Making a laser/light "weapon"

Discussion in 'Architecture & Engineering' started by cmf, May 20, 2011.

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  1. cmf Registered Member

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    (What I am talking about will look like a pager/cell phone...before that issue gets raised).

    Hi..

    We are hoping to start a laser tag-like game that people play 24 hours/day, and it's basically a giant game of assassination laser tag that is always ongoing.

    However...the typical laser tag 'ammunition' won't work because it won't penetrate pockets or bags..It has to directly hit the sensor. But we want something that is unobtrusive, where people don't need to wear visible sensors or anything..I want the signals to get through several layers, like cell phones and beepers do.


    Here's some technical info of what won't work that may be helpful -


    lasertagparts.com/mtformat-2.htm


    Honestly, I have very little knowledge about this aspect of what we want to do. :shrug: But can anyone here think of a way to make something like this work? I could give more details about what we hope the prototype will look like/include, but I need to figure out if it's even possible to create..
     
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  3. cmf Registered Member

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    --------i posted this somewhere else, but they needed more info, so.. -----


    I spoke with a guy who reprograms the laser tag modules...He said that everything else should be possible, except for needing the sensors to be visible.

    First, these would be about the size of an altoids mint tin. We've had initial talks with a cell phone service provider to use their 3G network (similar to how Kindle uses AT&T's network). They were interested in the added exposure it would give them, plus if people on their networks had extra services/advantages, then it'd be good for them. We'd have to install/connect a chip which will resemble Verizon's mifi chip -

    lifehacker.com/5564269/replac...izon-mifi-chip

    And so.....People buy the "weapon". They sign up for a T.A.G tournament which will have a large cash grand prize..A program/website will arrange them in order, initially using their zip codes or whatever. Each person will have a time limit to find their next target, and then the next one, etc..Each weapon will have it's own id number, like laser tag weapons do, and so the person would only be able to eliminate their target if they shoot them...As soon as they do, the info is sent using the 3G network...etc. Once the contestants get whittled down enough, then the game would change slightly and we'd do a big final round...

    And so...we've had several venture capitalists show interest, but we need to figure out if it's even possible to make the actual 'ammunition'. I have a programmer who's used to the laser tag system working with me, but - if anyone is interested if this turns out to be possible -we could use a couple of people who know more about this kind of stuff...

    Anyways, that's the plan. Initially, I had thought that we could do it all with laser tag technology, and it IS possible to put the weapon/transmitter and the receiver/target in the same casing, but again...I don't know about the firing aspect....

    If the frequency of the light wave is changed, would that affect whether the sensor needs to be in direct line of sight?

    thanks...I really appreciate any information or suggestions you could give me!
     
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  5. phlogistician Banned Banned

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    Use a code pulsed infra red laser (laser tag used an infra red LED, get 21st century). Infra red will penetrate thin fabric. Coding the pulse will allow for easy identification of the shooter.

    Of course, the problem you have with the game, is that if people aren't wearing any outward sign they are playing the game (ie the sensors), how does the assassin know who to shoot?

    Unless you make sensor jackets, maybe with a small logo on, that players will recognise, and that you know will pick up the infra red beam, because you've made and tested them with your shooting equipment. If players place sensors themselves, how do you know they can actually detect the shot? Of course, if you go down the jacket route, you could hide regular tag sensors behind logos or patches on the back/arms/chest of the jacket.

    You need to record the number of shots fired AND that they were not directed at non game players. It's not acceptable to 'spray and pray', that's hardly skillful. The jacket helps the shooter identify the target, so you could save yourself the problem of identifying where each shot was placed, although there still should be some mechanism for disqualifying players that shoot innocents. A hit man would not make such a mistake.

    Oh, btw, using this method is only going to cost you 2% of your net profit, should you care to make use of the ideas.

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  7. cmf Registered Member

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    2% sounds more than fair!

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    Thanks for the idea. As for who to shoot...Players will be given a photo/address/work address of the people they are going after.

