I guess I should have been clearer in my original post. I wasn't talking about their country. I was talking about where I live. (and I got off track I think) A lot of Westerners judge these women for wearing them. Kinda like "you're free now, why wear it. You're so backward. You're husband must beat you" etc. And for that woman being stoned, we execute women here too. For all you know, she killed her children.
Or she could have been stoned for something as simple as adultery or "unwillingless to submit to her husband". Very civilized. ~String
Ok, now, bring your ass to the U.S. or any E.U. country wearing a ski mask (not a burqa) and see what happens.
yep, anyways, when people here revile the burka, do you think they forget Biblical scripture that suggests covering the head, being modest, and submitting to your husband? We have a large ME population here in MI and there is backlash against them. I hate seeing the guy at the mini-mart who came here wearing a turban and now wears a baseball cap after his store got vandalized.
I was trying to prove a point. Bank robbers typically wear ski masks. You won't attract much attention at a bank here with an abaya because they are common place where Muslim women are concerned. Ski masks aren't and would raise suspicion. I'm sure if bank robberies started getting carried out by people wearing burqas/abayas, then there might be some legislation steps taken to prevent it. I'm personally not aware of any laws against covering your face, but you would attract more attention than you ever wanted if you ever walked into a bank wearing a ski mask; as mentioned, same would go for abayas if they ever started being used in bank robberies.
Sure but there is a general assumption that women in the ME are unhappy; far from it. I have seen more depressed and highly strung women in the West. http://www.aqoul.com/archives/2005/09/arab_women_assu.php http://www.cmu.edu/cmnews/extra/050218_qatar.html
Because women in the Middle East "know what's good fer 'em", I suppose. I don't have a specific problem with someone wearing a burkha or abaya or chador or whichever; then again, it is a symbol of oppression in many places in the Middle East and elsewhere, and it looks like it's heading back that way, so I'm not opposed to banning it in functional usage - driver's photos (obviously), security reasons, etc. Various solid functional rationales to ban it in places, I think. Sam, what's your specific objection to a wholesale ban on the burka (or burqa or burkha)?
Dhimmis? It doesn't affect social functioning in the places where it is used; any objection to it, as far as I can see is latent expression of bigotry disguised as concern.
So you defend your warped point of view by positing the fact that women in the west are unhappy, and therefore FORCING (note SAM-- the word "force" as in, the "force of law") women to wear burkas is a good thing? Are you serious? It's a well established fact that when people are given freedom and choice, there will always be a large number of people who are miserable (as a percentage of the population). Misery, it would seem, is a zero-sum comodity, and when the entire populous isn't made somewhat miserable, then that misery just seems to fall upon a specific percentage of the population (all, whimsical conjecture, of course). At any rate, I guess we should all just become Muslim nations and force women under our heels in order to make them happy, S.A.M. ~String
Hmm. I thought you opined though that if people didn't like the laws where they were that they should move elsewhere. You applied it to original residents, too. Changing opinions now?
And people who pretend to be secular should conceal their bigotry better.Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
People are forced to do many things by law which they condone by continuance of the society. Laws are subject to change, however, they should be changed if the society itself thinks it necessary, not because Americans assume that, given a choice, everyone would obviously pursue an American lifestyle. And I see from your statements that you believe that as well.
Nah nah nah: you said that people who didn't like the local rules, however nasty - and I'm talking the execution of apostates and so forth - should just move. That was your point, not mine. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! OK, then. What if the rules say that you can't wear a burkha? Even on reasons of security? Suddenly, now, it's a humanitarian crisis. So which is your position, then? Move? Accept? No burkha? Die for apostacy? Eh? But you go and hide behind the accusation of bigotry if that's what you've got left. Some people would just come out and say "I was wrong". I know it's hard, but there it is, and you'd be a better person for doing so. Your choice. That being said, your accusation is wrong. I don't think that the burkha should be banned except in very specific circumstances - banks, id checks, and the like, for obvious reasons. However, I must agree with you that the bigoted should better conceal their bigotry. It avoids direct embarassment, say, when the hypocrisy they thought they'd left behind them accidentally floats to the surface. Not so?
Frankly, if there is a law passed against the burkas, even the whiff of one, I GUARANTEE it will become the most popular garment in all Muslim women. I may even take it up myself.Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! I have a distinct distaste for being told what I may or may not do; brings out the goat in me.
