Israel, Palestine and the Arab/Israel Conflict

If I am not mistaken, IAF means Israel Air Force. With so much hate toward Israel, how ironic for him to train IAF for 18 months.

By the way, he appears to have an obsession with the number "18".

 

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You must have guzzled a whole six-pack of Coronas if you think those events are even remotely similar.

 

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hunguv, good observation

whirlwind is probably 18, was hit on the head 18 times, and failed Grade 11 history 18 times

 

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ill put up some bloody pictures of what Israeli soldiers are doing everyday and in contrast what CNN shows you. there coming soon, ill put them up as soon as i can.

 

Bloody pictures appeal to emotion and lack context. It's the last resort of someone who has lost their argument.

 

75% of Palestinians are now living below the poverty line ($2 per day per person). The povertry line in "Israel" is $20 per day per person.

48% of all Palestinian women and 45% of children under 5 years are now aneamic. Before the intifada, 20% of Palestinian women were aneamic.

30% of all Palestinian children suffer malnutrition.

Generous offer to the Palestinians
Oslo Agreement to the Palestinians: You are going to have 22% of the 100% which was originally yours.

Barak's "Generous" offer to the Palestinians: We are going to give you 80% of 22% of 100% of the land which was originally yours.

Sharon's "Peace" plan to the Palestinians: We are going to give you 42% of 80% of 22% of 100% of the land which was originally yours, and this 42% will remain under continuous curfew.

American Christian Zionists to the Palestinians: We are asking Sharon to give you 0% of 42% of 80% of 22% of 100% of the land which was originally yours.

Bush's "Peace" plan to the Palestinians: I trust Sharon's judgment, since he is a 'man of peace,' but where the hell is Palestine?

Blair's "Peace" plan to the Palestinians: We started this whole mess. But right now I go along with Bush's extraordinary "vision."

 

"If I were an Arab leader I would never make terms with Israel" - Ben-Gurion
(First Prime Minister of Israel)

One day, or rather night, in 1956 I sat up at his house [Ben-Gurion's] till three in the morning. That night, a beautiful summer night, we had a forthright discussion on the Arab problem.

"'I don't understand your optimism," Ben-Gurion declared.

"Why should the Arabs make peace? If I were an Arab leader I would never make terms with Israel. That is natural: we have taken their country.

Sure, God promised it to us, but what does that matter to them? Our God is not theirs.

We come from Israel, it's true, but two thousand years ago, and what is that to them?

There has been anti-Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault?

They only see one thing: we have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that?

They may perhaps forget in one or two generations' time, but for the moment there is no chance.

So it's simple: we have to stay strong and maintain a powerful army. Our whole policy is there. Otherwise the Arabs will wipe us out... "

From: Nahum Goldmann, The Jewish Paradox: A personal memoir - New York: Grosset and Dunlap, 1978, pp. 99-100.

 

Classic Quotes on Zionism

"There is no such thing as a Palestinian people... It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn't exist." -- Golda Meir Statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.

"How can we return the occupied territories? There is nobody to return them to." -- Golda Meir (quoted in Chapter 13 of The Zionist Connection II: What Price Peace by Alfred Lilienthal )

"We shall try to spirit the penniless population across the border by procuring employment for it in the transit countries,while denying it any employment in our own country .... expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly." -- Theodore Herzl (from Rafael Patai, Ed. The Complete Diaries of Theodore Herzl, Vol I)

"... it is the duty of the [Israeli] leadership to explain to the public a number of truths. One truth is that there is no Zionism,no settlement, and no Jewish state without evacuating Arabs, and without expropriating lands and their fencing off." -- Yesha'ayahuBen-Porat, (Yedi'ot Aharonot 07/14/1972) responding to public controversy regarding the Israeli evictions of Palestinians in Rafah, Gaza, in 1972. (Cited in Nur Masalha's "A Land Without APeople" 1997, p.98)

Speaking about Zionism, and its effects on the indiginous Palestinians: (quotes from Alfred Lilienthal's The Zionist Connection II: What Price Peace)

"We seem to have thought of everything -- except the Arabs" -- Judah Magnes

"If this be the Messiah, then I do not wish to see his coming" -- Ahad Ha'am speaking of Zionism.

"I have learned that the state of Israel cannot beruled in our generation without deceit and adventurism."-- Moshe Sharett, Israel's first Foreign Minister and later a Prime Minister(p.51 Simha Flapan, "The Birth of Israel", 1987).

"The very point of Labor's Zionist program is to have as much land as possible and as few Arabs as possible!" --Yitzhak Navon ("moderate" ex-Israeli president and a leading labor party politician.) Cited on p.179 of Nur Masalha's A Land without a People who cites Bernard Avishai's The Tragedy of Zionism 1985 p.340.

 

What if 158,000 Americans were killed?

In the last 20 months 1% of the Palestinian population has been killed or wounded by Israel.

In the USA that would be equivalent (if we take 1% of the American population) to 158,000 dead and 3,600,000 injured.

