Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by hug-a-tree, Dec 31, 2005.
Who the fuck says?
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You are somthing Else indeed Dragon. At the 8th Week, I beleive abortion to be considerd Murder. I should have stated that from the beganing. You Showed a picture of a fetus more then 8 weeks Devloped.
(6 to 8 weeks post fertilization)
Lens Vesicle, Nasal Pit, Hand Plate; Trunk Widens, Future Cerebral Hemispheres Distinct
Head and Neck
As the brain has increased in size by one-third since the last stage, it is still larger than the trunk.
Rostral neuropore is closed and four pairs of pharyngeal arches are visible now, though the fourth one is still quite small. The maxillary and mandibular prominence of the first arch are clearly delineated. The stomodeum, the depression in the ectoderm which will develop into the mouth and oral cavity, appears between the prominent forebrain and the fused mandibular prominence.Swellings of the external ear begin to appear on both sides of the head, formed by the mandibular arch.
Lens pit has closed, retinal pigment may appear in the external layer of the optic cup and lens fibers form the lens body.
Two symmetrical and separate nasal pits may appear as depressions in the nasal disc.
Blood flow through the atrioventricular canal is divided into left and right streams, which continue through the outflow tract and aortic sac. The left ventricle is larger than the right and has a thicker wall.
Lobar buds appear in the bronchial tree.
Abdomen and Pelvic Regions
The intestine lengthens.
Ureteric bud lengthens and its tip expands, thus beginning the formation of the final and permanent set of kidneys.
Distinct regions of the handplate, forearm, arm and shoulder may be discerned in the upper limb bud.
Lower limb bud begins to round at top and tip of its tapering end will eventually form the foot.
Innervation, the distribution of nerves, begins in the lower limb buds.
SpineThe relative width of the trunk increases from the growth of the spinal ganglia, the muscular plate and the corresponding mesenchymal tissues.
After the 8th week, Then yes it is murder. But since you like to play Picture games, and have Proven a very valuable point. We should Show More pictures of starving Babies, Beaten and battered Unwanted Children too... who Are MUCH more susceptible to pain then the Embryo. Drug addicted babies Born to mothers because they did not have the choice of abortion and the story goes on. A better understanding in sexual education and Protection. Prevention.
Also a Note in Anatomy If you will, when the Central nervous system cord is disconnected (Or undeveloped) the Process known as "Feeling" is disconnected. Have you Taken that into consideration as well? and for the love of this world, I hope there are more of YOU out there having healthy Family's rather then Drug addicted, HIV infected or simply mothers who don't wish to have children out there. Mother who can Not afford the proper care of a baby, or handle the many stresses of having a child. I hope more of YOU out there understand that you are few.. Are you willing to care for all the Un wanted abandoned babies of the world? The Diseased Children who were forced to be Birthed? There aren't enough of YOU out there. So it still needs to be a sad CHOICE made by the one who's to mother and care for this new life. Because things can become much Darker then abortion.
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yes. very dark.
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This nonsense is hardly worth responding to. If you want to discuss this, take it to the "Animal cruelty" thread.
You missed the point again.
Pro-choicers do not say that "mothers should murder their unborn children". They say they should have the right to choose whether or not to terminate an unwanted pregnancy.
See the difference?
This, too, is a straw man. Nobody says innocent babies have no rights.
I don't think you have the first inkling of understanding, if you think this is a matter to "play" with.
Wrong on all counts.
nonsense? really? and were am I saying nonsense in that paragraph? were am I wrong?
Hey ... I can't wait to visit China and savor every meat en bone of every dog they cook in China...yummy. Why you seem to be the one who is givin emotive rubbish cause I wasnt speaking to you at all. Now...u say I am missin what? pro-choicers statement? huh? This thread is about the ethics of abortion and not pro-choicers beliefs. And yes I do have the "inkling" of understanding, now it is you who hasnt got much understanding. In fact I know why are you responding in such way, you are trying to make me pay for what I said about Jews on other thread. Well get this, I have nothing against Jews, so stop this shit against me right now.
Dragon, I stand Corrected. you Seem to know a lot about the Fetus and Development. I am Not going to Argue any further with you on this topic because your Passion For Life Out weighs my Disgust For illness and addiction.... So at this Point, I Take my Hat off Too you Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! ... I DO Wish more HEART Felt people like YOU were out there. I also Wish it was easier to See where I am Coming from as well. but your Passion Is most moving, and I am Done Posting on this thread. Well.. About My Personal opinions Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! I have nothing left..
