Carvaka school of atheism...

Discussion in 'Eastern Philosophy' started by VitalOne, May 2, 2007.

  1. VitalOne Banned Banned

    The carvaka school of atheism and materialism is existed around at least 600 BCE....

    It teaches that there is no God, no afterlife, no karma, no heaven or hell, no soul, etc....and that reality has an independent existence...

    One of the famous carvaka sayings is:
    "While life is yours, live joyously;
    None can escape Death's searching eye:
    When once this frame of ours they burn,
    How shall it e'er again return?"

    According to the carvaka philosophy, there is no mind or soul independent of the body, the body is all, after the death of the body there is nothing else since the body is all...

    The carvaka philosophy also says that things like rituals, sacrifices, prayers, etc...are only done by people with no sense.

    "There is no heaven, no final liberation,
    nor any soul in another world,
    Nor do the actions of the four castes,
    orders, or priesthoods produce any real effect"

    The carvaka school also teaches that there is no evidence for such things, and that testimony is not real evidence....

    So how does this ancient atheistic doctrine compare with modern atheism? Why does modern atheism resemble this carvaka philosophy so much?

    According to the Indian this Kali Yuga men's intelligence will be diverted to atheism, and atheism will be very strong
    Last edited: May 2, 2007
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  3. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

    Wow, that's fascinating. It sounds like Epicurianism, since atheism doesn't lay out any goals or tenets about enjoying yourself.
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  5. lightgigantic Banned Banned

    There is also another famous saying from Carvaka Muni

    ṛṇaḿ kṛtvā ghṛtaḿ pibet yāvaj jīvet sukhaḿ jīvet

    bhasmī-bhūtasya dehasya kutaḥ punar āgamano bhavet

    Even if one has to go into debt, as long as one lives, he should live happily by eating as much ghee as possible. Since the material body simply becomes ashes at death, how will it ever come to life again?

    The difference between modern atheism and ancient atheism is that in ancient times the volume of kali yuga was not so increased, so they had a better standard of material happiness. Rather than eating ghee under all circumstances, now its more an issue of uncontrolled sex desire moving into the limelight
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  7. VitalOne Banned Banned

    Yes, it appears as if eventually most people will become atheists....but this part of the Kali Yuga is the only good period within it, because of the bhakti influence, according to the Brahma Vaivarta Purana. This good period began around 1898, the sametime that all the technological innovations and things sprang up, and will end around 11898. After that things will be a lot worse...
  8. lightgigantic Banned Banned

    yes, thats the general course of events ... interesting dialouge between maharaj yuddisthira and markendaya rsi in the Mahabharata (Markendaya rsi got a benediction to live through many universal devastations) - as the potential next emporerer Maharaj yuddhistira was feeling some discontentment about the upcoming kali yuga (they were at the tail end of dwarpa yuga). Before beginning on a string of social anomolies, Markendaya rsi says "every kali yuga its the same thing ...."
  9. EmptyForceOfChi Banned Banned

  10. Light Travelling It's a girl O lord in a flatbed Ford Registered Senior Member

    Are you saying then that there is more bhakti in the world since 1898 (or there abouts) than before 1898?

    I find that hard to believe. Has there not been a decline in theistic religion since then, or am I missing something?
  11. VitalOne Banned Banned

    I don't know if there is more bhakti, that is not what the prophecy says, the prophecy says that because of the bhakti influence (of the past) this time from 1898 to 11898 will be a good period....this bhakti influence is most likely from the past....then after that civilization will be no where again...just like before 1898.....
  12. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

    600 BCE...

    Around 600 BCE there was an awakening of man during which mankind started to collectively accept the notion of self determination, and reject the idea of being puppets to the "Gods" of nature.
    Zarathustra (627-585 BCE) promulgated the Dualism of Good and Evil,
    Lao-Tzu (604-531 BCE) wrote the Tao de Ching,
    Confucius (580?-479 BCE) “flaunted his agnosticism”,
    Buddha (565-483 BCE) taught a “godless wisdom”,
    Xenophanes (550 BCE) criticized Greek polytheism,
    Pythagoras (550 BCE) taught sacred geometry and mathematically based science,
    Isaiah (550 BCE) taught “the first true monotheism in history”,
    Theagenes (525 BCE) “rationalized Homer”, and
    Hecataeus (500 BCE) “mocked the Greek myths”.

    The Encyclopaedia Britannica says, “The prophets were first and foremost teachers of religion, not of ethics. Their supreme concern was the will of God, rather than the rule of righteousness.” However, in the 6th century, B.C.E. Jeremiah and Ezekiel began to emphasize “individual responsibility and sought to restore to the people a sense of personal relationship with God, which they had lost under the impact of pagan influence.” “This was a time of general national disintegration, when religious and social organizations were rapidly breaking up.”

    It only progresses from there...
    Thucydides (400), Trial of Socrates (399), Plato’s Academy (387), Aristotle (335), Indian Artha-sastra (politically rationalistic), Zhuangzi (mystical idealism), Shang Yang (legalism), Euclid (geometry)...

    In Chinese History, 1000 B.C.E. marks the beginning of the Zhou Dynasty, which emphasized very strongly the Emperor’s “mandate of heaven” and “obedience to Gods”. But beginning in 772 B.C.E. in Southern China (and extending until 481 B.C.E.), the so-called “Springs and Autumns Period” began. This consisted of eight lesser periods, when life and limb were cheap, barbaric, and toward the end, “philosophy became more important than war.” This is when Lao Tzu and Confucius had arrived on the scene.

    The list goes on and on.

    Now I can add this to the list...

    At around 600 BCE mankind had an awakening - people started to preach personal repsonsibility and and start taking an active role in determining their own fate.

    What do you think brought this awakening about (if you agree that there was one)?
  13. VitalOne Banned Banned

    Maya Calendar - February 28, 747 BCE

    (World 5 - August 11, 3114 BCE - November 13, 2719 BCE - February 16, 2324 BCE - May 21, 1930 BCE - August 23, 1536 BCE - November 26, 1142 BCE - February 28, 747 BCE - June 3, 353 BCE - September 5, 41 CE - December 9, 435 CE - March 13, 830 CE - June 15, 1224 CE - September 18, 1618 CE - December 21, 2012 CE)
  14. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

    So you are saying it had something to do with the Maya ages?
    I don't know.
    What other significant explosive awakenings coincided with the beginning/ends of ages?
  15. VitalOne Banned Banned

    Well, there is the great flood, which archaeologists date back to 30,000 BCE....trace back to World 0 of the Maya Calendar (World 0 - October 19, 28740 BCE ), There is also the Great Pyramids (World 3 - September 11, 10604 BCE)

    I don't really know if it has much significance though...things just happen
  16. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

  17. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

    I once read that humans starting using fire at about the same time, all over the world.
    This was a time, obviously, that there was no mass communication and a small population.
    Different tribes around the world did not discuss with each other.
    Last edited: May 18, 2007
  18. EmptyForceOfChi Banned Banned

    they had mobile phones, old ones though they didnt even have bluetooth.


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