Is faith a reliable path to knowledge?

[Jan Ardena]

Yeah, that's a great question, how about you stop changing the subject?

Firstly, I didn't ask you a question.
I want you to explain the basis of your belief, the way you expect me to explain mine.


So how do you know that nobody has a perception of God?

Why do you believe that someone must demonstrate that God is real, for you to believe God is real?

Jan

 

[Beer w/Straw]

Firstly, I didn't ask you a question.
I want you to explain the basis of your belief, the way you expect me to explain mine.


So how do you know that nobody has a perception of God?

Why do you believe that someone must demonstrate that God is real, for you to believe God is real?

Couldn't you just be trying to coax someone to show you a disrespect for your beliefs in order to justify a bias you hold?

 

[Write4U]

What was the display of spirituality?

Who did the cathedrals honor? IMO, its part of the spiritual illusion of the mind.
The biggest pyramid, the tallest church, the greatest cathedral, the Holy See. All designed to imprint an image of mystical powers to locals and visitors.

As Carlin would say it its just a display of c......., naah, I won't say it.

 

[Jan Ardena]

Who did the cathedrals honor?

The Bishops?

jan.

 

[Write4U]

The Bishops? jan.

Jeez, cathedrals were built to honor God. A House of God?

And this may also appeal to you:

or this:

 

[spidergoat]

I want you to explain the basis of your belief, the way you expect me to explain mine.

They are connected. You can't demonstrate the central premise of your argument, that theists have a perception of a real god, and atheists don't. As long as theists can't demonstrate that there is a god, I will continue in my (default) state of disbelief.

 

[Write4U]

I wonder if there are any statistics on the benefits vs damages done by the various religions. If anything, it would show if it is a successful survival mechanism or not. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_war

 

[Jan Ardena]

Jeez, cathedrals were built to honor God. A House of God?

A cathedral is a Christianchurch which contains the seat of a bishop, thus serving as the central church of a diocese, conference, or episcopate.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathedral

Jan.

 

[Jan Ardena]

Double post.

 

[Write4U]

A cathedral is a Christianchurch which contains the seat of a bishop, thus serving as the central church of a diocese, conference, or episcopate.

Jan.

Well, most of them had glass-in-lead decorative windows. I just told you how they are made. I don't care what a cathedral is in the hierarchy of religion.

It was only in context of opulence in order to impress the faithful and "hopefully" God.

 

[Write4U]

This is what I was talking about;

A revival of the art and craft of stained glass window manufacture took place in early 19th-century Britain, beginning with an armorial window created by Thomas Willement in 1811-12.[citation needed] The revival led to stained glass windows becoming such a common and popular form of coloured pictorial representation that many thousands of people, most of whom would never commission or purchase a painting, contributed to the commission and purchase of stained glass windows for their parish church.

Within 50 years of the beginnings of commercial manufacture in the 1830s, British stained glass grew into an enormous and specialised industry, with important centres in Newcastle upon Tyne, Birmingham, Whitechapel in London, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Liverpool, Norwich and Dublin. The industry also flourished in the United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand. By 1900 British windows had been installed in Copenhagen, Venice, Athens, Bangalore, Nagasaki, Manila and Wellington

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_and_Irish_stained_glass_(1811–1918)

and watch the proces here: the stained glass starts at 35:15

 

[Jan Ardena]

I don't care what a cathedral is in the hierarchy of religion

"I don't care" being the operative phrase.

Jan.

 

[Write4U]

"I don't care" being the operative phrase. Jan.

Why do you do this? I am telling you a story of historical use of gold nano-particles in stained glass and you are going to correct me on the definition of the word "cathedral"?
Now you are deliberately arguing against a small bit of interest which is a true scientific fact, and you tell me that my use of the word "cathedral" has any bearing on how they made colored glass for religious buildings in the past and still do.
The question is; Did you know this fact or did you learn something new?
Have you ever set foot in a real cathedral? I have. It was spectacular and I recommend anyone to have a peek. It's impressive.

