Are statistics of the religiosity of prison inmates reliable?

Are statistics of the religiosity of prison inmates reliable?

if yes, why?
If not, why not?

 

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The inmates can give their religious preferences if they want to. No one is forced into telling the authorities anything if they care not to. That being known then reliable statistics aren't possible about all inmates beliefs only those who disclose.

 

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Which statistics?

Statistics are more a measure of trends and possibilities, not absolutes. Sure, some inmates are probably converting if it'll benefit a possible parole. Others may convert because they need to turn to something to help them through their problems.

So I guess like all the other recent threads, you're asking if they are all honest. Probably not all, but how would you best determine the error of measurement?

 

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No for very practical reasons. Atheists will lie about their religious beliefs in prison because if they don't they will be cut off from access to all the resources available to theists. Hence no time out from cells to visit church, no prison chaplain to recommend library or laundry duty or offer phone calls to family members at Christmas, no parole recommendation from the prison chaplain to support release, etc. Are atheists stupid that they would cling to lack of belief rather than knock time out from their sentences?

I've already debated this before:

http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2268524&postcount=262

http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2269037&postcount=266

Or you can follow the argument from post 262 onwards in the thread:

Are people inherently evil?

 

Prison inmates are known to be highly religious, and not for the cynical reasons others claim. I think the doctrines of forgiveness for sin appeal to them.

 

Most criminals of the kind who get jailed are pretty strongly theistic, in my experience. If you exclude the drug crimes (possession and the like), and the sociopaths, they pretty much all are, as far as I've met. They were raised so, and independence of one's upbringing in such matters usually entails serious education.

That doesn't make them religious. It makes them superstitious, and poorly educated. They're conservative, by nature.

The sociopaths are often religious, for the manipulation opportunities outside of prison as well as in (if you want to find a sociopath, the first two places to look are the church and the jailhouse) but not theistic in any honest or ordinary sense - in my opinion.

 

that's part of it too but some really do believe in the religion.

the manipulation part comes in due to the way they believe god is vs others. they may think others are deluded about god and they know what it's really about. for instance, they can just cite all the cruelty and amorality in the bible or quran or whatever to identify themselves in it as well as see god as justifying it as well.

for instance, God, the sole figurehead of an absolute authority (this is what they want to be) who doles out to others with authority to act, the sexism, the power-mongering, the wealth accumulated from pillaging or destroying others, the raping of women or subjugation, forgiveness of any and every sin etc., are all very appealing to a sociopath.

basically it's just a person who sees the religion as condoning the amorality of nature. they can do what they can get away with and 'god' created the system that way obviously is how they see it. they would be this way with or without the religion but you're right, the religion gives them a false or respectable cover to some extent which is a bonus as well as legitimizes to some extent what they do.

 

I don't doubt some inmates "Find God" in prison, but I'd like to know how many maintain their faith once they leave prison? There was a thread on Buddhism in Lifers - that was probably genuine.

 

I agree with you there. They aren't necessarily devout, they just assume these things to be true as one would assume someone could do witchcraft to you. I have found blacks to be especially religious. It's also like a tribal thing, you want to be on the side of the most powerful thing.

 

I'm not asking whether they are honest.

My concern is that statistics on religiosity are being used to come to conclusions about a number of things (there are several "religion becomes extinct threads to highlight this), and then action is being taken on the basis of these statistics - but it is not clear to begin with how reliable these statistics are.

 

reminds me of a joke

An atheist was walking through the woods one day in Alaska, admiring all that evolution had created. "What majestic trees! What a powerful river! What beautiful animals!" he said to himself. As he was walking alongside the river, he heard a rustling in the bushes behind him. Turning to look, he saw a 13-foot Kodiak brown bear beginning to charge towards him. He ran as fast as he could down the path. He looked over his shoulder and saw that the bear was rapidly closing on him. Somehow, he ran even faster, so scared that tears came to his eyes. He looked again and the bear was even closer. His heart pounding in his chest, he tried to run faster yet, but alas, he tripped and fell to the ground. As he rolled over to pick himself up, the bear was right over him, reaching for him with its left paw and raising its right paw to strike him.

"OH MY GOD! ..."

Time stopped.

The bear froze.

The forest was silent.

Even the river stopped moving ...

As a brilliant light shone upon the man, a thunderous voice came from all around...

"YOU DENY MY EXISTENCE FOR ALL THESE YEARS, TEACH OTHERS THAT I DON'T EXIST AND EVEN CREDIT CREATION TO SOME COSMIC ACCIDENT. DO YOU EXPECT ME TO HELP YOU OUT OF THIS PREDICAMENT? AM I TO COUNT YOU AS A BELIEVER?"

Difficult as it was, the atheist looked directly into the light and said, "It would be hypocritical to ask to be a Christian after all these years, but perhaps you could make the bear a Christian?"

"VERY WELL." said God.

The light went out.

The river ran.

The sounds of the forest resumed.

... and the bear dropped down on his knees, brought both paws together, bowed his head and spoke: "Lord, thank you for this food which I am about to receive."

 

lol Great joke LG

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Probably not very, especially if they are a more black and white type question, like you see so much these days on the internet. You'd get the same unreliability if you asked a population if they were happy or sad, and then did an in depth analysis on how depressed they were.

How'd he know it was the christian god?

 

I think this is missing the point entirely. First, are the proportions of religious to non-religious in prison different from the proportions in the general population. And two, if you don't accept these numbers, then why accept any numbers? IOW, why would this survey be anymore flawed than any other survey?

 

I dont think reliability comes into it as much as inconsequential. People get more religious when they are down and out...well mainly if they have even the slightest shred of remorse. Just human nature.

 

Its like...when your doing good everyone wants to be your friend and when your doin bad peeps dont want ta know ya.

 

I suppose the Bible does not forbid eating humans?

 

LOL!!!

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jan.