How long a Fully Synthetic Engine Oil 5w-40 can last?

Discussion in 'Free Thoughts' started by Saint, Mar 7, 2016.

  1. timojin Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,252
    Friend lets talk chemistry and not insults . I am putting details of components in the lubricant while you are not but insults , I am telling what the additive do , while you are not. Here is some thing from Wiki for your expansion of knowledge
    I told you before lets exchange information in chemistry and we might increase or retain what we have learned . Insults don't do the job.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_oil
    API Group IV Polyalphaolefins, 100% Synthetic chemical compound.

    Poly-alpha-olefin (or poly-α-olefin, abbreviated as PAO) is a polymer made by polymerizing an alpha-olefin. It is a specific type of olefin (organic) that is used as a base stock in the production of some synthetic lubricants. An alpha-olefin (or α-olefin) is an alkene where the carbon-carbon double bond starts at the α-carbon atom, i.e. the double bond is between the #1 and #2 carbons in the molecule.[1]

    Ester
    API Group V Esters are 100% Synthetic chemical compounds consisting of a carbonyl adjacent to an ether linkage. They are derived by reacting an oxoacid with a hydroxyl compound such as an alcohol or phenol. Esters are usually derived from an inorganic acid or organic acid in which at least one -OH (hydroxyl) group is replaced by an -O-alkyl (alkoxy) group, most commonly from carboxylic acids and alcohols. That is to say, esters are formed by condensing an acid with an alcohol.

    Many chemically different "esters" due to their usually excellent lubricity are used for various reasons as either "additives" or "base stocks" for lubricants. [1]
     
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  3. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    Not necessarily. With a paraffinic mineral oil, you typically have a viscosity index (VI) of just under 100 and for these you do need a polymer thickener (a Viscosity Index Improver or "VII") to get the high temperature viscosity (SAE20) high enough, when the cold cranking viscosity (0W) is low enough. But PAOs and similar hydrocarbon synthetics can have a VI as high as 140. In other words they do not lose viscosity as rapidly as the temperature rises.

    I explained this earlier - the need for thickeners is far less with these synthetics, which , as I also explained, has further performance advantages.

    Re your latest, I refer you to this link, which explains that PAOs are saturated, I say again, saturated hydrocarbons. No double bonds. If they had double bonds, they would be unstable and unsuitable for use as lubricants.

    http://utsrus.com/documents/seminary_doklady/exxon_mobil_pao.pdf

    (But I really don't know why I'm bothering.

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    Last edited: Mar 14, 2016
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  5. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, I've known all this for a few decades now, thanks.
     
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  7. Saint Valued Senior Member

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    How about my Auto Transmission Oil?
    Is it 40000 km to change?
    I am using Toyota's oil.
     
  8. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    3,252
    Right now I have 110000 miles in my 2006 Mazda I have not change oil in the transmission , I had a honda it stopped on me at 165ooo miles A hyundai 56000 miles the clutch went off and Y will not get my self involved wit Hyundai or KIA they are the same crap
     
  9. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    It is best to change the transmission fluid at 1000 miles then again at 60,000 miles and every 60,000 miles after that. If you just bought a used car it would be best to change all of the fluids if you can't find when they were last changed. The brake fluid should also be changed at about the same time as the transmission fluid is changed.
     
  10. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    3,252
    That is good advice I change only break pads after I heat the metal sound and no turning down the disk. . All those changes make mechanics shops wealthy
     
  11. Saint Valued Senior Member

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    4,752
    When my car was new, I changed the transmission oil after 2000 km,
    followed by every 40000 km.
    Malaysia's weather is hot (average 27-35 degree C), the mechanist said that the oil degenerates faster in hot weather,
    60000 miles too long for us.
     
  12. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    33,264
    I'm talking about AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION FLUID not OIL.
     
  13. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    12,546
    Well actually ATF is a kind of oil, just a rather thin (low viscosity) kind and with a lot of fancy additives, mainly so as to give the right characteristics to the take-up of the brake bands and internal clutches in the transmission, so that you get a smooth drive and don't burn anything out.
     
  14. exchemist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,546
    Really, I would follow the vehicle maker's handbook, both for the specs of the various oils and fluids and for the change intervals. The car makers work hand in hand with the oil manufacturers and little is to be gained by departing from what they say.
     
  15. Saint Valued Senior Member

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    4,752
    We call it Gear Oil here.

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    Usually after 40000km, it was darker, originally it is very reddish.
     
  16. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    Yes gear oil is transmission fluid here. 60,000 miles is what engineers say is the latest to change that oil.
     
  17. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Yes it is redish
     
  18. Saint Valued Senior Member

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    4,752
    60000 miles = 96560 km,
    too long, your gear will spoil.

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  19. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    It depends on how you drive your car. If you are a careful driver always taking it easy then you should be able to go 60,000 miles without any transmission problems. The new types of transmission oils are designed to go 60,000 miles just read the label of the type you buy and it will tell you.
     
  20. Saint Valued Senior Member

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    4,752
  21. river

    Messages:
    17,307
    Just a tid bit of info. here on engine oil ; on Honda's

    The new 2016 civic's and CR-V's use 0w-20 ; as standard engine oil.

    Just saying
     
  22. exchemist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,546
    Just spotted this. Be careful: there are two distinct things.

    The oil used in final drive (rear axles), where there is commonly a hypoid gear, needs an EP gear oil. This is not, repeat not, the same thing as automatic transmission fluid (ATF). ATFs are thin oils with friction modifiers, suitable for the torque converters and epicyclic gearboxes found in automatic transmissions.

    A real EP gear il is a high viscosity oil with sulphur-phosphorus EP chemistry, designed to lubricate the very challenging regime of combined rolling and sliding surfaces that you find in a hypoid gear set. Hypoid gears are found in the final drive, where the rear axle takes the drive from the prop shaft and turns it through 90 degrees.

    Manual gearboxes are simpler than automatic ones to lubricate, as they do not have oil-immersed brake bands and clutches. Engine oil can sometimes be used in these.
     
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  23. river

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    17,307
    Is this true as well for Marine gear oil ; which for the most part is hypoy 90.

    just asking
     

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