A cathedral is a Christian church which contains the seat of a bishop, thus serving as the central church of a diocese, conference, or episcopate. The counterpart term for such a church in German is Dom from Latin domus ecclesiae or domus episcopalis; also Italian Duomo, Dutch Domkerk and cognates in many other European languages

As it is the seat of the bishop, no expense was spared in construction of these houses of worship.

Cathedrals in the Middle Ages
Cathedrals in the middle ages were typically large churches and were considered the center church of the bishop’s throne. In the medieval times, monumental cathedrals were built to symbolize of faith and a display of creativity within the middle ages society in Europe.

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=cathedrals in the middle ages&qpvt=cathedrals in the middle ages&qpvt=cathedrals in the middle ages&qpvt=cathedrals in the middle ages&FORM=IGRE

 

[Jan Ardena]

They are connected. You can't demonstrate the central premise of your argument, that theists have a perception of a real god, and atheists don't. As long as theists can't demonstrate that there is a god, I will continue in my (default) state of disbelief.

They are both positions, not arguments. Any arguments that ensue, is based on those positions.

jan.

 

[Jan Ardena]

Why do you do this? I am telling you a story of historical use of gold nano-particles in stained glass and you are going to correct me on the definition of the word "cathedral"?
Now you are deliberately arguing against a small bit of interest which is a true scientific fact, and you tell me that my use of the word "cathedral" has any bearing on how they made colored glass for religious buildings in the past and still do.
The question is; Did you know this fact or did you learn something new?
Have you ever set foot in a real cathedral? I have. It was spectacular and I recommend anyone to have a peek. It's impressive.

As it is the seat of the bishop, no expense was spared in construction of these houses of worship.
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=cathedrals in the middle ages&qpvt=cathedrals in the middle ages&qpvt=cathedrals in the middle ages&qpvt=cathedrals in the middle ages&FORM=IGRE

The point I'm making is that belief lies at the heart of everything you have thus far said, and you cannot account for it.
You have as much faith in your belief, as theists have in their belief.

Jan.

 

[Write4U]

The point I'm making is that belief lies at the heart of everything you have thus far said, and you cannot account for it.
You have as much faith in your belief, as theists have in their belief.
Jan.

Belief that gold dust makes red glass? What are you talking about?

That post had nothing to do with belief, but knowledge that mixing gold dust while blowing glass gives it a red hue, which was a miraculous phenomena in those times.

Even today glass blowers can't tell you why gold turns to red. That is explained in the above link about "making stuff smaller".

But I am beginning to believe that you just spout your beliefs, but have no facts from which I can learn anything.

Back up your own claims, before you start judging people's beliefs.

p.s. Do you know how they make church bells? I bet you don't now that either.

For once, try to learn something, and stop your most disagreeable attitude.

 

[Write4U]

spidergoat said,
They are connected. You can't demonstrate the central premise of your argument, that theists have a perception of a real god, and atheists don't. As long as theists can't demonstrate that there is a god, I will continue in my (default) state of disbelief.

Jan Ardena said,
They are both positions, not arguments. Any arguments that ensue, is based on those positions. jan

And your arguments do not in any way strengthen your "position".

 

[Jan Ardena]

And your arguments do not in any way strengthen your "position".

I would expect that, from your perspective.
Your arguments on the other hand, do strengthen your position, as in they convey your atheism.

jan.

 

[Jan Ardena]

That post had nothing to do with belief, but knowledge that mixing gold dust while blowing glass gives it a red hue, which was a miraculous phenomena in those times.

The glass blowing thing is neither here nor there.
Your attempt to explain spirituality, God, existence, and so on, is based on belief.

jan.

 

[Write4U]

I would expect that, from your perspective.
Your arguments on the other hand, do strengthen your position, as in they convey your atheism. jan.

I have made my position clear in previous posts and I am ready to move on to more interesting facts.

The glass blowing thing is neither here nor there.
Your attempt to explain spirituality, God, existence, and so on, is based on belief.
jan.

As Carlin said, God is all powerful and can make and do everything we see, except He just can't handle money. Alaways needs a little more, tax-free. For those gold panes no doubt, or perhaps some more gold brocade on the outfits.