If Election result 2016 declared illegal, what then?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Quantum Quack, Aug 23, 2018.

  1. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    A founding constitution is a founding constitution regardless of nationality...or politics for that matter...
     
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  3. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    A traffic infraction isn't unconstitutional. Election violations isn't unconstitutional either.
     
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  5. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    do you believe breaking the "rule of law" is constitutional?
    ... just curious..
     
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  7. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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  8. Dr_Toad It's green! Valued Senior Member

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    Nice. Every idiot I had on ignore is right back where they belong.

    I'll just keep asking other members why they made snarky comments to thin air...

    Seattle, you make too damned many assumptions, and "Quantum Quack", who chose his name after long thought and ineffectual attempts to reason does the same.

    pjdud is another case, however. He's just "expletive deleted" stupid. I've worn out my ability to respond to fools politely, or to keep my tongue when they prove themselves fools.
     
  9. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Every time someone posts something like this, I'm reminded of this:

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    - https://xkcd.com/610/
     
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  10. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    Yes.
     
  11. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    Name one assumption that I've made that was wrong.

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  12. Dr_Toad It's green! Valued Senior Member

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    Yep. I still have real books, but nowhere near as many as I'd need to stock the library at the Citadel. Samwell Tarley would get bored in a day...
     
  13. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    To the best of my knowledge:
    There is no law forbidding a candidate from getting information nor advice from anyone in the whole world.
    This would include people of other countries, like England, France, Ethiopia, India, Canada, Australia, Mexico or Russia.

    The question that arises is one of "value".
    Foreign nationals are forbidden to provide anything of value to a political campaign to sway an election.
    If we look at information as having value, then both campaigns could have actively violated the spirit of the law.
    What then?
    The courts have yet to weigh in on this issue.

    Meanwhile
    The electors are chosen by the states, (whose laws regarding the choosing and responsibility of electors varies).
    The electors then choose the president and vice president. (I do not think that they are required to vote for the presidential candidate's running mate).
    The electors have voted and the outcome is 100% legal. Every and any thing that may have happened before that vote is moot.

    Just because a bunch of ignorant spoiled crybabies ain't happy with the result and want to change the rules doesn't mean that they are anything more that a bunch of braying jackasses.
    But then again---I fear the rule of the mob.

    (why the hell am I bothering to post this?)
     
  14. pjdude1219 screw watergate i want to know about zaragate Valued Senior Member

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    i know you enjoy throwing temper tantrums because you think your better than other people. like your posts in this thread. My superiority over isn't imagined though i don't think i'm superior. I know your inferior to me. as much as you throw temper tantrums about how unthinking and uneducated everyone but those you agree with are; you have shown zero ability to judge the merits of ideas based on fact but solely on how close they align to your beliefs. you talk about how much better you via your age but you act like a toddler.
     
  15. pjdude1219 screw watergate i want to know about zaragate Valued Senior Member

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    for me its simply that if we refuse to protect the integrity of our elections we lose the ability to govern with any sort of real capability. Poland in the later years of the elective monarchy comes to mind. The Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth was at one point the largest and most powerful country and fell apart in part because of outside interests getting involved in their elections. While i don't think the US would ever get that bad it does show what allowing foreign meddling in ones elections can do. We need to have a hard line here and if it causes a constitutional crisis so be it, I believe that price to be cheaper than letting a candidate stay in office who had foreign support in his favor.
     
  16. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Trump has to go, and the rest of the Republican Party with him, because anything else is giving up on American democracy.
    One step at a time is progress. Pence is a Republican, like Trump, only without Trump's loyal base of support. Plus the fight ties up the Republican leadership.
    And Pence himself is dirty, of course, being Republican. Line him up for next, if you want - I'm thinking a couple of Senators would be a priority.
     
  17. pjdude1219 screw watergate i want to know about zaragate Valued Senior Member

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    the hallmark of a thinking mind is to be able to defend an ideas validity while not personally holding that idea. It has been my experience that when people make comments such as these what they really mean is to be smart and educated you need to agree with me. Its a natural tendency of humanity to do. it takes a conscious effort to avoid such a pitfall, most people dont bother with such effort. I fail at it a good portion of the time. difference between me and say toad is I realize that and work on it.
     
  18. pjdude1219 screw watergate i want to know about zaragate Valued Senior Member

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    and this is why i can't stand you. so smart yet so mindnumbingly stupid. your doing the same thing trump is doing labeling people as the enemy solely because their doing things you don't like. If we are to save the country and better it we need a functional conservative party. essentially labeling conservatives as the enemy isn't going to fix anything. and yes your going to say your not thats great and for the record i don't think you are and thats what you believe. Yet thats how conservatives are going to see. Your running into the ego problem i explained to your in your anti guncontrol rants. thats great that you think you made the greatest bestest argument ever. its fucking irrelevant what matter is how the argument is received. and you just told every single conservative that you think their criminals. There is always a price, you need to start thinking about it.
     
  19. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    There is a Constitutional prohibition, backed by legislation. It's called the "emoluments clause".
    There is no question that the Russians provided things of value to Trump in the campaign, secretly, to gain advantage for themselves.
    But not the letter. Only Trump has violated the letter, as far as we know or have any evidence.
    For starters, the people you are calling names want the rules enforced, not changed.
    That's a kind of basic mistake, don't you think?
    - - -
    If you want an idea of what's involved, check out the video of Sigal Mandelker refusing to answer this question put to her in a Senate hearing: "Does Mr. Putin personally own assets in the United States?"
    https://www.treasury.gov/about/organizational-structure/Pages/sigal_mandelker.aspx
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2018
  20. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Right now that's the Democratic Party - not that it functions all that well.
    If you want a functional liberal Party to go with your conservative one, you might be talking about a restoration of the former Democratic Party liberalism, and the establishment of a complementary conservative Party more or less from scratch. You would have to get rid of the current Republican Party to do that, and that's the immediate emergency task anyway - so we're on the same team.
    I'm not. I'm labeling the Republican Party fascist - which means among other things terminally corrupt, incapable of democratic governance.
    There's nothing "conservative" about deregulating moneylenders and starting land wars in Asia, for example.
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2018
  21. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Correct.
    Incorrect. The president has certain rights under the Constitution. He was elected, and the election was certified. There is exactly one Constitutional means to change that - impeachment. Anything else is unconstitutional.

    Yep. So if a doctor signed your birth certificate before he was licensed, it would be an "unconstitutional" birth certificate. Would you therefore be stripped of your rights, your job and your family? After all, you are now "unconstitutional."​
     
  22. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    There is none. Nor is there any part of US law that states if the candidate is a member of a golf club, you have to accept it. Does that mean that any president who plays golf can be removed from office?
     
  23. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    yup thats the big ticket event.
    what i am confused about is the level of political knowledge of those democrats saying he should be impeached.
    impeachment is only possible if the majority of the Republican party vote for it.
    thus; they are asking the Republicans to efectively hand the democrats the next election by remving their chosen leader, warts n all.

    which unles he is found having a tea party with people dressed as nazis at a death camp on camera, they are not likely to impeach their only real control of both houses and the presidency for the last 50 years.
    most of the capitalist polaticians are there for greed. not public service.
    thats the lie that many middle of the road democratically orientated people tell themselves.
    it suits their purposes to be able to force others to adhere to a social code while they grab random and back room deals which go against a socialist democratic process.
    that is the greed living inside the capitalist model which is noramlised in the morality of millions if not billions of people. its like a dual personality.
     
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