Animal Pain and humane treatment

Discussion in 'Biology & Genetics' started by Captain Kremmen, Mar 1, 2010.

  1. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Pretty hard consider how the lobster head is non-existent and it frontal extremities (eyes mouth, ect) are just extensions of it thorax.
     
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  3. visceral_instinct Monkey see, monkey denigrate Valued Senior Member

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    So you can't just sever it beneath where the brain is located??
     
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  5. stateofmind seeker of lies Valued Senior Member

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    lol
     
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  7. stateofmind seeker of lies Valued Senior Member

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    I knew I shouldn't have trusted that girl on yahoo answers!

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  8. Orleander OH JOY!!!! Valued Senior Member

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    and how many people are taught where it is? How many might just slice off the face, leaving the brain? Or only cut the brain in half?
     
  9. Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

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    the only legal way to kill a cray in Australia is to lay it flat on a chopping board with its head towards you, place a knife point down just between its eyes and drive it through the brain and imidiately cut the head in half. It is a criminal offense (animal crulty) to kill by boiling.
     
  10. Orleander OH JOY!!!! Valued Senior Member

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    no its not. LMAO
     
  11. Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

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    and you would know how? Were you an Australian chef in a Seafood restraunt when the changes to the laws were brought in? No you wernt, I was
     
  12. Orleander OH JOY!!!! Valued Senior Member

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    No, they tried to make it law and it never passed. Its a rule your employer enforced, not the legal system. Its not a law
     
  13. John99 Banned Banned

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    orleander, the best way for live crabs and fish is to put the into a freezer. its like going to sleep for them.
     
  14. Orleander OH JOY!!!! Valued Senior Member

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    I agree.
     
  15. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Not to mention its lower "brains" which control the legs and tail might feel "pain" as well, but then again those might best be called reflexes. Lobster learning and "thoughts" would most likely be limited to its main brain (Super-Ganglion) just behind the eyes. Maybe it might be possible to jab a red hot poker behind its eye and fry its main brain, but that won't prevent uncontrolled movement of it lower exterminates, which might crawl around just like a chicken does when you chop of its head, both these animals have significant motor control functions in the spinal column/lower brains, though more so for the lobster.

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  16. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Dam good idea, being cold blooded they just might shut down without feeling pain as we would when we freeze to death, though its often claimed we don't feel pain as their mind goes in the latter stages of hypothermia sort of like the matchgirl. I would guess the lobster would hallucinate of happier times under the see
     
  17. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    So you'll just torture them until biologists finally discover that they do feel pain, and then you'll spend the rest of your life in a Tibetan monastery doing penance?

    "Mostly" doesn't really say much.

    You are evil. There's no good reason to cause pain to any creature if it can be reasonably avoided. I campaigned for the initiative that began what is hopefully a trend to relax factory farming methods in California. I'd rather pay a little more for my meat and have a slightly clearer conscience. If some far superior species one day finds that my death will benefit his culture, I'd prefer he bring it about painlessly. I don't use glue traps for mice.

    True bugs are an order (Hermaptera) of insects. They are identified by mouthparts that have been shaped into a proboscis, which they use to puncture plants and feed by sucking their sap. A few species have adapted to feeding on the blood of animals, including bedbugs and also water striders, the only truly aquatic insects.

    The word bug is used loosely in vernacular language to include all insects, and even more loosely to include arachnids (spiders, ticks, scorpions, etc.) and myriapods (centipedes, millipedes, etc.)--i.e., all land-based arthropods (animals with exoskeletons).

    The word is used even more loosely for any microorganism that causes illness, due to their resemblance to insects when viewed under a microscope. From the sense of causing damage it has been transferred to software defects, and from the sense of being tiny it has been transferred to covert listening devices.

    The one thing it has not been generalized to is crustaceans--the class of aquatic arthropods--although the Aussies apply it to a few local species of lobster.

    Birds and mammals are qualitatively different from the three other classes of vertebrates (reptiles, amphibians and fish) by being endothermic or "warm-blooded". This unique metabolism gives us the ability to generate much more energy than the exothermic or "cold-blooded" animals. In addition to having more powerful musculature (a dolphin can make gumbo out of an equivalent-sized alligator), this also gives us larger brains. NOTE TO PHYSICISTS AND CHEMISTS: Biologists use the terms "endothermic" and "exothermic" exactly opposite to your custom.