Didn't I tell you to continue your discussion of animal rights in the "Animal Cruelty" thread, rather than in a thread on abortion? Wouldn't that make more sense?
But ok, I'll tell you what was nonsense... again.
People do not need to eat meat for protein and B12. There are vegetarian sources of those. Beans cannot grow everywhere - so what? Cows cannot live everywhere either. Beans are not the only source of B12, so whether or not they have "enough" is irrelevant.
This is a gross generalisation, based on ... what? Your faulty perception. Are you talking about native Americans, or inhabitants of India? Regardless, Indians (of both types) do not "look like zombies", in general. And your "good for nothing" comment sounds racist.
They eat it because they like the taste. That's all. They don't need it.
Wallowing in your depravity again? What do you think you're achieving with that?
You don't have to post in this thread, dragon. Given your lack of education on the issues, perhaps it would be better if you didn't. It would certainly save me a lot of effort.
Wake up, dragon. There are two sides to the abortion debate, often labelled "pro-life" and "pro-choice". This debate is entirely about the relative merits of the two positions.
What other thread? What about Jews?
Are you anti-semitic as well as cruel to animals?
Not anti-semitic? Then, why would I have any problem with what you said about Jews?
Really, dragon, try to stay on topic. If you want to discuss Jews, do it in another thread. If you want to discuss vegetarianism, do it in another thread. If you have views on abortion, then discuss them here, but try to work out what your position is and why you hold it before you mouth off.
Well having experienced all of the above and then some, I actually prefer to be alive, thank you, prefer it having to having endured having my legs ripped off before I had a chance to live a proper life.
lol, I like this one! any offers to abort Hapsburg! lol
THANKYOU JAMES R!!!! Although many people here don't understand anything about our pro-choice beliefs or even abortion, for that matter, you still stand strong and i believe in everything you say (although people come up with weak come-backs for the reasons that you posted as to why you are pro-choice--I mean, come ON, compare abortion to burglary becoming underground--wtf? You obviously don't understand the stance, quark or whoever posted that--abortion has the same underground sort of existence--or would--as drugs :m: . because drugs are illegal, they are "underground", with dangerous drug-rings and other hazards such as dirtied needles. If abortion were illegal, women would still get them, except in unsanitary, unsafe, unprofessional, and oh yes, ILLEGAL labs. Then you would be killing both the mom AND the child--or is that what you want? ).
Why should the gov't make all our decisions? I mean, COME on, ENOUGH is regulated. I believe in CHOICE, choice in ALL things that is, abortion included.
And thankyou again for your veggie-relations, jamesr. As a proud vegetarian, but NOT preachy, so don't worry--I totally agree with you. Although Quark doesn't seem to understand what you are saying, I see it plainly. Perhaps Quark is to blinded by the standless pro-anti-choice side to see what you mean. Another hyprocritical (i think i spelled that right) thing of the "life" side is that pro- "life" activists, a few years ago, MURDERED an abortion doctor, Dr. David Gunn.
so dragon has such a great understanding of women and abortion, yet refers to an anonymous baby as "he". okay, okay, call me radical, but come ON. men do not rule the world, and that's exactly what they're trying to do on the abortion issue. yes, men do have a hand in pregnancy, but who's body is it? and who usually takes care of the child their entire childhood and youth no matter whether the man runs off, as often has occured. the mother, of course, and the should-be decision-maker on the matter.
Accuse me of whatever you will, but that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.
No matter what it looks like, that's the mother's body that is being destroyed. 530,000 women die from pregnancy every year. Many are saved from this fate by abortion.
I think Baron was lampooning the views of the pro-lifers there, tree tree trin.
What if the man was told by the woman she could not get pregnant becuase of a medical condition? Especially if she knows it isn't true. (happened here in Michigan more than once)
Or perhaps he uses a condome provided by the woman with several strategic needle holes? (also happened)
Taken advantage of in his sleep? (little known fact a man's penis is erect while dreaming)
Both partners are using protection and the rhythm method and he hedges the bets by pulling out? (Hey it could be you in that one in a million)
Doctor performs an incomplete vasectomy?
There are hundred of them, believe me.
Now there is no such thing as either gender always being responsible. There should also be no laws against abortion. I'm sorry but laws only make it underground and unsafe. It doesn't change anything, just how likely the woman is to survive.
oh yea...haha. sry, bar--i deleted the post
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