Atmospheric Pressures and Gravity

RiffRaff:

Are you still ignoring my posts? Why have you not replied to me, including to the many direct questions I have asked you?

To ignore certain posts, as you do, while also claiming that nobody has tried to have a conversation with you, strikes me as dishonest. Is this the best you can do?

Why did you make so many errors, then, if you know all that maths stuff?

Were your mistakes just accidental? Mere sloppiness and lack of attention on your part?

Will you be more careful in future?

We're helping you by pointing out simple mistakes, so that you can avoid repeating them in future posts and in discussions you might have with other people in the future.

You still haven't thanked me anybody here for helping you. That seems churlish, impolite and ungrateful of you, at a minimum, and verging on dishonest at the worst.

I wanted to explore that with you.

I asked you a number of specific, direct, questions about that formula. I even helpfully tried to clarify it a little. But you didn't want to discuss it with me. You ignored my questions and my post on that.

And now, here you are, complaining that nobody wants to talk to you about your formula.

It's not very honest of you, RiffRaff.

Is this the best you can do?

Who asked you for a textbook answer? Please don't tell lies, RiffRaff.

How did you find it, then? I asked before, but you weren't interested in discussing it.

Do you want to discuss it with me now?

Why are you still here, if this is such a waste of your valuable time?

Several people here - myself included - have demonstrated that you made a number of errors.

In fact, you yourself previously admitted that you made at least one mistake.

So, please don't tell lies, RiffRaff. Try to be a better man.

Who said that? Please don't tell lies, RiffRaff.

Hardly. You're the one who doesn't want to have a discussion. It seems to me that you just want to complain about being persecuted by various people. You're looking hard for excuses to play the victim.

Remember, you came to us. We didn't come to you. If you didn't want a conversation, why did you choose to sign up to a discussion forum?

I'm sure it does. TI calculators usually work just fine, in the right hands.

Did you forget the part where I walked you through what inverse square law means, giving the example of $g=GM/r^2$?

Tell me, RiffRaff: how did I fail to show you that I can apply the inverse square law?

Are you making the excuse that English isn't your first language, now?

But aren't you an American?

You still haven't acknowledged that $8^0=1$. Just post that you agree that it does, and I'll happily move on.

Why have you not addressed this simple matter? Why do you keep ignoring it?

Are you going to contact TI to tell them that their calculator is wrong, because it says $8^0=1$, rather than $8^0=0$ (as you claim)?

If you do, and they respond, can you please post their response here? That will be good for a laugh.

No. I wasn't aware of that. What are the scientists' current working hypotheses?

What does $8^0=1$ mean, RiffRaff? Can you tell me what it means?

I thought you said you wanted to leave the US. (?)

 

You're aware of what we say, but do you agree that it is correct?

Please tell us, because you're not being very clear.

How do you know? You haven't asked any of us about the work we can do.

Now now, RiffRaff. You really shouldn't tell lies. When you do that enough times, people start to get a bit annoyed with you. You also lose credibility when you tell lies that are very easily exposed. Do it enough and people start to think that, maybe, you're generally a dishonest person.

So, I'm going to ask you, just once: did I, or did I not, give you any reasons why $8^0=1$?

I'd like you to acknowledge that I gave you some reasons. Can you bring yourself to do that, even if you can't bring yourself to thank me for trying to help you?

Please don't ignore this request of mine, RiffRaff. If you do, I might have to conclude that you're knowingly telling lies, rather than making innocent, silly mistakes.

Yes. Ideally, discussion about science and mathematics happens in a cordial conversation, in which the participants all acknowledge what each participant and has to say, even when they disagree. Also, participants who make mistakes typically admit their mistakes when they are made clear to them, and they try not to repeat the same mistakes more than once. The best discussions occur when all participants are honest and open to revising their ideas in the light of better arguments and/or evidence.

Look, RiffRaff. You made some silly, basic errors. If you're man enough to admit that you made them, we'll all be very happy to move on to more substantive discussions. But when you ignore things and tell lies, that puts up barriers to further fruitful discussions.

Do you understand?

Nobody here has questioned the value of $G$ or the mass of the Sun, RiffRaff. We've got this, I assure you. There's no need for you to worry.

Maybe. Or maybe you're wrong and some of us are very familiar with math or science? How will you tell the difference, RiffRaff?

Yourself included, apparently.

Why are you integrating? What is the quantity y in that expression?

That's an interesting point. Does the ellipticity of the actual orbits result in variations in air pressure over the course of the planetary year? How does this factor into your formula?

Which particular variations have you taken into account?

Well, you don't have to worry about that here. We're all good at math here.

 

RiffRaff:

You ignored a lot of what I wrote to you, including direct questions about your "work", again. Why?

That suggests that your formula doesn't work for Venus, where you would have $x=1$.

In other words, so far, your formula only works for Earth and Mars. And since the number 10.33 is, as far as I can tell, a free parameter, it's not hard to finagle the formula to give the "correct" answer for any 2 data points.

Have you decided whether you believe that $8^0=1$ yet, or not?

Okay. Let's assume you're correct, for the sake of argument, so that adding lots more CO2 to the atmosphere is great for ozone layer recovery.

Are you suggesting this is what should be done then? Increase fossil fuel burning, to put more CO2 into the atmosphere?

 

No. You did.

That is correct as a mathematical statement, of course, but you forgot where you started, denying that $8^0=1$.

Do you remember how you defined x in the first place?

You said that $x=(d/d_V)^2$, where $d$ is the distance of the planet from the Sun and $d_V$ is the distance of Venus from the Sun. So, for Earth, you said $d/d_V=1.38$ and then $x=1.90$. Then, you plug that value of x into your formula as the exponent and get $y=0.914$, which is supposed to be something to do with the atmospheric pressure of Earth. (It's sort of close to 1 bar, which is approximately the right answer for Earth.)

But your formula does not work for Venus, because in that case $d=d_V$ and therefore $x=1$. Plugging that into your formula gives $f(x)=93/(1+10.33)^1=8.2$, which implied that the pressure on Venus is 8.2 bar, rather than the 93 bar you need it to be.

Really, with so many errors in your maths, don't you think it's time for you to give up trying to do maths - or to learn how to do it properly, RiffRaff?

At the very least, you should stop being so arrogant about your supposed prowess in maths, because - let's face it - you're just not very good at it, yet.

That's what you just agreed is the case. Right? You didn't know before, but now you know. But now that you know, you have a different problem.

Thanks for helpful tip. I would never have understood what you mean without it.

Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

This isn't one of those. Here, we speak English.

Oh, come now, RiffRaff. Don't be tiresome. You lost that battle days ago.

 

Moderator note: RiffRaff has been warned for knowingly telling lies and for insulting another member of sciforums.

 

RiffRaff:

I have at no time promoted fascism, openly or otherwise. I find your accusation to be insulting. It is an inappropriate personal attack on me that is entirely unjustified.

I don't appreciate it when you tell lies about me. You should stop that. You should apologise to me for your appallingly rude conduct towards me.

I get it that you're upset that you made some mathmatical errors. You don't want to admit to them. Instead, you want to attack the people who pointed them out to you and who tried to help you to understand why you were wrong. That's disappointing but, sadly, not an unusual reaction from people who have trouble admitting their own mistakes. However, your anger at having your errors pointed out does not give you any special right to make personal attacks or to tell lies. If you cannot understand this, you will be leaving us, one way or another.

Are we clear?