    Humans tend to intuitively classify birds with mammals: fuzzy warm-blooded animals that nurture their young. But in fact we're both more closely related to the reptiles than to each other.

    This is a common misconception. Birds have a reflex center in their spinal column that can control the wing muscles in an emergency. When a bird is startled, the wings start flying before the brain has a chance to pick a direction, giving a head start in avoiding danger. Domestic chickens can't quite fly, but their wings generate enough lift to drag them along the ground. This gives the illusion of crawling, but it's not the legs that provide the motion.

    People who keep their pet parrots indoors, but aren't vigilant about trimming their flight feathers, are routinely heartbroken on the day when the combination of a loud noise and an open window sends their bird out into an unfamiliar milieu. By the time he can get control of his wings he's two blocks from home and has no idea how to get back.

    In mammals and birds these ganglion clusters are easily relegated to the name "reflex center," compared to the size of the brain. In the lower animals the comparison is not so overwhelming.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 2, 2010
  18. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Oh god your nitpicking is horrific, I can almost hear your whining voice and its egoistical tone! I didn't mean to imply they actually "run" I have seen a chicken without its head "run" and sure enough they don't run with their legs (often they fail to move forward at all), but I'm not going to explain that in one sentence! Their spinal column provides the reflex none the less, but most likely much more limited then a lobster's ganglion column.

    or it just sits on a tree screaming. Depending on the size of the parrot you can track it down by its screams even from two blocks away: when a parrot is baffled and bewilder that all it does, its sit screaming for the people it knows to come find it, of course wild parrots are a different story but parrots born in captivity are completely baffled and confused by the outdoors. True getting it back its not very easy (specially when it up in a fucking tree) but its often easier then a cat or dog, who only comes back to you if they want to... wait a minute what the fuck does your quote have to do about anything on this thread??? Its like a supposed expert fact shit out of nowhere, their I returned one from personal experience, I now know why my parrot owns me: to shit out stupid "facts" based on personal experience, from my friends at MAARS and parrot guide books, to one up nitpicking uber-nerds.

    Jesus Christ, no shit captain obvious!
     
  19. Captain Kremmen All aboard, me Hearties! Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, how do you know that they don't feel more pain ?
    Why aren't you on your own lobster thread, anyway?
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2010
  20. Spud Emperor solanaceous common tater Registered Senior Member

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    Congratulations, worst case of being fooled by spellchecker's synonym recognition for the year...brilliant!

    Oh, here's an idea.. how about chilling the lobster in the fridge..yatte,yatte..
    Oh shit, Spud mentioned that about three thousand posts ago. Derrr!

    Tangentially, a couple of months ago, the Spud Empress was half asleep and complained of having something meaty crawl across her belly. Naturally I resisted any lewd remarks and presumed she was dreaming.
    It happened again and being an empathetic sort of chap, I brushed it off again ( metaphorically, that is).
    Later I felt something moving on myself and slapped it away, we have some pretty big spiders about and that would not be completely unusual.
    Later still I felt something very crawly under my back.
    I woke the Spud Empress and asked her to turn on the lamp and look at what was under my back when I sat up. Sure enough a massive centipede was to be found and I caught the fucker in a glass then took it to the kitchen and boiled the kettle, poured a jar of steaming water and introduced the centipede to it's demise. It did turn a lovely shade of pink and I have to admit for several moments I seriously considered eating it. It looked just like a tasty morsel from the ocean and the retribution would have been sweet.
     
  21. Enmos Staff Member

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    Thanks Fraggle!

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    However, you made a tiny mistake there. True bugs are of the order of Hemipetera. Perhaps you accidentally mixed up Hemiptera and Dermaptera (Earwigs)

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    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 2, 2010
  22. Enmos Staff Member

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    How big are we talking?
    Like this?

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    Why didn't you just pick it up and put it outside?
     
  23. Spud Emperor solanaceous common tater Registered Senior Member

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    Just while we're on the subject (which includes arachnids) and on the subject of me being subject to the misery of bugs in general. In climbing a wattle tree on the weekend to cut off an unwanted branch, I managed to collect 15 (yep, fifteen, I counted 'em) paralysis ticks around my waist and buttocks, and yes one of the little{foul Aussie expletive deleted} was burrowing its way into my scrotum.
    It's a harsh life but rarely boring.
     

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