientific nature? If it isn't me then someone needs to stop making pointless statements of frustration (in other words addressing that which has already been addressed or addressing a non-issue).

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  14. MarcAC Curious Registered Senior Member

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    (It referring to science) Such as?

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    It's the funniest thing when atheists try to sneak all sorts of gospel into their "logical" framework.

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  15. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    What's the difference between the two (2) statements dear Q?

    You're kidding, right?

    Is it me or was the argument that was originally posted of a non-scientific nature?

    There was no difinitive nature to the argument, or lack thereof.

    If it isn't me...

    Oh, but it is. For some reason, you appear completely incapable of synthesis and end each non-sentence with a smiley face. Curious...
     
  16. MarcAC Curious Registered Senior Member

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    No, I'm not. :bugeye: Since I appear to be incapable of whatever you stated please educate me then... explicitly illucidate the difference between the two statements, please, if you recognise such.
     
  17. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    If you must insist on having your intelligence insulted, I'll graciously accept the offer.

    "The scientist suspended his already existing knowledge..."

    "the scientist uses existing knowledge..."

    Do you see the difference?
     
  18. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    I appear to be incapable of whatever you stated

    The word was 'synthesize.' It means to combine ideas into a complex whole.
     
  19. MarcAC Curious Registered Senior Member

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    You are insulting your own intelligence dear Q.

    As a sidenote, those are phrases taken out of context, not statements.

    If you refer back to the original statements...
    ... i.e. if a theory predicts A and observation shows B, then B is a different "explanation" as opposed to A.

    The scientist suspends his "knowledge" based on the prediction A and allows for the explanation B.

    What you did, again, was state the obvious which was already addressed in the statement (not phrase) that the prediction A is contradicted by observation (which is rather obviously inherrent to the phrase "new evidence for a phenomenon" placed in context of the statement).
     
  20. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    . i.e. if a theory predicts A and observation shows B, then B is a different "explanation" as opposed to A.

    No, prediction A becomes 'null' and a new prediction is made based on B observations.

    The scientist suspends his "knowledge" based on the prediction A and allows for the explanation B.

    No, the scientist never suspended his knowledge about anything. His prediction was null based on the observations. The theory in which he based his prediction must have been tested to a certain degree of accuracy in the first place. We must therefore ask how the observations made an already tested theory produce null results.

    All of this based on existing knowledge.

    What you did, again, was state the obvious ...

    No, what you did, again, was fail to understand the obvious.
     
  21. §outh§tar is feeling caustic Registered Senior Member

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    Type 'feral child' into google. 269000 hits should be enough.
     
  22. Crunchy Cat F-in' *meow* baby!!! Valued Senior Member

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    Which religious assertion of 'God' would you like to have a contradiction for?
     
  23. glaucon tending tangentially Registered Senior Member

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    Not quite sure I want to wade into this thread at this point but.. I can't resist a logic game so...
    First things first however: what is this supposed circular argument being discussed??
    And yes, I have read the whole thread... no one has explicitly mentioned it.
    TIA
     

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