    Granted, people may worry about the privacy issue, but it's really no different than looking up someone information in a phone book.

    Do you mind if I message you with other questions? Yours is the best suggestion I've gotten so far.
     
  8. phlogistician Banned Banned

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    Please do. I have some experience in this area, I used to play Lazer Tag (still have a couple of sets in my attic, two pistols, two caps, four sensors), and used to play 'Killer' when I was as a student.
     
  9. Nasor Valued Senior Member

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    Question: What's to keep people from cheating by simply not carrying their sensor around with them for most of the day, thus making themselves "invulnerable"? If I were unscrupulous and wanted to win your big prize, I would probably leave my game equipment in a drawer at home all the time except when I was going out to "kill" my target. Even then, I would probably leave it wrapped in foil/in a backpack/covered with a coat/whatever until I actually needed to take it out and use it, and then I would put it right back.
     
  10. phlogistician Banned Banned

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    I was musing on this,.... I reckon the actual shooting/detection part is the weak link, and an unnecessary complication.

    I reckon GPS tracking solves it all,... you can track friends on Google Maps, using phone triangulation and GPS, and my phone also GeoStamps photographs, so to play the game, players sign in to Google Maps, and this is monitored by the game hosts, and the killers take a geostamped picture of their victim, and send it to the host, who compares the location to the position of the victim, and scores the hit.

    Simples. No additional technology required, over what is already available right now. I guess there could be 'an app for that' which signs people in, and takes care of sending the MMS message, etc etc, and receives real time updates, bonus hits,... just like you see on 'The Bourne Identity' etc. A bonus could be that a hit needs a 'cleaner' so another player needs to go spend five minutes standing at the location of a previous hit within a certain time, to 'clean' the scene, for extra points.

    This of course takes care of shooting the wrong person (victim not in GeoStamped, location? Oooppps!) , for which there should be a penally, like evading the Police (played by another player for a bonus) for a period of time.
     
  11. Nasor Valued Senior Member

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    Interesting idea, but there are lots of places where GPS doesn't work; in buildings, subway, parking garages, even city streets where there are too many tall buildings around...

    Also, it seems like there would still be problems with people just turning their stuff off when they aren't right about to make the hit, leaving them basically invulnerable - unless the person assigned to hunt them just happens to be in exactly the right area at exactly the right time. I suppose maybe you could have a system where the hunter has to stay signed in until he gets his target, and looses the assignment if he logs off. Although then you're back to the GPS dead zone problem again...
     
  12. phlogistician Banned Banned

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    Yeah, but the 3G phone network can triangulate your position quite accurately. On my phone, just using 3G in built up areas (that have lots of phone masts) it gets my position within 10metres. Out in the countryside the accuracy isn't as good, as there aren't as many masts to triangulate from, but then the GPS isn't hindered, so that provides position date.

    Onto cheating,... the people running the game will log that players are online.
     
  13. jamesbrentonk Banned Banned

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    You're using outdated phone services. You should start using computerized technophones. They're the ipad of the future. Aha ha anyway.
     
  14. cmf Registered Member

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    I was envisioning a wristband that can't be removed, and if the weapon was separated from it by more than 20 feet or so, then a connection between them would be broken and the person would be eliminated..or something like that.


    And the server would send random messages to the players throughout the day telling them they have five minutes or so to check in...


    But it's all moot if we can't figure out a type of wave that can penetrate pockets/bags, but it also needs to be something that can be aimed from a distance of ten feet or so and can hit a general area about the size of a person..

    thanks for the replies so far.
     
  15. phlogistician Banned Banned

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    I think you are perhaps limiting your potential market by not trying to use existing technology built into current mobile phones, and also increasing your cost base by trying to invent bespoke hardware.

    If you do insist on a physical sensor/weapon, make something that plugs into a phone's USB socket as an accessory. That will keep it simple. Or it could simply send a coded signal using the headphone socket,... 'listens' for a waveform, and uses an infra red laser to send a wav coded transmission. That makes the hardware compatible with a lot of devices.
     
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