 

What about suicide bombings?

Extract from an interview by a western journalist with Shaykh Mohammed Hussein Fadlallah:

What about the suicide bombings against Israeli civilians? What would Fadlallah say to me, I asked, if I were an Israeli father who had lost one of his three daughters to a suicide bomber? How would he counsel me?

"I would tell you that the person who killed your daughter is under occupation," Fadlallah said. "You have driven him to desperation. My advice to you would be to join forces with those who want to end the occupation. Then your other two daughters would be safe."

Washington Post, 7 June 2002

 

We killed children by fracturing their heads with sticks

Quoted from the Israeli newspaper Davar, 9 June 1979

Testimony of an Israeli soldier who participated in the massacre at al Duwayima Village, on 29th October 1948:

"Killed between 80 to 100 Arabs, women and children.

To kill the children they fractured their heads with sticks. There was not one house without corpses. The men and women of the villages were pushed into houses without food or water. Then the saboteurs came to dynamite the houses.

One commander ordered a soldier to bring two women into a house he was about to blow up.

Another soldier prided himself upon having raped an Arab woman before shooting her to death.

Another Arab woman with her newborn baby was made to clean the place for a couple of days, and then they shot her and the baby.

Educated and well-mannered commanders who were considered "good guys" became base murderers, and this not in the storm of battle, but as a method of expulsion and extermination. The fewer the Arabs who remained, the better."

 

lets see what you say after i show you HUNDREDs of pics. what will you say when you see a pic of 2 Israeli soldiers beating up an infant with sticks? or a soldier beating an old lady? or a 2 soldiers shooting a 50 year old suvillian man with automatic machine guns until his LEG FALLS OFF. or the pic of an 8 meter high wall which makes the schools/hospitals/work places over 18 km away (before the wall they were within 3km) and all of the people with no jobs/education/medical care as a direct result.

do you expect Palastinans to roll over and play dead when Israel invaded in 1947 and 1967 and took the land? would you if it happened to you? and as for those pictures, you have a choice if you want to see them unfortuantely the Palastinians dont. they see it every day so they are obvioulsy going to fight back the only way they can (suicide bombings)

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No need to see hundreds of pics. My own cousin was a commando and medic patrolling in Lebanon. One night they saw someone walking around after cerfew holding something that looked like a gun. They shot a shoulder-fired missile at him. Turned out it was an old man with a broom. It was my cousins' duty to scoop up what was left of him. Such are the horrors of war.

 

AND THEY SAY IRAQ HAS BROKE 17!!

UN Resolutions Against Israel, 1955-1992
Resolution 106: "... 'condemns' Israel for Gaza raid"
Resolution 111: "...'condemns' Israel for raid on Syria that killed fifty-six people"
Resolution 127: "...'recommends' Israel suspend its 'no-man's zone' in Jerusalem"
Resolution 162: "...'urges' Israel to comply with UN decisions"
Resolution 171: "...determines flagrant violations' by Israel in its attack on Syria"
Resolution 228: "...'censures' Israel for its attack on Samu in the West Bank, then under Jordanian control" ...


The following are the resolutions vetoed by the United States during the period of September, 1972, to May, 1990 to protect Israel from council criticism:
....condemned Israel's attack against Southern against southern Lebanon and Syria..."
....affirmed the rights of the Palestinian people to self-determination, statehood and equal protections..."
...condemned Israel's air strikes and attacks in southern Lebanon and its murder of innocent civilians..."
....called for self-determination of Palestinian people..."...

http://www.mideastfacts.com/resolutions.html



U.S. Vetoes of UN Resolutions Critical of Israel
(1972-2003)
Vetoes: 1972-1982
Subject Date & Meeting US Rep Casting Veto Vote
Palestine: Syrian-Lebanese Complaint. 3 power draft resolution 2/10784 9/10/1972 Bush 13-1, 1
Palestine: Examination of Middle East Situation. 8-power draft resolution (S/10974) 7/2/1973 Scali 13-1, 0 (China not partic.)
Palestine: Egyptian-Lebanese Complaint. 5-power draft power resolution (S/11898) 12/8/1975 Moynihan 13-1, 1...

http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/UN/usvetoes.html



And they (America) say Iraq violated 17 or something?

 

will you stop quoting and start talking?

all of these facts can be put into context very easily and thus used against you and the 'palestinians'

 

The quotes about un resolusions are used for Israels argument. Isnt it funny that Israel, that even its most hatefull critics say its crimes are marginal compared to most countries during war, is beeing bombarded by so many resolusions? when u got dousans of muslim countries (and until 1990 the soviet block that supported them) it was very easy to sneak in resolusions. Means completley nothing. Write something original pls.

 

After Israel got out of Lebanon, three Israeli soldiers who were patrolling on the border, in the Israeli side, were kidnaped and killed by Hezbolah. It appeared that the UN soldiers from the Hindi regiment helped hezbolah.

 

that's probably because they were mad at the Israeli noncompliance with the UN resolutions